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[DmitryB]

Hello everyone. I am new to JRiver (all of 3 days) and this is my story/question.

I am moving from using iTunes exclusively for a decade or two and wanted to use a media management program that could coldly play audio formats iTunes for some bizarre reason has not seen fit to make compatible after all these years. (Is FLAC really still controversial??)

In any case, as a listener of primarily classical music I've been keeping my iTunes library organized a certain way and would like to keep the essence of that design going with JRiver: my library was built almost entirely with Folders and Subfolders and Playlists. So a main folder for all the composers, let's say, Mozart then subfolder for Chamber or Opera and then subfolder for String Quartets or Don Giovanni and then a Playlist for the specific ensemble or conductor, etc. The Playlist may contain multiple albums  because many musicians recorded the same piece of music multiple times and I'd like to have all the versions in one place.

I can see this is something that can be recreated using Groups and Playlists in JRiver, so that's great. But a few questions for people who have been using JRiver longer than 3 days:

1) Is there another way classical listeners use to arrange their classical collections? (I prefer to do things manually, so no Smartlists or auto-import because I have found in the past things getting past me and then forgotten.)

2) I am finding that the Groups that contain sub-Groups and Playlists constantly close, so I have to reopen each level over and over again. Is there to just keep the Groups open all the time?

3) And most importantly, I'm having problems customizing the Views that I prefer in the Playlists. The problem is the Album Artwork. I love to have Artwork prominently displayed along with whatever additional columns I choose. But in Playlists the Album artwork can only be a tiny thumbnail (really, the size of a thumbnail) and it can not be resized to be larger. In other places of the program the Artwork can be resized, but I can not find a way to do this in Playlist. Essentially the Image #1 below what I'd love to be able to recreate in a Playlist: Large/Adjustable Artwork on the Left and my additional columns of choice on the right.

4) Content Panel (like in image #2) appears in all the Playlists and that's fine: but is there a way to get rid of/change the Date Added info? My system also gives me some ID number of numbers. I do not find this information useful in any way. Can I replace it with something else?

Thank you so much!

Just FYI, the version I'm of JRiver I'm using is the last version downloaded from this site (version 25) and I'm on a iMacPro.

Thanks again!
Dmitry

[JimH]

There is some good information on classical music here:
https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Tagging_Classical_Music

[DmitryB]

Thanks JimH for the link! I'd read that thread previously in my various google searches for solutions. They have some great ideas for tagging classical music, but nothing that addresses my problems with questions 2, 3 and 4. I've read repeatedly that the program is customizable in every way, but I can't figure out how to configure the view to my liking and it's the Album Cover that is the main culprit. Choosing the column Image doesn't give me the artwork, Thumbnails sometimes gives me artwork, sometimes not, but tiny size. I'd love to be able to resize the image like in the Panel display, but Panel doesn't seem to be available in Playlists. (If it is - I don't see where.)  ?

I can't even get the Album view in the main/parent Playlist level. All the available options give me artwork per track, so I end up with 1000 covers for just 50 recordings.

It's a bit frustrating; I haven't purchased a license yet (still in trial mode) and am starting to wonder what other media libraries are out there. 

[blgentry]

In MC, the normal way of looking at Playlists, with the tree on the left and the details on the right, is not bad, but it's kind of limited for advanced use like you are describing.

My preference is to use a Panes view for this kind of work.  Look in Audio.  You should see a view with the title "Files".  That is a Panes view that has one pane (selectable column) with file location in it.  This might be a good view for you to play with since it will let you drill down through you files and folder pretty easily and should not collapse on you like the Playlists do.

You can make your OWN Panes views too.  You can add the columns you want so it will let you select things exactly as you want to.  Now, at the bottom of the a Panes view is the list of files that you have selected by clicking in the various panes above.  That file list can show thumbnails for files (songs) or it can be made to show ALBUMS instead and can show just the album art of each album.  Just go up top to the title of the Panes view, click on the little down arrow, and then select List Style > Album Thumbnails .

Some combination of Panes and the proper list style will probably give you the type of view you want.

