Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Datman]

I had too much time on my hands today.  I have been overly concerned with getting the best audio quality and too many options. I have always believed there is a small improvement with master audio over core audio (AC3/DTS). Under the best conditions  a well recorded soundtrack, maximum bit rate there will be subtle differences.

I figured out a way to do an undisputable test. I simply used the right and left front outputs on my Asus xonar hdav 1.3 deluxe sound card and directly plugged that output into my Echo Mona sound card used for semi professional recording(different computer). I captured it all in 24bit 96khz. I choose Baraka as my source it’s a 24/96 soundtrack. I pick a part that was about 8 min and recorded it every possible way. 1st in 24/96 2nd turn windows audio audio to 16/48 (24/96 source) 3rd I played the AC3 audio track, all with MC18.

Then I did the same process with PDVD 11 and TMT5. I recorded each version and able to play it replay compare them every possible way all the while thinking there must be obvious differences given the ability to put them side by side I could hear. For me and perhaps a younger mans ears would be different but I finally see the emperor has no clothes on.

I could not hear any discernable difference from any of the versions. Maybe on the very soft parts there was more depth in the background  in the full 24/96 versions with MC18 and PDVD 11.

I thought perhaps a different source. I did the same thing with Chris Botti 2005 BD also in 24/96 now the emperor had on a speedo. The background depth was a little better than the AC3 version. If any at all only the very very best soundtracks will the differences even audible.

just my 2cents

[hulkss]

If you want to hear BIG changes in your audio (hopefully improvements) you gotta make changes with loudspeakers and room acoustics. If you do not want to mess with your speakers or your room, you can do it with digital filtering via the JRiver DSP convolver. A few of us are using Audiolense to generate the filters. http://www.juicehifi.com/index.html

[Datman]

If you want to hear BIG changes in your audio (hopefully improvements) you gotta make changes with loudspeakers and room acoustics.

I'm already there. I’m very close to the conundrum  “ Is this as good as it gets?” I have pretty good hardware and finish room treatments over a year ago.

I’m just surprised how little actual improvement master audio provides. I’ve heard other say there is virtually no difference I always thought they must not have a good system. I was always sure I could tell the difference in a blind test. I’m positive in a blind test I could not tell the difference. So it’s time for me to be happy with what I have and enjoy MC18
 

[gappie]

So it’s time for me to be happy with what I have and enjoy MC18
 

i agree. nice story. just spend some time to get the best out of what you have, and stop thinking about it and enjoy the music, because that what it was all about (and mc ofcourse, the music is in good hands there )

 
gab

[kstuart]

There are two different things being confused here:

* Movie soundtrack Audio

* Music playback Audio

The big difference is that during a movie, you are watching the building explode, following the pretty person walk down the street, and trying to anticipate what the bad guy is going to do next.  You are not focusing on any aspect of audio.  As a result, there is no real difference in experience between 1.5mbps DTS audio (that is the core for the lossless DTS audio) and any lossless movie audio, unless you have a more-expensive-than-a-car Home Theater system.

In contrast, these days you can get a USB asynchronous DAC for as low as $99 that will give you 24bit 96khz stereo audio playback for music, that IMHO is noticeably preferable to lossey MP3 files.

But you may not notice that if you use music mostly for background listening.  Usually the one exception is headphone listening...

[Datman]

there is no real difference in experience between 1.5mbps DTS audio (that is the core for the lossless DTS audio) and any lossless movie audio, unless you have a more-expensive-than-a-car Home Theater system.

That's the kind of system I have and all I'm saying is now I too realize that they sound the same. Even on a system that cost more than a car.

[eddyshere]

hum....interesting ?. did you make your listening tests on loudspeakers or on earphones...? you said you recorded on semi-pro equipment, I assume you used monitoring grade speakers for the test. If so that is an interesting statement. I would agree that differences are very subtle and I do sometimes laugh about the audiophile woodoo talk but at that sampling rates and panel I would have expected to see the emperor at last with a long boxer short

[kstuart]

There is also the factor of trained listening.

Many of the differences between audiophile gear and good quality "mid-fi" gear are only audible to someone who is a music or audio professional, or else someone whose major hobby for many years is music.

This doesn't inhibit stores from selling eight channel lossless audio HDMI receivers to everyone else, because a lot of the economy is based on acquiring status symbols.

I once had a boss who drove his Ferrari every day to work in the 10 mph rush hour traffic...

[Datman]

Agreed

I think that the way I recorded each sample and being able compare them instantly on the same system makes the relevance of having a state of the art system and studio audition room less important. However the system is a Bryston 1.7 per/pro, Bryston 4b amp Canton ergo 120 and CM51 front speakers XLO speaker wires Transparent cable audio interconnects. Two JBL 1522 (if I remember) 15in subs each in a tuned 7cuft box. The combination of room treatments and REW (room eq wizard) and a BFD I get a measured response effectively flat to 15hz powered by two Adcom 555II run mono bridged to each.

For a small family room it sounds pretty good. Good headphones might revel more but this is where I listen to movies so this is where it counts.

Now when I made all these upgrades everything made an improvement among the biggest was getting the multi-channel  analog (in my case) HTPC dialed in. Giving me a huge improvement over core audio via spdif. I can redo that comparison today and I still think the analog sounds warmer ( I think equal to HDMI) compared to spdif.

Here’s another suggestion, what if Master Audio tracks are just a bunch of hype? A great new selling feature that for the vast majority of movies are just unconverted core audio. It would probable sound exactly the same. This is my discovery on these two soundtracks they sound the same. Maybe both of these were not good sources for this test. I thought music would be better than explosions.