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[glynor]

1. NEW: Theater View "Views" menu is fully configurable in Options > Theater View > Audio, Image, etc. > Configure.
2. Changed: Theater View "Views" menu is not related to main database view schemes.

I decided that since I am ranting on about this a bit, and since it might evolve into a multi-build discussion anyway, it is best to just split it off into a separate topic right from the get-go.

I think when I click Audio in Theater View

Just remember that some of us hardly ever do click (or choose with a remote) Audio in Theater View.  I use Theater View almost entirely for Video playback, and I'm not alone.  I'd certainly love to see improvements, and if this is the start of that road, then I'll shut up and try to be happy in the interim.

That said... On a conceptual level I don't understand why the instinct seems to be to segregate Theater View's navigation off into its own sandbox.  It is exactly the opposite of how I look at it, and it makes my brain hurt.  Why would you want to have to learn how to use something twice?  If you know how your media is organized (and where to look and what data "tree" to expect) in Standard View, why would you ever want to have to learn a whole new way to look at it and think about it for Theater View?  If I wanted this, wouldn't I just want a completely separate application to handle the 10-foot UI?

The way I look at it is that I want Theater View to be identical to Standard View, but with a simpler UI that has different control widgets and font sizes that works from the couch.  Period.  A "10-foot window" on MC.  As near as I can tell... The current goal seems to be to avoid ever having another "tier" below Audio, Video, or Images in the Theater View "tree".  So that when you click on Audio, it should take you directly to your "Panes".

This is a terrible idea as far as I am concerned, and it'll be very difficult to get it to work for me.  Now, if I used Theater View primarily for Audio, I suppose it could work.  Give me a [Genre]/[Artist]/[Album] view scheme under Audio in Theater View and I'd be fairly happy with it for most things.  But I don't use Theater View for Audio.  I use it for Video.  Like an organized TiVO.  And it works very, very well.

The "direct to panes" motif doesn't work because I do not browse my TV Shows with the same "Panes" as I browse my Movies.  I don't browse my Home Videos with the same "Panes" as I use for TV Shows, and sometimes I don't browse my Home Movies in the same way every time... but they're all "Video".  Going into some menu and reconfiguring the view each time I decide "no, I can't really find a movie I feel like watching, maybe I'll watch an episode of The Wire instead" is absurd, even if it is easy to do.  In Standard View (and Theater View currently) I have pre-defined views, in a nice tree.

When I click Video in the tree, I get a choice of:  TV Shows, Movies, Home Videos, and a few other types...

Then when I choose Movies, it shows [Genre] and does NOT show any non-Movie video files.  Likewise, when I choose TV Shows, it shows [Series], and when I choose Home Videos it shows a calendar-like view starting with [Year].  But maybe sometimes I want to browse home movies by [Keyword] or by [Album]), so I have View Schemes for browsing like that too.  And so on and so forth for my other video types.

So... I've said my piece.  And so you know, I'm really not upset or anything.  I just don't really understand the motivation.  And, again, perhaps you've thought of all this and you have some really slick solution.  Certainly wouldn't be the first time you surprised me!

[Matt]

Then when I choose Movies, it shows [Genre] and does NOT show any non-Movie video files.  Likewise, when I choose TV Shows, it shows [Series], and when I choose Home Videos it shows a calendar-like view starting with [Year].  But maybe sometimes I want to browse home movies by [Keyword] or by [Album]), so I have View Schemes for browsing like that too.  And so on and so forth for my other video types.

You can still make Movies and TV Shows views.  You will switch between them using the Views button.  It's the same, just different.

[glynor]

You can still make Movies and TV Shows views.  You will swich between them using Views button.  It's the same, just different.

I'll try it before I comment further.

[glynor]

You can still make Movies and TV Shows views.  You will swich between them using Views button.  It's the same, just different.

Played with it a bit.  Defined my TV Shows and Movies views.  They do work.  However, this is clearly not intuitive and easy for my Wife and Mom to use without instruction.

