Topic: 16.0.111 Replay gain problem (Read 4618 times)

justsomeguy · « **on:** June 16, 2011, 04:03:33 am »

I noticed today that MC is ignoring the volume leveling in the dsp after a track change. It happens if I click the next track or let the track play through and MC switches to the next track. In either case the volume has noticeably increased and the only way to correct it is to stop and start playback on the current track, however at the next track change it happens again.

justsomeguy · « **Reply #1 on:** June 16, 2011, 04:08:38 am »

Ok, I just very quickly re-installed 16.0.110 and it works fine. I then installed 16.0.111 again and the problem is back.

justsomeguy · « **Reply #2 on:** June 16, 2011, 02:44:50 pm »

Anyone else with this problem?

justsomeguy · « **Reply #3 on:** June 21, 2011, 03:05:53 pm »

This still happens with 16.0.115....

Go back to 110 and there is no problem

Matt · « **Reply #4 on:** June 21, 2011, 03:46:52 pm »

Quote from: justsomeguy on June 21, 2011, 03:05:53 pm

This still happens with 16.0.115....

Go back to 110 and there is no problem

What settings are you using in DSP Studio > Volume Levelling?

What does the display show on that page as it switches tracks?

Are you running some other DSP that could be increasing the volume so that Clip Protection is getting engaged?

justsomeguy · « **Reply #5 on:** June 21, 2011, 08:54:27 pm »

I was using GlissEQ but have disabled it. Still happens. Only things enabled are Output Format, Volume Leveling and Analyzer.

I'm using ASIO output. In Output Format Resampling is set to none, Bitdepth 32bit, Channels 5.1, Mixing Clone, and Move center to front L/R is checked.

After playing with it some more it doesn't seem related to Volume Leveling at all, as I can uncheck it and still have it happen. It does appear to be applying the volume leveling though when checked and the problem is less pronounced with it on than off but still happens either way. I've turned off Overflow handling so I could see the peaks and several tracks I'm seeing 150% and sometimes higher peak level. When it happens if I stop playback and start it again on that track the level is normal.

If I set Channels to 2 the problem doesn't happen.

justsomeguy · « **Reply #6 on:** June 21, 2011, 09:00:38 pm »

Ok, just figured out what is causing it. In Output format I have Channels set to 5.1 and Move center to front L/R checked. If I uncheck Move to L/R everything works fine no matter what Channel or Mixing config I use.

Matt · « **Reply #7 on:** June 22, 2011, 09:39:05 am »

I haven't been able to reproduce this.

The 'Move center to front L/R' option attenuates all channels so that clipping is mathematically impossible.

Are you playing 2.0 content or native 5.1 content? Is some other setting important?

Thanks.

justsomeguy · « **Reply #8 on:** June 22, 2011, 03:17:02 pm »

I am playing 2.0 content.

Just discovered another condition to cause it to happen. I only have mp3 and flac in my library and it only happens when there is a track change between different formats. If a mp3 is playing then the next track is flac it happens and the other way around. It it still dependent on if "Move center to front L/R" is checked. If it's not, it still works fine.

Matt · « **Reply #9 on:** June 22, 2011, 03:18:07 pm »

Do you have all audio playback set to 'Automatic' in Options > File Types?

If not, could you try that?

justsomeguy · « **Reply #10 on:** June 22, 2011, 03:33:23 pm »

Just checked and playback method is set to automatic for all audio file types.

Matt · « **Reply #11 on:** June 22, 2011, 03:41:24 pm »

I'm really confused because the output side doesn't see any difference between a FLAC and MP3, so it shouldn't even know there was a track change.

Could you also disable Volume Levelling to make sure that isn't making a difference?

Any other clues?

justsomeguy · « **Reply #12 on:** June 22, 2011, 04:06:35 pm »

While I've been testing it the only dsp that I have checked is Output Format. No resampling, 32bit, 5.1 channel, clone mixing and move to front are the settings for the dsp. It happens in clone or JRSS mode, if mixing is set to no up or downmixing it doesn't happen (obviously since move to front gets disabled automatically). Overflow handling is set to none and I can see 150% or more sometimes peak depending on the track, with clip protection on the peak tops at 100% but with quite tracks that should be no where near 100% they are amplified as well.

