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[phalanthus]

why doesn't the look-up process pick up the best available?

[dcwebman]

It orders them top down as the most selected from users. Someone else's best available may be different than your view.

[phalanthus]

my example is black sabbath "technical ecstasy"- the auto lookup chose a cover which is absolute crap @ 130x130 - not what you would select manually EVER surely ?
i do not understand how it works

[Alex B]

Only the selections that are done inside the Get From Internet tool add "votes".

Maybe the selection is arbitrary or the first submitted image stays in the first position if there are no votes.

Regarding the "Black Sabbath - Tehnical Ecstasy" album I got these choices a few minutes ago:



Even if you decide to select the current, aka "Your Library", image you should press the Save Cover Art button to add a vote and submit the image if it is not already on the server.

(I just submitted mine.)

[MrHaugen]

This is a problem, and it's the reason why I never let MC do things like this automaticly.
Is there a way for MC to pick out the biggest and best picture if no votes have been given, or a even number of votes have been cast? A good cover art is normally with a size above 1000x1000 and 200KB? Sure, it also depends on the actual scan, but in most cases the bigger the better.

[Frobozz]

Bigger is not better in all cases.  Some people scan in very large images but do a very very poor job of it.  For example they won't turn on the descreen filter when scanning so end up with moiré patterns in the scan.  Others are scanned with incorrect color balance or color temperature.  There are many ways to scan images poorly.

The only way to judge the quality of an image is to look at it and have humans vote.  Unfortunately everyone doesn't agree on what is really best.  Some people prefer big while others will prefer a smaller but better quality image.  I have standardized on 500x500 cover art so if there is an 800x800 image and a 500x500 image, and they booth look good, I'll pick the 500x500 while you might pick the 800x800.  Not everyone is going to agree on which one should be the top vote getter.

[phalanthus]

my original question remains unanswered - if we let media center pick our album art for us we will get rubbish - why ?

[Alex B]

As you can see from my screenshot, there was no 130x130 picture for the example album when I tested the feature. In my experience many albums get a medium sized picture by default, probably because sizes from 300x300 to 500x500 are traditionally common and are what most users have submitted.

I am not saying that the rules that determine the default choice could not be tweaked, but it's up to JRiver to decide if they want to explain in detail how it works now and request suggestions from the users.

The automatic downloader that can be enabled in the auto-import options is a nice feature for newcomers who don't have existing cover art. I'd recommend disabling it after the first mass import and using the interactive tool whenever appropriate (= either for getting or submitting better quality art or for adding art to newly imported albums). The actions made with the interactive tool enhance the database content.

[phalanthus]

"As you can see from my screenshot, there was no 130x130 picture for the example album when I tested the feature"
TRUST ME - THAT IS WHAT I GOT & IS ONE OF MANY EXAMPLES

[Alex B]

You are not getting the point. The database is based on user submissions and can be bettered by user actions.

Regarding "Black Sabbath - Technical Ecstasy" maybe there is a separate entry with slightly different spelling or maybe new submissions have replaced the 130x130 picture after you got the poor quality image. Did you actually try the interactive tool? It accesses the same database as the automatic feature.

[JimH]

This is a problem, and it's the reason why I never let MC do things like this automaticly.
Is there a way for MC to pick out the biggest and best picture if no votes have been given, or a even number of votes have been cast? A good cover art is normally with a size above 1000x1000 and 200KB? Sure, it also depends on the actual scan, but in most cases the bigger the better.

A bigger file can often be cropped incorrectly.  It can also have color distortion, or a moire pattern.

The current system promotes images that have been selected most.  It isn't always correct, but it gets better with time.

We gave this problem a lot of thought.  We think the solution is the best.

You can always do the process manually and choose exactly what you want.  You can always replace an image you don't like.

[MrHaugen]

Would it not be even more effective if we had a way of voting the cover art down the list? Preferrably with a bigger count than the automatic vote up. This would be perfect for people manually looking through the cover art lists and spots some bad ones at the top.

[phalanthus]

why can't we have the capacity to indicate what is the best of the options- i.e. size right, no white borders when inappropriate and actually belonging to the album we are working on - that selection would be the 1st choice shown and any other rubbish would trail behind ??

[Frobozz]

I don't know JRiver's rationale for the cover art database design and image selection.  I suspect that high on their list of concerns is minimizing the incentive and damage that can be done by people who would want to game the database to inject inappropriate images or incorrect images just for the lulz.  If you could vote images down you open up avenues for gaming the database.  The current system where cover art is voted up only if it is an image that you are willing to apply to your own files makes for a system that is less likely to be gamed.