EDIT (for clarity): As it is now with this build, when they start up MC from the desktop and pick Video from home in Theater View, they get a random assortment of video panes (whichever view happened to be used last).  There is no visual indicator that they may or may not be seeing all of the available Video files on the system.  There is no cue for them to click on the Views button in order to change this.  There is no simple way to "go back" and start over with the list of possible choices.  And, what they get will change depending on what was last used (and that might have been done by someone else two or three days earlier).

So, for example, I just started up Theater View, hit Video, and was presented with a list of TV Show Series titles.  If I were my mom, I'd probably just assume that is all that's available, and I'd say "I thought you said you had a bunch of movies on here?"

In MC12, I pick Video and get:

Code: [Select]

TV Shows -->
     Series --->
          Season ---> Files
Movies --->
     Genre --->
          Artist --->
               Corporation ---> Files
Home Videos (Calendar) --->
     [Year formatted] --->
          [Month] --->
               [Day] ---> Files
Home Videos (Keywords) --->
     [Keywords] --->
           [People] --->
                [Places] --->
                      [Events] --->
Home Videos (Albums) --->
     [Albums] --->
          Same as Calendar --> Files
Music Videos --->
     [Genre] --->
          [Artist] ---> Files
Podcasts --->
     [Album] ---> Files
Adult --->
     [Genre] ---> Files
Imports --->
     (Calendar-like View based on Import Date) ---> Files

And, I'll probably eventually have a "Kids" view as well (and, I imagine, remove the Adult one).

Either way, this is easy to use.  I've actually given Theater View and the remote to my Mom (who had never touched MC or iTunes or anything similar before in her life) and told her where the arrow keys and enter key was, and she could easily figure it out and pick a movie to watch.

If I gave it to her now, she'd never find anything.  I'd have to explain to go to the Views button, which she'd forget an hour later, and then she'd complain: "What good is that?  Why can't I just pick TV Shows or Movies right away?  Where the heck am I in this thing?"

It just isn't as good, it is confusing to novices.  And the list is FAR too long to put under the Views menu button as is.  I like how I have the WHOLE window to choose my media "sub" types (even though I had to create my own custom field for it since I can't modify the built-in one).

EDIT: This also doesn't address the fact that I have to "reinvent the wheel" manually to get all these views (which I already HAVE in Standard View) working again in Theater View.  Extremely annoying.  And, even once I go through the pain of doing this all once, when I decide two months from now to "adjust" one of my View Schemes slightly, I'll have to remember to go and do the same thing again in the special Theater View configuration dialog.  I'll, of course, forget to do this, so they won't match and I'll be all confused as to how things are organized.

And if I have to do all that, and I still can't get it quite the way I want it... I might as well switch to SageTV or one of the other HTPC front-ends.

[raym]

I don't think I can add too much more to what Glynor said. I share his concerns with all of this.

What I'm really wondering is why? I mean, havn't we been down this road before? I thought it all worked really well the way it was. Good for beginners and advanced users alike. Of all the improvements that could be made to Theater View, this is one area I would have left alone. I just think you guys had it right in the first place.

What benefit is separating - and in most cases - duplicating view schemes supposed to give? I now need to manage my view schemes in two places!?!

The change just introduces too much additional naviagation to pull up my custom views and it's not clear which view I'm actually in.

I know it's early days... hopefully this is one of those changes that's not here to stay... sorry.

[glynor]

What I'm really wondering is why? I mean, havn't we been down this road before? I thought it all worked really well the way it was. Good for beginners and advanced users alike. Of all the improvements that could be made to Theater View, this is one area I would have left alone. I just think you guys had it right in the first place.

Me too.  QFT.

[park]

I'd like to see all of the the Theater view viewschemes included in the regular tree. They could be separate from the audio, images and video ones. When you click on the theater view one in the tree you would automatically go to the theater view ui too.

If, while in standard view, you right clicked on a theater view viewscheme in the tree you would be presented with a menu saying "edit viewscheme" where there would be a similar viewscheme configuration window to that of the standard viewschemes.

[raym]

One thing that could make this idea work for me (aside from the duplicate views problem) is having an always accessible "revolving view-scheme selector bar" at the top of each view. Sort of like how Vista Media Center does it (which is one thing I think it does quite well).

