Topic: AudioEngine D1 @192KHz? (Read 23011 times)

godt · « **on:** March 27, 2013, 10:26:28 pm »

I have an AudioEngine D1 connected by Toslink to my PC with Realtek-Azalia HD sound onboard, and Windows 7 64 bit.

Using WASAPI Event style, but

Every 192kHz file is resampled to 96kHz. Been through the Wiki and the forum, messed about with DSP settings, all to no avail. I get:

'Playback could not be started using the format: 192kHz 24bit 2ch.

This format would work:96kHz 24bit 2ch.'

'Something went wrong with playback.... Playback could not be started on the output WASAPI - Event Style' using the format 192kHz 24bit 2ch.

This output may not be supported by your hardware.'

I have 192kHz 24bit set as default format in Realtek HD control panel.

Anyone overcome this at all?

AudioEngine people say it can definitely handle 192kHz 24bit.

Mike48 · « **Reply #1 on:** March 27, 2013, 11:29:48 pm »

I don't know about this particular DAC, but usually Toslink tops out at 96/24, and one would need to use wire (SPDIF, AES-EBU) to get to 192/24.

Mike48 · « **Reply #2 on:** March 27, 2013, 11:44:40 pm »

I was wrong about that. At least according to the reviews of the unit, it should do 192 through Toslink. I suppose it's possible that some sound cards won't send 192 over Toslink. I'm sure you'll get other comments, and most likely someone will get it.

godt · « **Reply #3 on:** March 28, 2013, 12:40:05 am »

Yes, I've been puzzling through this one, having seen the suggestion that Toslink tops out at 96kHz. Yet the AudioEngine people say 129kHz is possible with Toslink, and it isn't with USB, at least standard USB. Nothing at AudioEngine about USB Audio Class 2.

Then there are different kinds of Toslink cables. I'm beginning to think that this is what makes 192kHz possible:

http://www.lifatec.com/toslink2.html

Quite a bit of talk about 'glass' Toslink, and the specs would suggest this would do it. Some of this glass Toslink stuff is seriously expensive.

godt · « **Reply #4 on:** April 16, 2013, 06:39:12 pm »

Well, I've got my Silflex glass cable connected to the D1, which seems to mean that I have everything I need to get 192kHz. I have Realtek HD Audio set to 24 bit 192000Hz output, I have Media Center set to WASAPI Event style and all output formats up to 192000Hz set to match input format at 24-bit. But I cannot get anything above 96kHZ to play at its native output.

Any suggestions as to what else I might try?

Matt · « **Reply #5 on:** April 24, 2013, 07:56:46 am »

My guess is that using the Realtek onboard sound card is the issue. It probably doesn't support 192kHz.

I would try to get it out of the loop.

mojave · « **Reply #6 on:** April 24, 2013, 03:24:22 pm »

My Realtek onboard sound card supports 192 kHz via Toslink. I had to go into the Windows Control Panel > Hardware and Sound > Sound > (device) > Properties and click the Supported Formats tab and then select 192.0 kHz for it to work.

godt · « **Reply #7 on:** April 24, 2013, 09:30:45 pm »

Thank you for the replies. The Realtek does support 192kHz, so that is OK. But you have both pointed to what my problem is. The D1 is no installing on, or connecting to or through the Realtek HD audio. If I uninstall the Realtek, Windows installs its own HD audio, and that creates an unholy mess, with distorted system sounds even. If I install a fresh version of the Realtek drivers, I get two new audio devices:

Speakers, Realtek HD audio, not plugged in

and Realtek Digital Output, Realtek HD audio, ready

A test on the latter produces no sound. The green level bars float up, but I get no sound.

Below those devices is:

Speakers, 3-Audioengine D1, default device, which has max output of 24 bit 96000Hz.

I've uninstalled everything and reinstalled, installed Realtek drivers without the Toslink cable connected, yet at no point does the D1 associate with the Realtek. Which means that my setup is limited to 96kHz, as you suggest mojave, by Windows.

I cannot see a way to associate the D1 with the Realtek drivers, or vice versa. Realtek stuff appears as separate, and separated, devices.

Listener · « **Reply #8 on:** April 25, 2013, 11:39:24 am »

I use SPDIF output from Realtek onboard sound on my personal PC. JRiver shows two choices labeled "Digital audio S/PDIF...".

