Topic: VST plug-in support (Read 13991 times)

keither · « **on:** May 06, 2009, 04:38:14 pm »

It does not appear that there's any way in DSP Studio to sequence plugins.

Large plugins can make the DSP Studio window exceed the size of the screen with no way to get access to the settings (perhaps scroll bars are needed)?

DSP Studio title bar shows zone # and not zone name.

MC crashes in the VST plugins whenever I try to play a track.

mojave · « **Reply #1 on:** May 06, 2009, 04:39:09 pm »

I like the new VST Plugin feature. However, I can't uninstall VST Plugins. It says they are uninstalled after I click uninstall. When I go to the DSP Studio, they are still there.

Matt · « **Reply #2 on:** May 06, 2009, 04:42:19 pm »

If you have a VST plug-in you're having issue with (crashes, too big, etc.), please provide a way for us to test it. (either provide a link or email the plugin to matt at jriver dot com)

Thanks.

keither · « **Reply #3 on:** May 06, 2009, 04:47:01 pm »

Check your e-mail. That's one of them that caused a crash.

-Keith

mojave · « **Reply #4 on:** May 06, 2009, 04:47:50 pm »

I think some plugins require the output mode to be ASIO.

Matt · « **Reply #5 on:** May 06, 2009, 04:53:42 pm »

Quote from: keither on May 06, 2009, 04:47:01 pm

Check your e-mail. That's one of them that caused a crash.

-Keith

Thanks.

Unfortunately, I guess, it loads fine for me (and looks nice in DSP Studio).

It wouldn't process data (said format not supported) until I stopped and started playback, which looks like a bug.

But after restarting playback, it's working great.

Any ideas?

Matt · « **Reply #6 on:** May 06, 2009, 04:55:01 pm »

Quote from: mojave on May 06, 2009, 04:39:09 pm

I like the new VST Plugin feature. However, I can't uninstall VST Plugins. It says they are uninstalled after I click uninstall. When I go to the DSP Studio, they are still there.

After a plug-in uninstall, you may need to stop playback and/or close and reopen DSP Studio.

keither · « **Reply #7 on:** May 06, 2009, 05:02:28 pm »

I dropped another one in e-mail to you, since for some reason the first one I sent works now. *chuckle* This one crashed when I used it.

neFAST · « **Reply #8 on:** May 06, 2009, 05:15:55 pm »

Should we consider using VST Plugins instead of the effects from DSP Studio?

bunglemebaby · « **Reply #9 on:** May 06, 2009, 06:46:14 pm »

Quote

Should we consider using VST Plugins instead of the effects from DSP Studio?

Only if you think you'll get better sound or a lower cpu/ram hit from them, which is probably the case with at least one of them. That said there are a lot of great sounding VST fx out there. There's also a plethora of garbage to go with it. The VST standard is not necessarily any better than Direct-X (or RTAS) based effects. VST is just a standard, and happens to be the most commonly used standard in the audio production and DJ world.

If you're curious and unsure, you can check out the forums at http://www.kvraudio.com/ for some ideas on good, free effects that might be useful to you.

If you're feeling bored and looking to make your tunes sound wacky search for FSU effects...

newsposter · « **Reply #10 on:** May 07, 2009, 01:33:48 am »

And here is another link for some VST 'gear':

http://www.freewebs.com/daviddiezmusic/vst.htm

)p( · « **Reply #11 on:** May 07, 2009, 02:19:18 am »

Has anyone got the vst version of the convolver plugin working with mc?

http://convolver.sourceforge.net/vst.html

peter

Matt · « **Reply #12 on:** May 07, 2009, 11:09:22 am »

Quote from: keither on May 06, 2009, 05:02:28 pm

I dropped another one in e-mail to you, since for some reason the first one I sent works now. *chuckle* This one crashed when I used it.

Thanks. It looks like plug-ins that support more channels than the input are a problem.

I don't see any way to tell a plug-in "only process on the first two channels of your eight inputs", so we may just have to pump extra data through it that we'll ignore.

mojave · « **Reply #13 on:** May 08, 2009, 10:20:47 am »

Quote from: keither on May 06, 2009, 04:38:14 pm

It does not appear that there's any way in DSP Studio to sequence plugins.

I found a program called Console that also works as a VST plugin. It allows you to sequence other plugins. You may want to take a look at it.

keither · « **Reply #14 on:** May 08, 2009, 10:27:14 am »

I was using Console before as a DX plugin. But it's flaky inside MC.