Something like this would allow me to see at a glance what other view schemes are available when entering a given view (Audio, Video, Images). I could arrow up to it easily, select the view scheme I want WITHOUT needing to "jump out" to the views button AND it provides a nice visual of which view I'm actually in.

Here's a mockup:
http://www.pix01.com/gallery/7E983800-3866-4113-A403-321A43239740/MC/index.html?image=7080871510.jpg

[gappie]

the posts of glynor sums up my concerns very well.

Of all the improvements that could be made to Theater View, this is one area I would have left alone. I just think you guys had it right in the first place.

indeed.

 
gab

[Matt]

Here's a mockup:
http://www.pix01.com/gallery/7E983800-3866-4113-A403-321A43239740/MC/index.html?image=7080871510.jpg

I like this.

And there have been several requests in the past to make the Views menu in Theater View fully and independently configurable.  In my opinion, the browsing paradigm is different enough from Standard View that different views make sense.

I agree that a way to copy a view scheme into the Theater View view list from Standard View would be nice.

[Doof]

How about adding a "Hide this view from Standard View" checkbox and then a menu item to "Show/hide hidden view schemes"? Then the people who don't want their Theater View view schemes cluttering up standard view can hide them, those that want them in both places can have them in both places, and you already have a checkbox that keeps standard view view schemes from cluttering up Theater View.

Then, if you really don't like the current way of showing nested view schemes, display them like in raym's mockup.

Wouldn't that make everybody happy and accomplish all goals? Or am I missing something? I have to admit that I have two PCs running MC. One only uses Standard View, and the other only uses Theater View. So this has never really been a problem for me.

[glynor]

I like this.

And there have been several requests in the past to make the Views menu in Theater View fully and independently configurable.  In my opinion, the browsing paradigm is different enough from Standard View that different views make sense.

While I was up red-eyed and cursing too much caffeine last night I was considering effectively the same solution.  I don't really like the exact implementation raym suggested because my list is longer and wouldn't fit in that horizontal listing.  However, some "view scheme switching" method could certainly work, if it wasn't stuffed under a random left-toolbar button.  I was thinking of more of a combobox-like solution (like the current dropdown panes, actually).

However, there are some basic technical navigation problems with this as well.  How would you move "up" when you have more than one screenful of data showing in the view?  Sure, you could use Page Up/Down, but we want this to work with only arrow keys and enter, right?  So then, if Up/Down still moves the file/pane item selection up and down, how do you get into this new View navigation bar area?

I want to think on it a little more... Got some ideas brewing along these lines though.

One thing I was thinking though... I would STILL want to be able to click on Video from Home and be presented with a list of configurable choices:  TV Shows, Movies, Home Videos (Calendar), Home Videos (Keywords), Imports, Podcasts, etc.  I can understand how some people would not want to be forced to jump through this hoop though, even if they may want to have a few other views that they'd use occasionally.

I'm thinking that instead of remembering which view was used last (the current system for direct-to-panes), perhaps we could get two checkboxes in the Options section of the Edit View Scheme dialog (I still think they should just be the regular view schemes, but it could also be in the Edit Theater View Views dialog):

Theater View:
Show In Theater View
Use as default view for: (combobox containing Audio, Video, or Images)

And then, if NO view scheme has that "default view" option selected, it'd show you a list.  If one does, it would just jump directly to that view (while giving you the option of changing once you're there via a method somewhat similar to what raym suggested).

Like I said though... Still percolating.

[raym]

I don't really like the exact implementation raym suggested because my list is longer and wouldn't fit in that horizontal listing.  

That's why I said "revolving". The "<" and ">" are supposed to indicate this. Pressing ">" (for example) would expose more choices to the right and visa versa for "<". Like I said, the best example of this that I can give is the way Vista Media Center does it.

I like this.

Cool! If a solution like this is adopted, the only thing I'd like to add is:

1. PLEASE make it a configurable skinning item in terms of where it can be positioned on screen, color etc
2. PLEASE allow list wrapping from this view selector. Ie, if I arrow UP from here, the cursor wraps to the bottom of the screen (as it does currently in all views).