Regarding Playlists:  I think you are on the right track how you are setting up your playlists.  Build your playlist groups and subgroups as you have been.  ...and then make a Pane for Playlists!  To do this, right click on an existing Pane, then select "add Pane to the left", and then Playlist Group, Root of all playlists.  The new Pane that appears, titled "Playlist" will have a tree of your playlists that you can choose from.  I just tested and I don't think it collapses it's groups when you select others.

I hope this helps get you started.  Good luck!

Brian.

[DmitryB]

Brian, thanks so much! I will try what you describe later tonight. I hadn't thought of using Panes in place of Playlists, but that may be a good solution for this! Hopefully I can find an existing "Pane" somewhere. 

[DmitryB]

EDITING THIS:

I have sort of figured this out...but something is off. I've created a new Pane that has all my Playlists. (I assume any new playlist will appear in this Pane?) Is this what your instructions were???

Thank you!

Regarding Playlists:  I think you are on the right track how you are setting up your playlists.  Build your playlist groups and subgroups as you have been.  ...and then make a Pane for Playlists!  To do this, right click on an existing Pane, then select "add Pane to the left", and then Playlist Group, Root of all playlists.  The new Pane that appears, titled "Playlist" will have a tree of your playlists that you can choose from.  I just tested and I don't think it collapses it's groups when you select others.

Brian.

Hi Brian!

I think your advice here was right: the Pane view is perfect for what I need, but I wasn't able to do the steps you advised because - and I'm probably just dumb - nowhere I click in any window gives me an option to "Add Pane To The Left." I obviously don't know where to right-click... 

[blgentry]

I have sort of figured this out...but something is off. I've created a new Pane that has all my Playlists. (I assume any new playlist will appear in this Pane?) Is this what your instructions were???

Yes.  As long as you did "root of all playlists", all new playlists will show up in that pane.  YOu might have to refresh the view to get new playlists to appear.  Not 100% sure about that detail.

Brian.

[DmitryB]

Hey Brian (and anyone else who can help!,

So after a couple of days of playing with this set-up: it's mostly good BUT...a few limitations that I hope have a fix.

Working with the Playlists in the Pane creates one problem: the View can not be changed from playlist to playlist. One change affects the entire catalog. But if one playlist is a big choral piece and the next is piano solo, I can't customize them... Can I? The way I'm seeing items listed in the Pane Playlist does not reflect how items are listed in the Root Playlist, including the way items are sorted.

And the Pane Playlists do close on their own, although I'm learning to live with it. This part is not a deal-breaker.

Also, semi-related: some of the items in my collection have multi-channel options. When I import the album in, it imports both 2 channel and Multi into the same album, so a 5 track disc becomes a 10 track disc. Is there a way to either make the multi-channel invisible or to merge them?

Thanks!
D.

[blgentry]

Working with the Playlists in the Pane creates one problem: the View can not be changed from playlist to playlist. One change affects the entire catalog. But if one playlist is a big choral piece and the next is piano solo, I can't customize them... Can I?

You mean the files display below the Panes up top right?  What do you want to change per playlist?  Sorting?  If it's sorting, you can add sort options to the Panes and then click on the kind of sorting you want to do.  It will apply very quickly.  I don't know of a way to save the sort order per playlist *and* display it in a Panes view.

Using a Panes view for Playlists is kind of backwards in a way.  Because it does not honor playlist order (I don't think) and doesn't use any of the options from the regular Playlist view.  The reason I suggested that you use it is that Panes have a flexible way of showing their files, using thumbnails, no thumbnails, album thumbnails, etc.  Plus it's pretty easy to drill down into directories using Panes (which you also asked for).  Panes have a lot of options that are well suited to displaying, sorting, and browsing lots of files.

It's also possible to build several Panes views for playlists and set up each one to sort differently.  Did you know you can open multiple tabs in MC?  So you can have a tab with Playing Now, another tab with an albums view, another with a Panes Playlist, and maybe more tabs with extra Panes Playlist views with different sort orders.  Clicking between tabs is really fast (just like a web browser).

The way I'm seeing items listed in the Pane Playlist does not reflect how items are listed in the Root Playlist, including the way items are sorted.