Matt · « **Reply #15 on:** May 08, 2009, 01:59:16 pm »

Build 167, available at the top of this board, fixes some VST issues.

Ordering of DSPs is something we're considering, but I don't know if it'll make it into v13.

keither · « **Reply #16 on:** May 08, 2009, 02:13:00 pm »

Hey Matt -

Got the upgrade, and yet another plugin that crashes comin' at ya.

This one also has a size that's too big for the screen (on my 1280x800 laptop).

Matt · « **Reply #17 on:** May 08, 2009, 03:11:39 pm »

Quote from: keither on May 08, 2009, 02:13:00 pm

Hey Matt -

Got the upgrade, and yet another plugin that crashes comin' at ya. This one also has a size that's too big for the screen (on my 1280x800 laptop).

I can't figure out why that plugin tanks. We call the main processing function processReplacing and it explodes inside the plugin.

The plugin loads fine, shows UI fine, etc.

I filled out a webform at their site to see if they'll help, although it might be a longshot. It might help if you asked as well.

)p( · « **Reply #18 on:** May 08, 2009, 03:26:26 pm »

Quote from: Matt on May 08, 2009, 01:59:16 pm

Build 167, available at the top of this board, fixes some VST issues.

ConvolverVST works with the new build

update: Oops...not really...seems to work but when enabled it says processing but no sound

peter

mojave · « **Reply #19 on:** May 08, 2009, 04:24:23 pm »

Quote from: )p( on May 08, 2009, 03:26:26 pm

ConvolverVST works with the new build

update: Oops...not really...seems to work but when enabled it says processing but no sound

peter

You could also try Voxengo Pristine Space as your convolver. There is a thread at HomeTheaterShack regarding its use and other plugins for digital room correction.

keither · « **Reply #20 on:** May 08, 2009, 04:33:24 pm »

Quote from: Matt on May 08, 2009, 03:11:39 pm

I filled out a webform at their site to see if they'll help, although it might be a longshot. It might help if you asked as well.

I've got other plugins I can use if that one is problematic. Also, it seems like the newer versions of T-racks are better, although more CPU intensive.

Matt · « **Reply #21 on:** May 08, 2009, 04:34:40 pm »

Quote from: )p( on May 08, 2009, 03:26:26 pm

ConvolverVST works with the new build

update: Oops...not really...seems to work but when enabled it says processing but no sound

peter

That one is tricky. It only loads if you switch the working path to its folder. We'll do this, but it's bad manners by the plugin.

But I can't figure out how to configure it. Could you email me a WAV that should work with it? It'd be nice if it was obvious when it was on and off.

Thanks.

keither · « **Reply #22 on:** May 08, 2009, 06:17:02 pm »

Hey Matt,

On the BBE and the new version of T-racks, my in-plugin settings aren't being saved from start-up to start-up. I'm having to reload all the presets I'm using each time I restart MC.

Matt · « **Reply #23 on:** May 08, 2009, 06:56:37 pm »

Quote from: keither on May 08, 2009, 06:17:02 pm

Hey Matt,

On the BBE and the new version of T-racks, my in-plugin settings aren't being saved from start-up to start-up. I'm having to reload all the presets I'm using each time I restart MC.

But preset loading and saving is working, right?

It's a weird settings system that I don't fully understand. There are like 10 or 20 slots, often with names. But then it allows you to change any slot independently.

I suppose it could save the slot # and slot settings at shutdown, or maybe just the slot settings and apply them to slot 0 on startup?

keither · « **Reply #24 on:** May 08, 2009, 07:00:53 pm »

Quote from: Matt on May 08, 2009, 06:56:37 pm

But preset loading and saving is working, right?

It's a weird settings system that I don't fully understand. There are like 10 or 20 slots, often with names. But then it allows you to change any slot independently.

I suppose it could save the slot # and slot settings at shutdown, or maybe just the slot settings and apply them to slot 0 on startup?

Yeah - preset loading and saving is working fine. I'm able to save my settings out per plugin and restore them when I restart, which is definitely a good start. I can see why y'all haven't supported this stuff before now.

I tend to use a single set of settings all the time, so I'm not overly concerned with what slots get loaded where.

GHammer · « **Reply #25 on:** May 08, 2009, 11:43:12 pm »

On a related note, Ozone 4 does not remember what preset it was using from startup to startup. I have to open it each time and select the preset.

Under DirectX, it never forgot them.

)p( · « **Reply #26 on:** May 09, 2009, 04:08:31 am »

Quote from: mojave on May 08, 2009, 04:24:23 pm

You could also try Voxengo Pristine Space as your convolver. There is a thread at HomeTheaterShack regarding its use and other plugins for digital room correction.