I agree that a way to copy a view scheme into the Theater View view list from Standard View would be nice.

I'm glad you agree! 

Thanks

[glynor]

Hmmm... Hadn't caught that.  That could certainly work.  You could have it set so that if your current focus is in the file/panes area and you arrow up to the top of the current page it would "highlight" this nav.  Then an additional up keypress would scroll up thru the list (you could show a onscreen ^ symbol as a cue), but if you hit left/right instead it'd scroll thru the views list.

Yeah, I think that could work well!  And you could even have several tiers of views if you want.

I still do not like the "separate TV scheme" configuration thing tho...

[raym]

I agree that a way to copy a view scheme into the Theater View view list from Standard View would be nice.

The other drag about not having the view schemes tied to the main db is that I typically administer the MC db from my desktop running MC in standard view. I then copy these db updates to each of my HTPCs around the house thru automated scripts to keep them all in sync.

As a result of this change though, I would need to pull out a keyboard and mouse on each of my HTPCs and apply the same view scheme changes on EACH and EVERY one of them whenever I decide to make a change to a tv view scheme. I really love how I can do all MC db changes I need from one central location and easily apply it to all other machines.

What about people who use Library Server with their HTPCs? Same problem! They make a change to their view schemes on the master db and these won't show up on the clients! Not ideal...

[glynor]

Wow... Didn't even consider that!  Even if the Theater View schemes stay separate from the standard ones, they NEED to be tied to and stored in the library!  Beyond the issue raym just pointed out, I need to be able to have different Theater View "setups" on a per library basis!

[jmone]

I've also going to add my voice to the "if it ain't broke don't fix it".  I've got very simple View Scheme requirments.....I use out of the box View Schemes for Audio (Artist/Album) and Pics (Years) but my main Video View Scheme is Genre / Artist / Album sorted by Track # (to cater for Music Video tracks) then Name with Media Type of Video and Data (to include ISO playback).  So I get in my Video section I get the following View:

Code: [Select]

Home Movies
Movies
Music Videos
  - Artist
       - Album
TV Recodings
TV Series
  - Album (= TV Series Name)
I've tried to recreate this in the new Theater View but for the life of me I can not get my ISO's (datatype DATA) to show up in TheaterView....(any suggestions or is it a bug?).  The attached image shows the working StdView results and the Config for Theater View that ignores my ISO's.


Of course I can now not check what the View Scheme results looks like in Std View.  I like the old View Scheme setup where you config what you want in StdView and select those that can appear in T'View.  All I've done this morning is muck around trying to get the same results in T'View as I've got in StdView and I'm thinking "were is the benefit to this?" - I've got to set it all up twice. 

I like the old View Scheme setup where you config what you want in StdView and select those that can appear in T'View.

Thanks
Nathan

[Matt]

Theater View views are stored in the database.

Showing data files in a video view is tricky.  We'll have to think about it.

[rpalmer68]

One thing that could make this idea work for me (aside from the duplicate views problem) is having an always accessible "revolving view-scheme selector bar" at the top of each view. Sort of like how Vista Media Center does it (which is one thing I think it does quite well).

Something like this would allow me to see at a glance what other view schemes are available when entering a given view (Audio, Video, Images). I could arrow up to it easily, select the view scheme I want WITHOUT needing to "jump out" to the views button AND it provides a nice visual of which view I'm actually in.

Here's a mockup:
http://www.pix01.com/gallery/7E983800-3866-4113-A403-321A43239740/MC/index.html?image=7080871510.jpg

This could work I think...

As long as we can still have views within views somehow.

For example, for my classical music I have

-> Classical
---> By Composer/Classical Work/Artist
---> By Classical Work/Artist
---> By Artist

And I also do similar things to others for video views.

So If I was to select "Classical" from the top view selection, I'd then need to be able to select the next level view, which could be in that top row again I guess "<By Composer | By Work | By Artist>"

Richard

[Matt]

How about adding a "Hide this view from Standard View" checkbox and then a menu item to "Show/hide hidden view schemes"? Then the people who don't want their Theater View view schemes cluttering up standard view can hide them, those that want them in both places can have them in both places, and you already have a checkbox that keeps standard view view schemes from cluttering up Theater View.