Right.  I actually didn't understand what you meant the first time I read it.  Now I see what you mean:  The numbered order of the playlist is not retained in a Panes view.  This is a known "feature" of Panes views.  I actually forgot about it until I started writing this post.  Sorry about that.

Also, semi-related: some of the items in my collection have multi-channel options. When I import the album in, it imports both 2 channel and Multi into the same album, so a 5 track disc becomes a 10 track disc. Is there a way to either make the multi-channel invisible or to merge them?

Presumably you have some SACD rips that have 2 ch and multichannel layers.  I've definitely experienced this.  There are many solutions.  Here are a few:

1.  Tag each of these as separate albums.  Select the 2 channel tracks and call them "Album Name (stereo)".  Then select the multichannel tracks and name them "Album name (multichannel)".  When you change their album tags, they will be separated into two different albums, so they will be truly separate.
2.  Build new top level views like "Albums stereo" and "Albums multichannel".  Write rules into your views like "[Channels] is equal 2" , which will only show you the songs on albums that are 2 channel (stereo).  Built a similar rule into your multichannel view to only show tracks with channels greater than 2.
3.  In a Panes view, add a column for channels.  Then select what you want to see.

Each of these has it's limitations.  You can kind of figure out what's important to you and use the solution you like.

Brian.

[DmitryB]

Thank you Brian for all of your help!

You mean the files display below the Panes up top right?  What do you want to change per playlist?  Sorting?  If it's sorting, you can add sort options to the Panes and then click on the kind of sorting you want to do.  It will apply very quickly.  I don't know of a way to save the sort order per playlist *and* display it in a Panes view.

Using a Panes view for Playlists is kind of backwards in a way.  Because it does not honor playlist order (I don't think) and doesn't use any of the options from the regular Playlist view.  The reason I suggested that you use it is that Panes have a flexible way of showing their files, using thumbnails, no thumbnails, album thumbnails, etc.  Plus it's pretty easy to drill down into directories using Panes (which you also asked for).  Panes have a lot of options that are well suited to displaying, sorting, and browsing lots of files.

It's also possible to build several Panes views for playlists and set up each one to sort differently.  Did you know you can open multiple tabs in MC?  So you can have a tab with Playing Now, another tab with an albums view, another with a Panes Playlist, and maybe more tabs with extra Panes Playlist views with different sort orders.  Clicking between tabs is really fast (just like a web browser).

What I was trying to do with the View in the Panes set-up is if I go from Beethoven's 9th Symphony - with orchestra, chorus, conductor, soloists (4 columns) - to solo piano (1 column) - I can't have the appropriate columns in each playlist. I will need to have them all in solo piano (including chorus/orchestra/conductor). In a root playlist I can customize each playlist to reflect the forces used in a composition. In the Panes set-up it seems to be a universal view. Remove the Chorus from the piano piece, and it's missing the 9th Symphony also.

I like everything else about the Panes set-up - except this (and that it doesn't respect the Playlist order, but I suppose there are work-arounds for that.)

So I like a lot about the Root level Playlists and I like a lot about the Panes set-up. Each one is missing one or two valuable things that the other one has!   

[blgentry]

What I was trying to do with the View in the Panes set-up is if I go from Beethoven's 9th Symphony - with orchestra, chorus, conductor, soloists (4 columns) - to solo piano (1 column) - I can't have the appropriate columns in each playlist.

Ahhhh.  I should have thought of that.  I can think of two ways around this:

1.  Make another two different Panes views.  One with columns for orchestra.  Another with columns for Piano.  Maybe even put your playlists into a group for each one (orchestra for one and piano for the other) and only display those playlist groups in each Panes view.
2.  Do you know about column presets?  You can set up your columns the way you like them.  Then save them as a preset.  Then any time you want, you can apply one of your presets.  So you could switch presets depending upon which kind of playlist you are looking at.  To get started with that, right click in the header area of an columns view and check out the Preset menu there.

Panes may or may not be the solution for you.  You know it's always possible to put a Panes view in a tab and a Playlists view in another tab and switch back and forth too.  Or two Panes views and a playlist view (3 tabs).  Or any combination you want.

Brian.