One is for the Toslink optical output and I think the other is for the coax output.

Windows shows similar choices in the Playback devices dialog. I select the one for Toslink output so that audio output from my web browser goes to my DAC via the Toslink connection.

I don't get sound when I output at 192 KHz through the Realtek Toslink connector to a TC Electronic BMC-2 DAC. (The Realtek does support output at 192 KHz through analog output or coax SPDIF.) Toslink may be limited by the capabilities of the transmitter, the receiver or the cable connecting them.

SPDIF is a one-way interface, passing audio data and clock information to the DAC. There is no way for the Audioengine D1 to tell your PC about its cababilities through the SPDIF connection. It can do so through a USB connection but that only applies to uses the USB connection for sending audio data to the D1.

Bill

godt · « **Reply #9 on:** April 25, 2013, 07:06:40 pm »

I can't find those options in MC or in Windows. Can you direct me please?

Typing 'Toslink' in Windows control panel search brings up nothing.

Listener · « **Reply #10 on:** April 26, 2013, 12:31:03 am »

Quote from: godt on April 25, 2013, 07:06:40 pm

I can't find those options in MC or in Windows. Can you direct me please?

You set the default audio output device in Windows. These instructions should work in Win XP or Win 7.

1. Right-click on the speaker icon in the system tray area of the taskbar.

2. Click on Playback devices in the menu that appears.

3. Click on one of the devices listed and then click on "Set default" to make that device the default device to which Windows and simple apps like browsers will send maudio output.

Steps 1 and 3 are illustrated in this screenshot:

JRiver can send audio output to the default device or to one of the other devices. You can select the appropriarte device with this process:

1. Click on Player in the main menu at the top of the MC window.

2. Click on "Playback options" in the menu that appears. Click on "Audio" and then "Output mode settings" in the dialog that appears.

3. In the settings dialog that appears, choose your output device from the dropdown list.

Steps 1 and 3 are illustrated in this screenshot:

> Typing 'Toslink' in Windows control panel search brings up nothing.

In the Windows 7 Control Panel, typing "audio" in the search field brings up several possibilities. Choosing "manage audio devices" brings me to the dialog for setting the default device.

Bill

godt · « **Reply #11 on:** April 27, 2013, 09:37:01 pm »

Thanks for the detailed reply Listener. You've confirmed my suspicions in a few ways. I have no reference to S/PDIF in any list of playback devices -Windows drivers, in Realtek or in MC. Just speakers and Realtek Digital Output.

So what I have done is delete everything - MC (just to do a new install) Realtek drivers, and USB sound devices in device manager. I then used Revo and CCcleaner to remove all leftover registry entries, rebooted and had no sound devices whatsoever.

I then rebooted with the AudioEngine connected to the USB port and without the Toslink cable. Windows installed its HD drivers. I rebooted, and had system sounds through the D1. (I have no speakers connected through the back panel.)

I then rebooted with the Toslink cable in place, and sound devices list appeared thus:

with these options under Properties for Digital Audio (S/PDIF):

I then installed the Realtek drivers and MC, and rebooted, with this result:

Properties for Speakers 3-AudioEngine D1 appears as:

and for Realtek audio output:

Selecting Speakers/D1 in MC as Audio Output device gives me HD music off my PC, and no system sounds, and no sound whatsoever through MC Connected Media.

If I select Realtek Digital Output in MC as Audio Output device, with it as either Default Device or Default Communication Device in Windows, I get no sound at all. This is while Windows gives this:

But if I play a 192kHz track, I get MC indicating that it is playing the track, and without any modification.

So I have my initial problem: 96kHz sounds through the D1 with or without Toslink cable, but now no system sounds or sounds through browser, popup or otherwise.

But what I can see clearly is MC displaying that 192kHz level is being processed fine. Only when I have Realtek Digital Output in MC as Audio Output device, I get no sound at all.

Realtek digital sound is handling 192kHz, but not connecting to speakers, on a clean install of all sound stuff involved.