I got confused just reading that.

The goal is to have a clean and simple list of views available in Theater View.

The default view schemes the player includes do not fit the bill.  For example, Quickies / Keywords / Rating is great for images in Pane view.  It's too complicated in Theater View where you only see one level at a time.  So using the list of Standard View view schemes for the Theater View views isn't too neat.

Separating the Theater View and Standard View views solves this problem.  We just need to make sure it's easy to configure both sets of views.  

Putting a "Theater View" item in the audio / images / video area of the tree was one solution, but it's clutter.  Giving an optional way to show that item just for configuration was another thought.  We don't know how to make that clear.

We're open to other ideas, but the goal stated above must be fulfilled.

[jmone]

Theater View views are stored in the database.

Showing data files in a video view is tricky.  We'll have to think about it.

Ahhh but many people store their DVD (and in my case Blu-ray / HD-DVD) in ISO's which is then launched when selecting them and until this build it was all fine.  There have been a heap of posts on how to do this in MC12 (it is even part of the WIKI http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/DVD_Library_in_Media_Center ) and with the latest addition of assignable coverart it is even easier.

Sorry but, I'm starting to think evil thoughts on the new TheaterView View Scheme setup....

[rpalmer68]

I got confused just reading that.

The goal is to have a clean and simple list of views available in Theater View.

The default view schemes the player includes do not fit the bill.  For example, Quickies / Keywords / Rating is great for images in Pane view.  It's too complicated in Theater View where you only see one level at a time.  So using the list of Standard View view schemes for the Theater View views isn't too neat.

Separating the Theater View and Standard View views solves this problem.  We just need to make sure it's easy to configure both sets of views.  

Putting a "Theater View" item in the audio / images / video area of the tree was one solution, but it's clutter.  Giving an optional way to show that item just for configuration was another thought.  We don't know how to make that clear.

We're open to other ideas, but the goal stated above must be fulfilled.

In some ways I like the theater views split away from the standard view, one thing I didn't want in my "Audio" Theater View was the genre being populated, so when people selected "Audio" they only got to see the views I had defined.. the only way I coud do this was to edit the Top level "Audio" view in standard view and remove the View items, which then made "Audio" useless in standard view which was annoying.

But than I also see the issue of having views defined in two places, which adds confusion...

Could the theater views move back under the standard views and just be color coded somehow?  So views available in Theater View are a different color to ones only available in standard view?


Richard

[raym]

Putting a "Theater View" item in the audio / images / video area of the tree was one solution, but it's clutter.  Giving an optional way to show that item just for configuration was another thought.  We don't know how to make that clear.

Adding a dedicated "Theater View" item in each of the audio/images/video trees makes the most sense to me. This is clear and self explainatory. Allow people to hide this if neccessary via the "features" option.

I do appreciate the goal of having a clean and simple list of views available in Theater View but tucking them away in the options dialog (for example) is not ideal. It's fine for options and settings pertaining only to Theater View but much of the power of Theater View lies in its customisable view schemes which in turn, is a major component of MC in general. For this reason, I think they belong in the same area as all the other view schemes and we should be able to link to existing Standard View ones if required to avoid duplication.

Theater View views are stored in the database.

Oh, that's good!

Thanks.

[jmone]

Ahhh but many people store their DVD (and in my case Blu-ray / HD-DVD) in ISO's which is then launched when selecting them and until this build it was all fine.  There have been a heap of posts on how to do this in MC12 (it is even part of the WIKI http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/DVD_Library_in_Media_Center ) and with the latest addition of assignable coverart it is even easier.

Sorry but, I'm starting to think evil thoughts on the new TheaterView View Scheme setup....

I've found a workaround (for now) of using a playlist but it is really not ideal but at least I can view and launch my ISOs.  I used to group all my videos together by Genre (Movies, Music Videos etc) regardless if they were an ISO, VOB, MPEG, AVI etc.....On a brighter note the new assign cover art is nice!

