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[mimizone]

Hi, I am still evaluating Media Center. So sorry if it's a dummy question.

I can't figure out how to force conversion of all types of files to DSD 64 when using DLNA.
I've created a DLNA server, with DSD 64 as the Output encoding.
I only got noise playing on my Sony receiver.

On Audirvana, I can set to force converting to DSD, and also the type of algorithm I want to use and the parameters (I use iZotope I think there). And it works on the Sony receiver (STR DN-1050) no problem.

I'd like to try the same on JRiver. Audirvana has some crashing/stability issues for me. and JRiver, even if it has way too many features that makes it overwhelming, seems to have a few things I want to use.

Side note: I have to force converting to DSD 64 because there is a bug on the receiver for high bitrate files over DLNA. The music sometimes shutters when using 24/192 for instance. It has nothing to do with bandwidth congestion or my Mac Mini being too busy. Definitely a bug in the Sony receiver firmware that they will never fix...

[Kippiis]

Hi everyone, I have the same question. Can anyone elaborate on this?

[Awesome Donkey]

I'm not even sure if this works (and would not be surprised if it doesn't) but you can try opening DSP Studio then go to Output Format and set Output Encoding to DSD in DoP format. From there make sure DoPE is enabled when using DLNA and see if that works.

But don't be surprised if it doesn't.

P.S. If all you're hearing is noise, make sure both system volume and internal volume is set to 100% or else it may not work either.

[mimizone]

Ok so the problem I believe is that the Sony receiver expects Native DSD over DLNA.
If I enable Output Encoding using DSD DoP, I get logically noise.

The solution would be to offer an option to do the encoding independently of how the data is sent.

Is that possible as-is somewhere else or it should become a feature request?

[Awesome Donkey]

I don't believe sending native DSD over DLNA exists nor is even possible. DSD over DLNA is only possible with DoPE.

https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/DSD#DSD_Over_DLNA

[mimizone]

Maybe something to do with the way JRiver sends the data.

I remember in another DLNA server (minidlnad), we had to patch the code to include the proper HTTP header / Content type used so DSD are read as such and not PCM or invalid data.
You can see that patch being referenced in the Dockerfile I created here https://github.com/mimizone/minidlna-dsd
The code is here (not from me) https://sourceforge.net/p/minidlna/git/ci/799e6cf505ec470b2bf0ae4118143380aa16b837/
The HTTP Mime type is set to "audio/x-dsd".

JRiver does it right when selecting "Original File format" and Bitstream DSD enabled.
But not when Output Encoding is set to DoP.

See I don't use SSL anywhere, I could probably sniff the traffic and see what JRiver does on the wire.
I believe JRiver code is not public, right?

[RoderickGI]

Just to be clear, neither ISO or DSD are supported by the DLNA or UPnP standards.

https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,118098.msg817172.html#msg817172

Have a read of that thread noting comments about converting to DSD. It goes via PCM in MC. Original format > PCM > DSD.

I remember in another DLNA server (minidlnad), we had to patch the code to include the proper HTTP header / Content type used so DSD are read as such and not PCM or invalid data.

So that would have been specifying in the header that the PCM stream was actually DoPE, and not PCM.

Search the internet. Native DSD over DLNA doesn't exist. Though it does get asked about a bit.

However, after decoding at the renderer end, what you have is Native DSD, and that is what the renderer sees. That is what confuses people, I think.


Disclaimer: Awesome Donkey, JimH, and I could be wrong. But I haven't found any evidence for that.


While I am here:

Don't do this;

I can't figure out how to force conversion of all types of files to DSD 64 when using DLNA.

Every conversion you do can result in lost information. PCM is fine. It is, after all, the raw digital audio data.

If you think it sounds better, and that is a very personal thing, consider this:
"Against this, there are some more logical answers why many DSD recordings sound very good indeed. Studios that master music in DSD specialise in high quality recordings of extremely good musicians. Because of this, DSD material includes some sensational music and if you’re a fan of classical music in particular, you’ll find that some of the finest performances by orchestras and composers have been captured in DSD and thanks to the care and effort that went into them, they sound fantastic even before any of the benefits of the format come into play."
https://www.cambridgeaudio.com/en/blog/what-dsd

I only got noise playing on my Sony receiver.

Did you take note of this?

P.S. If all you're hearing is noise, make sure both system volume and internal volume is set to 100% or else it may not work either.

Ok so the problem I believe is that the Sony receiver expects Native DSD over DLNA.

Can you share a reference for that? The Reference Guide does say;

DLNA section
Supported format*
DSD**:
2.8 MHz, 1 bit DSD

But it doesn't say how it delivers DSD over DLNA. In fact, it doesn't say much at all. I can't find anything in their other manuals and help files either. They just say the STR-DN1050 support DSD over DLNA. That would be DoPE I believe.

On Audirvana, I can set to force converting to DSD, and also the type of algorithm I want to use and the parameters (I use iZotope I think there). And it works on the Sony receiver (STR DN-1050) no problem.

So DSD over DLNA via DoPE works with the STR-DN1050. Set up MC for DoPE and play some DSD64 files to test. But don't convert everything else to DSD64!

[mimizone]

Thanks a lot for the info and for your opinion.

You’ll see in my previous messages that yes indeed the Sony receiver can get DSD via DLNA. Works from minidlna, audirvana and MC. I chatted with Sony support in the past cause it’s indeed not well documented...

I convert to DSD64 everything not because of  audiophile reasons and not because I don’t care about conversions in the middle, but because I experience with the Sony receiver that it doesn’t shutter when playing DsD but it does for 24/192. It’s not a consistent issue, and the flac 24/192 play fine sometimes, but it drives me nuts when it starts to do it in a track and then it will do it every 10s after that.
Converting to dsd was a quick solution that fixes the problem, but most likely not the root cause.

If I said native dsd over Dlna before it’s just to differentiate the fact I was using either the original file and not the DoP option.
Bad choice of words because I confused everybody apparently

I see exactly how DoP works I believe and went to all the different specs that can be found on the web to understand if I was doing something wrong that the Sony receiver was not expecting.
So far not sure why I have the problem, only over Dlna with 24/192.