I installed the Voxengo Pristine Space VST and it works 100% and sounds just fine with the latest mc build

Nice thread by the way...always good to see other experiences with drc!

peter

MusicHawk · « **Reply #27 on:** May 09, 2009, 06:03:35 pm »

I can report that I'm now able to use MC 13 with AudioProc, a sophisticated plug-in that provides the kind of controls used by radio stations, including multi-band compression, limiting, EQ, and more. It gives me "radio station" sound with lots of tweakability, a sound I like because I was a broadcaster for many years.

Some "buts.." and questions:

AudioProc was built for WinAmp, so it needs to be put in an undocumented WinAmp folder. It doesn't have a UI that integrates with MC, so with enough clicking I can get AudioProc's UI opened via MC's Plug-in Manager. So it's semi-MC-compatible, but works well once configured.

But, AudioProc is priced very different than MC, because it's sold PER COMPUTER, which gets very expensive fast. So it's probably for a very specialized market.
http://www.audioproc.ca/index.php?page=Home

Questions:

When I put AudioProc in MC's DSP chain, AudioProc's natural output audio level is very hot compared with MC. I have to turn down AudioProc's output by about 18db to get them roughly the same. Is this just a side-effect of it being a WinAmp plugin, or is something else going on? (It's actually quite interesting to have a way to crank up the output, because MC natively always seems "low".)

Where in the audio chain is MC's Spectrum display? It seems to be BEFORE audio is fed into DSP processes. I'd love to see on the Spectrum display what I'm actually hearing. It would be wonderful to treat the Spectrum (and maybe other audio-stream displays) as DSP chain elements, and to allow positioning of each DSP element.

Matt · « **Reply #28 on:** May 11, 2009, 09:37:13 am »

Quote from: MusicHawk on May 09, 2009, 06:03:35 pm

Where in the audio chain is MC's Spectrum display? It seems to be BEFORE audio is fed into DSP processes. I'd love to see on the Spectrum display what I'm actually hearing.

Visualization data is collected after DSP processing.

This means visualizations do show the effects of any DSPs.

An easy way to see this is by moving the preamp in the equalizer.

Frobozz · « **Reply #29 on:** May 11, 2009, 10:14:25 am »

The free TT Dynamic Range Meter VST doesn't work in MC. The same VST does work in Foobar (using George Yohng's VST Wrapper) so the VST probably isn't doing something too strange. The VST is just an animated meter that shows the dynamic range of the music.

The VST can be downloaded here. Download the "TT Dynamic Range Meter Plugin Bundle for All Platforms.zip" file to get the VST.

In MC13 I get no audio when the VST is enabled. The UI for the VST works.

Matt · « **Reply #30 on:** May 11, 2009, 11:09:02 am »

We were providing the processing block size incorrectly to the plug-ins. I think it explains most of the problems reported.

Look for an updated build later this week, and thanks for all the help.

keither · « **Reply #31 on:** May 11, 2009, 12:25:44 pm »

Thank YOU guys for adding this support!

mojave · « **Reply #32 on:** May 13, 2009, 11:05:09 am »

If I have the Playback Method set to "JRiver audio engine (using DirectShow filter)" then the DSP Studio plugins work fine. However, if I change the Playback Method to "JRiver video engine (using DirectShow filters)" then the DSP Studio plugins no longer work even if I have the same DirectShow filters selected. How do I ensure that all audio and video content use the VST plugin that I have selected?

By the way, I noticed that "JRiver audio engine (using DirectShow filter)" should have "filters" instead of "filter."

JimH · « **Reply #33 on:** May 13, 2009, 03:28:48 pm »

Quote from: Matt on May 11, 2009, 11:09:02 am

We were providing the processing block size incorrectly to the plug-ins. I think it explains most of the problems reported.

Look for an updated build later this week, and thanks for all the help.

This is in build 169, just posted at the top of this board.

Bibo · « **Reply #34 on:** May 13, 2009, 04:23:34 pm »

Does build 169 work with Thuneau's Allocator?
Thanks

keither · « **Reply #35 on:** May 13, 2009, 07:20:16 pm »

13.0.169 fixes the crashes in my problem plugins. Way to go, guys!