[glynor]

Adding a dedicated "Theater View" item in each of the audio/images/video trees makes the most sense to me. This is clear and self explainatory. Allow people to hide this if neccessary via the "features" option.

I agree completely.  If you need it to be separate from the main View Schemes, the best alternative is the Subsection of each of the main sections.

These subsections should also allow their own custom filters (just like any View Scheme).  That way, if you want to, you could add [Media Type]=Data and [File Type]=iso to the Video Theater View Views scheme and all of the Theater View views would work with these files.  I'd also use it to filter out files (like my "video editing stock library files") that you don't ever want to see in Theater View.

[ThoBar]

I agree completely.  If you need it to be separate from the main View Schemes, the best alternative is the Subsection of each of the main sections.

These subsections should also allow their own custom filters (just like any View Scheme).  That way, if you want to, you could add [Media Type]=Data and [File Type]=iso to the Video Theater View Views scheme and all of the Theater View views would work with these files.  I'd also use it to filter out files (like my "video editing stock library files") that you don't ever want to see in Theater View.

... and would provide a nice way to preview the results you'd get in Theater View

[edit]

... on the flipside however, I do like the fact that this centralises the Theater View management into one area. (I agree the current implementation is too restrictive however) I'm not a fan of having to configure one thing in multiple spots - and I think if the new system can be enhanced, it would be better for new users. Perhaps a system to 'pick' an existing standard view (from a list or tree) for use in Theater View

[glynor]

... on the flipside however, I do like the fact that this centralises the Theater View management into one area. (I agree the current implementation is too restrictive however) I'm not a fan of having to configure one thing in multiple spots - and I think if the new system can be enhanced, it would be better for new users. Perhaps a system to 'pick' an existing standard view (from a list or tree) for use in Theater View

Best. Idea. Yet.

Options --> Theater View --> Items To Show --> Configure should present a dialog (similar to the Handheld Sync List dialog) where you have a Tree of your entire library and can put checkmarks in any of your existing View Schemes and it'll include them.  It should allow you to include child view schemes (but let you manually de-select individual child view schemes if desired).  If you only check one scheme for Audio (or whatever) then it would just auto-open that scheme every time.  If you have more than one, or multiple tiers, then it would either use a rotating system like Park raym mocked-up above or just present a list (or maybe both).

Then, by default with new fresh library, there should be either:

a) a special "Theater View" sub-section of Audio/Video/Images top level schemes
b) a special top-level Theater View view scheme with Audio, Images, and Video child schemes

Either way, these should be pre-filled with specially constructed and useful (to the novice) special-purpose Theater View Schemes.  These would be default checked in the Options dialog mentioned above.

It is the best of all worlds!  That way, those of us who would rather just "dual purpose" use our regular old view schemes could do it and never have to duplicate work.  Those who want to keep them separate and special purpose, can do that.  Those who would prefer to hide them away from their regular Standard View schemes could do that (even if option A above was done, you could always make your own top-level Theater View master View Scheme and move all of them in there and then go into the options and check different boxes).

EDIT: Fixed the incorrect attribution of the rotating sub-scheme idea to Park instead of the true originator, raym.  Sorry about that!!

[skeeterfood]

Then, by default with new fresh library, there should be either:

a) a special "Theater View" sub-section of Audio/Video/Images top level schemes
b) a special top-level Theater View view scheme with Audio, Images, and Video child schemes

And even more, if you turned off Theater View by un-checking Tools -> Options -> General -> Advanced -> Features -> [ ] Theater View these special Theater View schemes could be hidden.  Not that most normal people would ever delve that deep into the murky waters of MC's Options Dialog

-John

[raym]

Best. Idea. Yet.

Options --> Theater View --> Items To Show --> Configure should present a dialog (similar to the Handheld Sync List dialog) where you have a Tree of your entire library and can put checkmarks in any of your existing View Schemes and it'll include them.  It should allow you to include child view schemes (but let you manually de-select individual child view schemes if desired).  If you only check one scheme for Audio (or whatever) then it would just auto-open that scheme every time.  If you have more than one, or multiple tiers, then it would either use a rotating system like Park raym mocked-up above or just present a list (or maybe both).

