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[Kukulcan]

Hi,

I'm having a weird problem, I hear pops, clicks and crackles if I enable the convolution engine, but only using ASIO!

Later, for the sake of testing, I tried the same cfg. files (generated by Audiolense) on my new laptop through its integrated speakers, (HP Pavilion x360 with an i3 5010U) and this time music sounded flawlessly (direct sound mode). Convolution engine indicated: 2 paths, Performance: 32X using SSE.

Interestingly I connected the same laptop (instead of the older HTPC) to the HAPI (via Ethernet) and it showed the same annoying pops and crackles (but a bit less than the slower and older HTPC). So this time the only difference in the configuration was that I was using ASIO (the HAPI can work only via ASIO).

Consider also that the HAPI is provided with proprietary ASIO 2.2 drivers, this interface/DAC is a very nice piece of professional stuff, I'm inclined to think that its driver has no fault, also because it works flawlessly if convolution engine is disabled.


so what's wrong?? Any idea?

[JimH]

Buffer size?

[mattkhan]

I would say yes to buffer size being the problem, reducing buffer size does cause increase glitches in my system (when using convolution). I've never been able to get it to work reliably with any line in (wdm, asio) though so use IIR only for that.

[Kukulcan]

Thank you for your replies. Do you mean this parameter in the attachment?
Mattkhan, your are saying to me that I can't get completely rid of this issue?  HAPI and convolutions with FIR are the FOUNDATION of my future system with active DIY loudspekers.

If JRiver (or what else) doesn't work good with ASIO and FIR convolution, I have to rethink everything.

[mattkhan]

I mean that I have not been able to get rid of the issue when using convolution with ASIO line in. I only get glitches, on normal playback, if the buffers are really really tiny. I use firewire myself and I have found that the FF400 interface was much less stable than the FF800 interface I now use.

The pic you posted looks like the sort of place a buffer will be set btw. There is one in the jriver output device config as well.

[mojave]

Yes, increase that parameter in the picture. That is too small for ASIO and convolution. The reason it works with direct sound mode is because much larger buffers are used by default. Low latency with ASIO drivers are usually only needed for live sound mixing.

You also need to go to Tools > Options > Audio > Audio Device > Device Settings and check the buffer setting there. The default of 50 milliseconds usually works, but sometimes more or less will help.

Regarding the HAPI driver, member DallasJustice bought a HAPI and returned it because the drivers were causing issues IIRC.

[Kukulcan]

ok thank you, it's clearer now. So I will try larger buffers and I'll let you know (in the following days, now no access to my system).

Could a Masscore "connection" make sense? The Hapi can be connected also through a Masscore NIC adapter. Actually the purpouse of this connection is to cut latency, so as you mojave already wrote, it's something interesting for real-time mixing, but some explanation from Merging website make me think that I could get an improvement (I don't know, just some suppositions). Please would you so kind to give a look at this text and make a comment:

MassCore technology “hides” one or more cores in a multiple CPU computer and then creates a “pipe” directly between the software and those hidden cores to essentially create an Intel-powered DSP based system. By doing this, the user can enjoy all the power that an Intel CPU core(s) holds (which is a HUGE amount) and does not add any additional latencies as it effectively removes the need for any requests to be made of the operating system with regards to real-time calculations.

The NIC adpter is not so expensive, just about 200€. If it could theoretically solve my problem, I may order it and give a try, if it doesn't help, I ship it back. (after having tried the increase of buffer size).

[mattkhan]

masscore itself just sounds some sort of shared memory pipe so I guess you're talking about the masscore pcie nic? how many channels are you using here? if it's a normal audio system then you shouldn't need a bespoke PCIe NIC just to get stable output.

[Kukulcan]

MassCore Ethernet PCIe Network, but  I don't know if JRiver sees it as output device....

Anyway the problem now happens even with only 2.1 configuration. I have now a 5.1 system, but when I build my active front (L,R,C), I will have much more channels... the limit of the Hapi is 16 with a second D/A module, I will get close pretty close to it...


Edit: Masscore must be something you get with the software Pyramix... so that's not the case.

[mattkhan]

google says there is some PCIe ethernet card referred to as the NET-MSC-GBEX1 model

16 channels should be fine with standard hardware, just twiddle with buffers and go from there

[Kukulcan]

I mean that I have not been able to get rid of the issue when using convolution with ASIO line in. I only get glitches, on normal playback, if the buffers are really really tiny.

Sorry, I also missed the part concerning ASIO in. So following the indications that you and mojave gave me about buffer, should be enough.

Just one last question: what kind of MoBo and CPU should I get? (Also because with active loudspeaker setup my old Athlon X2 will soon run out of power) Does convolution engine exploit multicore/multithread CPU? Or it would be enough a less core/high Ghz CPU?  May the MoBo and RAM make a difference? Or just a good ASUS with 8 GB RAM is enough?

Thanks again guys!!!!

[mattkhan]

I use a core i7 4790 with 17 filter paths without any issues, tbh the core i3 4340 I used to use could do this too but the i7 can do that + stream to 2 other devices at the same time so I'm happy.

What speed does it say the filters run at atm?

[Kukulcan]

I use a core i7 4790 with 17 filter paths without any issues, tbh the core i3 4340 I used to use could do this too

Thank you for the tips! When I'll set the proper buffer and everything works, I'll report here with some more precise data about the performance indicated in convolution engine.

[Kukulcan]

Yes, increase that parameter in the picture. That is too small for ASIO and convolution. The reason it works with direct sound mode is because much larger buffers are used by default.

It helps, the more the samples, the less the pops and crackels

You also need to go to Tools > Options > Audio > Audio Device > Device Settings and check the buffer setting there. The default of 50 milliseconds usually works, but sometimes more or less will help.

A drastic increase to this parameter, up to 500ms, has totally solved the issue. I can playback a movie without any crackles with 8 paths convolutions (5.1 with every speakers set to small) at just 2.0X real time performance. So it means that even though the old Athlon X2 64 6000+ is pushed almost to its limit, the playback still goes on without issues.

Thank you mojave!