Samson · « **Reply #12 on:** April 28, 2013, 02:50:24 am »

Getting a little complicated for me lol but just a long shot....try right clicking the the speaker symbol in the notifications area in task bar > Volume control options and click all options to show their own volume control. Then right clicking the the speaker symbol in the notifications area in task bar > open volume mixer. What are the respective volume settings. also does anything else now display in playback devices?

You mentioned usb but not sure how it might be applicable,
USB Audio Class 1 standard (1998) allows for 24 bits / 96 kHz.
USB Audio Class 2 standard (2009) additionally supports 24 and 32 bit and all common sample rates on USB 2 or 3 but will need a special driver.

JimH · « **Reply #13 on:** April 28, 2013, 07:08:59 am »

Do not use a registry cleaner. It is likely to cause problems.

When you uninstall, you can tell MC to remove registry entries, but you will lose all settings.

godt · « **Reply #14 on:** April 29, 2013, 12:14:27 am »

Quote from: JimH on April 28, 2013, 07:08:59 am

Do not use a registry cleaner. It is likely to cause problems.

So how do I uninstall it?

Quote from: Samson on April 28, 2013, 02:50:24 am

What are the respective volume settings. also does anything else now display in playback devices?

All devices show at max volume, with nothing new added. But your comments about class 2 usb remind me that the AudioEngine people knew nothing about that. And I recall not being able to find the specialist driver. I'll have another look.

This also reminds me that when I installed the Windows usb/HD sound drivers, I am sure that it listed 192kHz as a format. But when I looked again after installing the Realtek drivers, it showed only to 96kHz. Having got nowhere since, I might as well remove it all and start again. But how can I remove all settings in MC without using a registry cleaner?

Just noticed - I also have no sound from audio CD in CD drive.

Sooo, I just removed the Realtek drivers and rebooted. Windows installs HD drivers (is this the class 2 USB driver?) and this is what I get in devices:

And! S/PDIF lists all formats up to 192kHz but only plays 16 bit 48kHz.

At least I can here Windows startup! No sound from CD. And no sound from speakers other than device test! Anyone know a way out of this mess?

Samson · « **Reply #15 on:** April 29, 2013, 03:24:12 am »

Quote from: godt on April 29, 2013, 12:14:27 am

So how do I uninstall it?
Anyone know a way out of this mess?

There seems to be a few differenet issues here.

1)Playing 192kHz over Spdif. AFAIK spdif only reliably supports up to 24/96. Some devices transmitters/receivers will apparently transmit up to 24/192.It gets fuzzy for me when talking about cheap plastic fibreoptic cable on a Toslink connector as opposed to expensive glass fibreoptics on AT&T connectors.So while your sound card may indicate possible transmission @192 doesn't mean you will get it.

2) The usb thing seems to be a red herring. You are not connecting your external device over a usb connection.you are connecting internal sound card to external device over plastic spdif on toslink connectors?

3) Something weird seems to be going on with your computer in general, esp now if no sound from your cd drive etc.Not sure what shows up under device manager for various things and their drivers and I would keep checking the volume mixer when you try different scenarios to checkif somehow eg system sounds or whatever got muted? At any rate I suspect someone needs to fiddle going back and fourth troubleshooting various possibilities, clean uninstalling or mucking about with registry keys (which i dont recommend unless you are more than comfortable with this).These days I just re-image back to an earlier windows state (providing you have image backups). you can try system restore and if lucky this sometimes solves such messes.If all alse fails its the dreaded Re-OS (format and reinstall windows and progs).This would be the LAST resort if no one else solves the mess for you. At the end of the day it is possible you still may not get 192khz unless using a usb connected external dac.

hopefully others will give better advice

rjr1203 · « **Reply #16 on:** October 09, 2013, 05:18:57 pm »

I know that this is an old topic but if you did not find a solution I hope this might help you.

I have my Media Server running with its built in sound device that happens to be a Realtek, it supports up to 24bit 196K like yours and I have a DA that supports up to 24bit 384K, I purchased a Silflex glass cable because of everything good I heard about glass Toslink and I could not get my Media Server to lock with my DA, no sound at all. to make a really long story short I purchased a monoprice Toslink (8.0 mm OD) and my DA LOCKED immediately to the signal and got audio, tried an Emotiva Toslink cable and it worked too. So as I could see the issue was the silflex that maxed out at 24/96K.