Yep, I agree, This sounds like an awesome idea! 

[Matt]

I'm not crazy about putting Theater View view schemes under the main library.  They're different, and add noise.

I'll put my helmet on now.

[darichman]

I actually agree with Matt here.

Having said that, I don't use theatre view as much as a lot of the other users do -- I don't want to see my theatre view schemes bundled together with my standard view schemes. It could get cluttered very quickly. And if I change a standard view, I have to try and remember if I use it as a theatre view as well.

While we would have to create (often duplicate) theatre view schemes, isn't this something that would only have to be done once, or at least, infrequently?

In my mind, the two schemes should either be completely separate or tied directly to a standard view (like the old way), but nothing in between. I prefer separate.

[jmone]

I just want my ISO's back 

[Matt]

I just want my ISO's back 

We'll do this, but we're thinking about how.

I wonder if ISO's wouldn't be "Video" with a new field that says "play as data files" or something.

[jmone]

We'll do this, but we're thinking about how.

I wonder if ISO's wouldn't be "Video" with a new field that says "play as data files" or something.

  - ISOs are just disc images that could be DVD, Blu-ray, CD, or just data...you don't know till they are mounted.  It would be best to let users tag them individually by media type for inclusion in the correct view but always just "run" them, at which point they are mounted and Windows Autorun then works out what to do just as if you put the physical disk in the drive.
Thanks
Nathan

[Alex B]

We'll do this, but we're thinking about how.

I wonder if ISO's wouldn't be "Video" with a new field that says "play as data files" or something.

Could you introduce a new media type, "ISO video" ?

.iso files would automatically be associated wth this media type. They would show up in the Video category and in the Documents category. When played they would behave like any other data file.

If someone uses MC for organizing other kind of ISO image files it would be possible to exclude the .iso files from the video category by using a view scheme rule or by changing the media type to data. Similarly it would be possible to exclude them from Documents by adding a rule.

[gappie]

in my opinion it should not only be for iso files. i play a part of my videoos outside mc, as 'data' files, but organise them in vidoes in theaterview and start them from there.

[Alex B]

I suppose you could change the media type of those files manually to "ISO video" and they would behave like you want.

I.e. they would show up in the video category, but when played they would automatically start an external associated program instead of playing inside MC.

[glynor]

I'm not crazy about putting Theater View view schemes under the main library.  They're different, and add noise.

I'll put my helmet on now.

I don't think you need a helmet at all.  That's the entire point of the idea of having the checkboxes and the separate section of the main database in the tree to "store" them.  We can all agree to disagree!  You see them as different, I don't.  The default setup would be:

Have a Top-Level Theater View View Scheme under the Tree, with Audio, Video, and Images sub-view schemes (with nice pre-defined Theater Views).  I liked this better than putting a sub-scheme under each top-level option anyway.  Then, have an Option in like was described to allow you to choose any View Schemes in the whole tree that you want to select others, de-select some, or whatever.

This solves a ton of problems:

1. It gets the Theater View items out of the main Audio/Video/Images View Schemes, which you and some other users don't like.

2. It allows us to configure and test our Theater View Schemes by configuring them normally in Standard View.  (Swapping back and forth from Options --> Theater View and back to Options to "get it right" would be a huge pain.)

3. It allows you to easily copy/paste (through the normal method) View Schemes to and from the Theater View Schemes.

4. Simplifies setting up sorting.  Just follow the normal View Scheme rules as they are applied in these special View Schemes.

5. Solves the ISO problem.  Just add ( [Media Type]=data and [File Type]=iso ) to the filters.

6. Allows those of us who would much rather just have a unified system, where the Audio tree in Standard View and the Audio tree in Theater View match to get just what we want.  I might even try setting it up through the Theater View Top-Level item if it were this way though.  (BTW -- darichman, I do change my schemes fairly regularly.  They're in near constant flux.)

7. If you really want to set it and forget it and never see them, go to Advanced options and uncheck the new Theater View Schemes checkbox.  Poof, they're gone.