So, ongoing issues / feature requests in no particular order:

* That T-Racks 1.0 plugin is still too large for my screen (1280x800).
* VST settings are not saved from program close to program open
* There's no way to order plugins in the DSP
* DSP Studio does not indicate which Zone it applies to
* VST Plugin processes don't take advantage of multiple cores
* VST Plugins refresh their indicators VERY slowly / aren't very responsive
* DSP Studio disappears when MC is minimized and then restored
* DSP Studio plugins don't work when playback is set to JRiver video engine (using Directshow fiters)
* No indication of CPU usage used by an individual plugin

All that aside, the support that is in 13.0.169 is fantastic and definitely usable for what I'm doing. Pretty amazing to go from zero to here in what .. 6 builds?

Beatnik62 · « **Reply #36 on:** May 14, 2009, 12:59:27 am »

I've just a question, how do I uninstall VST plugins from the plugin list ?

Beatnik

Frobozz · « **Reply #37 on:** May 14, 2009, 03:24:52 am »

Quote from: Frobozz on May 11, 2009, 10:14:25 am

The free TT Dynamic Range Meter VST doesn't work in MC. The same VST does work in Foobar (using George Yohng's VST Wrapper) so the VST probably isn't doing something too strange. The VST is just an animated meter that shows the dynamic range of the music.

The VST can be downloaded here. Download the "TT Dynamic Range Meter Plugin Bundle for All Platforms.zip" file to get the VST.

In MC13 I get no audio when the VST is enabled. The UI for the VST works.

This VST is working now in build 169. But the animation of the meter is jerky. Like watching a video with a very low frame rate. The animation of the meter when used in Foobar is much smoother.

keither · « **Reply #38 on:** May 14, 2009, 08:18:35 am »

Quote from: Beatnik62 on May 14, 2009, 12:59:27 am

I've just a question, how do I uninstall VST plugins from the plugin list ?

In the Tools menu, select Plug In Manager...
All of the plugins are installed under the DSP item. Expand that, select the plugin you want to uninstall, and click the uninstall button.

mojave · « **Reply #39 on:** May 14, 2009, 11:44:48 am »

The plugin that I use, ReaEQ will not load with build 169. I get the error, "Failed to install plug-in." The plugin was already loaded before updating to 169. I uninstalled and it won't reinstall, either.

Beatnik62 · « **Reply #40 on:** May 14, 2009, 12:28:47 pm »

Quote from: keither on May 14, 2009, 08:18:35 am

In the Tools menu, select Plug In Manager...
All of the plugins are installed under the DSP item. Expand that, select the plugin you want to uninstall, and click the uninstall button.

Yep, thanks for this hint.

Beatnik

Bibo · « **Reply #41 on:** May 14, 2009, 01:27:30 pm »

Please could anyone test for me if build 169 can work with Thuneau's Allocator (http://www.thuneau.com/allocator.htm)? It's a crossover program: 2In-4or6Out.

Thanks

mojave · « **Reply #42 on:** May 14, 2009, 04:16:59 pm »

That is a cool looking plugin. However, I can't get it to work from within MC. It loads okay, but when I press the stream button I lose all sound. I also can't access the Audio Settings and Audio Routing.

Bibo · « **Reply #43 on:** May 14, 2009, 11:58:13 pm »

Thanks mojave

Bibo · « **Reply #44 on:** May 16, 2009, 01:30:45 am »

Quote from: Matt on May 07, 2009, 11:09:22 am

Thanks. It looks like plug-ins that support more channels than the input are a problem.

I don't see any way to tell a plug-in "only process on the first two channels of your eight inputs", so we may just have to pump extra data through it that we'll ignore.

Thinking of Thuneau's Allocator, is there any chance that MC13 is going to support 2 in by 8 out VST's?

Thanks

Bibo · « **Reply #45 on:** May 28, 2009, 12:38:32 pm »

I renew the above request - is there any chance that MC is going to support 2 in by 8 out VST filters?

Thanks

Brambo · « **Reply #46 on:** June 08, 2009, 02:43:16 pm »

Hi,

Adding VST support is a wonderful thing, it made me buy a licence actually.
Only plug-in I use at this moment is an equalizer named apEQ which can be found here => http://www.apulsoft.ch/apeq/
It is one of the best equalizers around IMO, and I've tried many. Highly transparent.
It has a very graphical interface, and that's where the problem begins. It won't refresh, so it is impossible to make changes without switching to - for example - effects and back to see the change. And even then it's mostly 'a shot in the dark'
It is working correctly in all my other apps, including Winamp and other players, so it is a pity to see that it is virtually useless in MC13 (and 14 as well)

Thanks,

INTERACT FORUM

Author Topic: VST plug-in support (Read 13991 times)