It seems that all cables are not created equal (it doesn't matter if someone says the opposite because I tested it first hand). I hope this helps.

godt · « **Reply #17 on:** October 09, 2013, 06:11:50 pm »

Thanks for the replies people. I too got myself a Siflex cable and got a nice connection with the D1 at up to 96k, but produced noise when I went to 192k. As the result of a long process of trial and error, part of which is above, I decided for a reason that I can no longer remember that the problem was with the Realtek drivers, and that I was wasting my time with the Realtek anyway because I could not get 88k or 176k.

So I got myself one of these:

http://www.esi-audio.com/products/juliaxte/

dropped it in, connected the RCA outputs to my Rega Brio, and away it went. A revelation. Windows is happy, it has ASIO 2.0 which worked out of the box after selecting it in MC, and I assume that with a phono pre-amplifier I can even record at 192k. The only issue I have had since is with MC being bothered by swapping sources: sometimes I have to reboot the PC to get MC to acknowledge a new source, eg., if I play a CD and then swap to 'connected media', nothing will happen until I reboot. Yes, I have Exclusive Mode unchecked in Windows. Anyway, it seems to happen less with MC19.

The Juli@ card is not a cheap solution, but it is a very very good one.

gtgray · « **Reply #18 on:** October 10, 2013, 10:05:45 pm »

I have had a Realtek do 192 fine over toslink or spdif to either my FiiO E17 or a cheapie 3 year old Sony 5.1 receiver. I don't have any native 24 192k content but when I set MC to upscale to that both devices report 192k... The Sony does not report bit depth but the FiiO does. I also have an M-Audio 192 that works over spdif... cheapies cables.

gtgray · « **Reply #19 on:** October 21, 2013, 10:34:10 pm »

I had a Pioneer Elite in the closet VSX-82TSX because it was only HDMI 1.1. I pulled it out it has a Burr Brown Shark 4 I think DACs. It was perfectly happy playing 24 bit 192 HZ off Toslink with a Monoprice premium Toslink cable. Now I am not sure I like the sound of 192K vs. 96k on some upsampled content. The M-Audio Delta 192 PCI is the source and the Pioneer Elites sounds way better than the cheapie Sony. This PC is an H61 M with a Sandy Bridge Pentium.

I have the same case with an intel board and an I3 Clarkedale and it makes lots of noise and is unusable on both PCI and USB. That is why I assembled the H61M...I have a Sound Blaster Z coming to do Toslink pass though using a PCIe slot. PCI and USB are on Southbridge.

The Clarkdale will sleep the HD61m won't despite my best efforts. So I will see what happens. The SB Z is supposed to pass through 24 bit 192K and since it is PCIe which is on Northbridge I expect it to make clean audio. The Clarksdale is an Intel Media Board and I was much surprised to find all the noise on the Southbridge.

gtgray · « **Reply #20 on:** October 23, 2013, 04:51:06 pm »

Quote from: gtgray on October 21, 2013, 10:34:10 pm

I had a Pioneer Elite in the closet VSX-82TSX because it was only HDMI 1.1. I pulled it out it has a Burr Brown Shark 4 I think DACs. It was perfectly happy playing 24 bit 192 HZ off Toslink with a Monoprice premium Toslink cable. Now I am not sure I like the sound of 192K vs. 96k on some upsampled content. The M-Audio Delta 192 PCI is the source and the Pioneer Elites sounds way better than the cheapie Sony. This PC is an H61 M with a Sandy Bridge Pentium.

I have the same case with an intel board and an I3 Clarkedale and it makes lots of noise and is unusable on both PCI and USB. That is why I assembled the H61M...I have a Sound Blaster Z coming to do Toslink pass though using a PCIe slot. PCI and USB are on Southbridge.

The Clarkdale will sleep the HD61m won't despite my best efforts. So I will see what happens. The SB Z is supposed to pass through 24 bit 192K and since it is PCIe which is on Northbridge I expect it to make clean audio. The Clarksdale is an Intel Media Board and I was much surprised to find all the noise on the Southbridge.

The SoundBlaster Z was a fail see the Sound Card/DAC Thread.

INTERACT FORUM

Author Topic: AudioEngine D1 @192KHz? (Read 23011 times)