After the first track change with a format change and the problem happens the issue still occurs on every following track whether it's flac to flac or mp3 to mp3 until playback is stopped and restarted. Then flac to flac and mp3 to mp3 is fine until another mp3 to flac or flac to mp3 occurs.

I was looking for a way around the problem, as I really like some of the improvements to video playback in the last few builds, and thought I could uncheck move to front and just mute the center speaker. However MC doesn't retain that setting after restarting MC.

Matt · « **Reply #13 on:** June 22, 2011, 04:24:34 pm »

I can't make this happen.

Would you be willing to email me a library backup so I could test your exact settings? I'm matt at jriver dot com.

With the option to move the center to the front L/R, it actually does nothing on 2.0 to 5.1 upmixing. In other words, it's not building a center and then folding it into the L / R. So I don't understand where the volume could be coming from.

Thanks.

justsomeguy · « **Reply #14 on:** June 22, 2011, 04:36:39 pm »

Done, sent with the subject "Library backup for volume problem" from matt6575 at ____ dot com

My names Matt as well.

Thanks

Matt · « **Reply #15 on:** June 22, 2011, 04:50:25 pm »

Thanks for the library. I'm still confused.

I'm using your settings and playing in 'Audio Zone'.

I imported some loud Metallica tracks and playing, seeking, and switching tracks never lets the level go over 100%.

Could you create a new zone and test it? Any idea what I could be missing?

justsomeguy · « **Reply #16 on:** June 22, 2011, 05:23:09 pm »

I setup an new zone and the only changes I made to it was to enable output format dsp and set the same setting as I listed above. I can still make the issue happen. However I noticed something else. I usually have cross fade between tracks turned off. In the new zone cross fade is on and when I force a track change, between tracks of a different format, during the few seconds of the cross fade the peak will not go above 100% but as soon as the cross fade is over then it immediately jumps over 100%.

Matt · « **Reply #17 on:** June 23, 2011, 01:00:13 pm »

We haven't been able to reproduce this on any machines here.

Can you confirm that 16.0.110 goes to 100% and 16.0.116 goes to 150%?

Could anyone else give this a shot?

Thanks.

justsomeguy · « **Reply #18 on:** June 23, 2011, 03:37:04 pm »

I installed 110 over top of 116 and it works fine. Installed 116 over top 110 again and it starts happening again. I have been installing over top of the versions so I did a complete uninstall, removed registry keys and library. Then went in and deleted the jriver folders under program files(x86) and under roaming in the user profile. Re-installed 116, set Output mode to ASIO, enabled Output Format dsp, set channels to 5.1, Mixing JRSS, switched Subwoofer to silent and checked Move center to front. Those were the only settings I changed. I then imported 4 files, 2 mp3 and 2 flac. I the problem happened again when switching between tracks of different formats.

It's very strange I can't understand what could be causing it. Doesn't sound like many others if any are having the same issue. I tried changing to WASPAI instead of ASIO but that didn't help. The only thing I've changed recently was updating drivers for my x-fi. I don't see how that would cause this but it's the only other thing I can think of.

Matt · « **Reply #19 on:** June 23, 2011, 04:49:20 pm »

I can reproduce it now.

When switching between MP3 (which provides 64-bit data) and FLAC / APE (which provide 16-bit data), the format converter gets reset.

The output format contains a center speaker the first pass, but then because the format converter silences the center, it marks the output as not having a center. On the second pass, this confused the converter.

Anyway, it'll be fixed next build. Sorry to put you through the ringer looking for the problem.

justsomeguy · « **Reply #20 on:** June 23, 2011, 05:21:41 pm »

Oh that's good... I started to think maybe I was crazy, especially since no one else reported or confirmed this.

Quote

Anyway, it'll be fixed next build. Sorry to put you through the ringer looking for the problem.

No big deal, I don't mind troubleshooting and helping when I can, especially with such a great piece of software.

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Author Topic: 16.0.111 Replay gain problem (Read 4618 times)