I really don't see any major negatives to this method, other than coding time of course (not my problem), and it would certainly keep everyone above "pretty much happy".  A good compromise.   

[skeeterfood]

What glynor said...  plus some easier method of seeing/selecting each of the Audio/Video/Images sub-Views within Theater View.

-John

[jmone]

We can already tag any file (inclung ISO) in the D'Base as Audio, Data, Image, Playlist,TV or Video and pending how you tag them they then appear in the relevant ViewScheme.  Unfortunatly at the moment:
a) if you tag your ISO as Video (or Audio) it is is the correct Veiw but if you "play" it, MC does not run/mount the ISO
b) if you tag your ISO as DATA it is not in the correct View but if you "play" it, MC will run/mount the ISO correctly. 

For me the simple solution would be:
1) Let users tag ISO's according to what they contain (eg Video, Data, Audio) - eg this can be done now
2) Always run/mount files with an ISO extension (eg like if they were taged Data) as I know of no other way of treating "ISO" files from a MediaCenter perspective

You may then need to think about the assigning coverart bit as the option I am using is to save the art in the "DATA - NAME" format which may not be the most appropriate naming convension.

Thanks
Nathan

[jmone]

Any more thoughts on this?
Thanks
Nathan

[glynor]

I suspect they're getting changes to the View Scheme setup, including Stock Views, finalized and then they'll come back to this.

[NoCodeUK]

Been away for a while.  Not had chance to play much recetly.  But I like what Glynor said!

Adam

[raym]

I'm not crazy about putting Theater View view schemes under the main library.  They're different, and add noise.

Fair enough but I hope the lack of nested views gets adressed. This is actually driving me a little mental  ...

[gappie]

I'm not crazy about putting Theater View view schemes under the main library.  They're different, and add noise.

yes. but could it not be an idea that when you enable theaterview in options>general>etc, a new item is added to the tree: 'theater view', just like now with start and podcasts, or, even better, put it under services & plugins. giving it a place where the interface is less hidden, and it would be easy to copy views from for instance audio, to Theater View, and nest views.

 
gab

i just made a 'mockup' how it could look under services and plugins.

[rpalmer68]

Fair enough but I hope the lack of nested views gets adressed. This is actually driving me a little mental  ...

Me too, but not as mental as I am about to be when I have to do a view reset for .31 and have to build them all again!!

[skeeterfood]

... or, even better, put it under services & plugins. giving it a place where the interface is less hidden, and it would be easy to copy views from for instance audio, to Theater View, and nest views.

I would go for this, but I still don't understand why adding a top-level TheaterView item to the tree unless TheaterView is disabled is so wrong?  Does anyone who's actually using TheaterView want it's view configuration as hidden as it is today?

-John

[rpalmer68]

I would go for this, but I still don't understand why adding a top-level TheaterView item to the tree unless TheaterView is disabled is so wrong?  Does anyone who's actually using TheaterView want it's view configuration as hidden as it is today?

-John

No, I'd like it in the tree somewhere.  To me the tree is where you edit views and it seems confusing to hide it somewhwre else to me.

Richard

[skeeterfood]

Hey JR,

Would you guys be up for a poll in the MC12 forum on where the TheaterView view configuration should live?

I probably shouldn't write it, because it might end up a bit biased:

Where should the TheaterView View configuration live:
A) In a top-level TheaterView tree item where it belongs  (NOTE: Can be removed by disabling TheaterView in Options)
B) Hidden away as it is now in Options with no decent way of copying standard view schemes or testing them in standard view.
C) Partially hidden as an item under Services & Plugins



-John

[gappie]

I would go for this, but I still don't understand why adding a top-level TheaterView item to the tree unless TheaterView is disabled is so wrong?  Does anyone who's actually using TheaterView want it's view configuration as hidden as it is today?

-John

im using theaterview 95% of the time. and i do think it is two steps back at this moment. and there are more who think so, in 13 "Theater View "Views" menu is fully configurable" but less then in 12, imo. but i think this is all part of the proses to get something better (like what is happening now with the views in standard view).

 
gab