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[safebet]

Hi all.  I built an AMD 5050e based system for Beyond TV but often experience sync issues with live TV.  I'm trying JRiver but get no sound!

I noticed that when I tune either of the SD channels available that sound does work, but the other several HD channels are quiet...what gives?  Very odd.

Beyond TV 4.9 and the WinTV apps work fine, only JRiver MC has an issue with audio.

It's a Gigabyte motherboard with Realtek audio, and one of the few with Nvidea on board graphics.

Any suggestions welcome.  Thank you!

[JimH]

What version of MC are you using?  17.0.129 is current.

Are you playing to a receiver?  Using bitstreaming?  HDMI?

[safebet]

What version of MC are you using?  17.0.129 is current.

Are you playing to a receiver?  Using bitstreaming?  HDMI?

Hi.  I'm using the integrated Realtek analog audio device on the motherboard, strictly as 2 channel; 15 pin RGB connection for video.  Audio works fine from videolan and other applications, including 3 alternate ones now that utilize the HVR-1600.

Sorry, I cannot check version at the moment but it was downloaded last week.

I currently use Squeezebox touch for high quality audio playback - this PC however will be exclusively used for TV and video, again simply using 2 channels.

Thank you for the response.

[Yaobing]

We have not had audio problem reported for a long time (Media Center 17).  We used to have audio problem with HD channels in Media Center 16.

What is the TV tuner device that you use?

[safebet]

We have not had audio problem reported for a long time (Media Center 17).  We used to have audio problem with HD channels in Media Center 16.

What is the TV tuner device that you use?

HVR-1600

[Yaobing]

HVR-1600

LOL.  It is in the subject line, of course.

[Yaobing]

Are you using Red October?

[safebet]

LOL.  It is in the subject line, of course.

Are you using Red October?

Had to find the wiki entry on "Red October" since I wasn't familiar with it.  After reading I now am somewhat...familiar.

Quick answer: Not sure as the PC is not available at the moment.  The PC was a clean XP install with all the expected updates of course.  Applications included VLC player and Beyond TV 4.9 which included WinTV.  Since then I've tried two additional TV/DVR capable applications, Media Portal and JRiver.

Wouldn't JRiver have installed the MC16 standard package at installation?  If I need to log some data please let me know and I'll do so.

The only other change was a downgrade to VLC player back to 1.17 since the "upgrade" to 2.x tanked reliable playback files that previously played for months without issue.  Not sure if that affects codecs registered and installed in the system.  I wanted to avoid installing multiple applications on this PC but I guess when one doesn't work you keep trying until there's one that suits the bill.

[Yaobing]

Wouldn't JRiver have installed the MC16 standard package at installation?  If I need to log some data please let me know and I'll do so.

You mention MC16 here.  Is this the version you have? I do not quite remember since when we fixed the audio issue related to HD vs. SD channels.  We made some improvement in MC, and the author of LAV audio decoder filter made some improvements in that, and the problem was solved.

If you have MC16, you can try installing MC17.  If you want to keep using MC16, you can install AC3Filter and choose that in MC for audio decoding. 

[safebet]

You mention MC16 here.  Is this the version you have? I do not quite remember since when we fixed the audio issue related to HD vs. SD channels.  We made some improvement in MC, and the author of LAV audio decoder filter made some improvements in that, and the problem was solved.

If you have MC16, you can try installing MC17.  If you want to keep using MC16, you can install AC3Filter and choose that in MC for audio decoding.  

Sorry to have introduced some confusion here.    I download and installed JRiver Media Center last week, I see now that it was version 17, and that is the only version I have ever installed.  

(When you asked about "Red October", I knew nothing about that so I viewed the JRiver wiki in which I read "Red October Standard -- MC16 automatically downloads, installs, and configures known good versions of LAV Splitter, and ffdshow. We build the graph and don't allow anything else. This results in video playback that just works. "  At the time I posted I hadn't realized that the current Media Center version I was using was 17. "MC" as in "MC16", duh!)


You may be on to something though where you mention this...

 If you want to keep using MC16, you can install AC3Filter and choose that in MC for audio decoding.  

Given that I heard audio (2 channel obviously, that is all I use) on both receivable ATSC channels in SD, could it be that the HD channels are using a different decoder due possibly to 5.1 channels being present, and that's why there's no audio routing to my standard 2 channel output driver/device?  That would actually make sense.  

If so, how might I modify any decoder to insure that all standard audio feeds from the incoming signal be routed exclusively to my 2 channel output device?  Aside from being able to select DVD audio tracks in VLC Player I hadn't considered that default audio a from a TV tuner could be routed incorrectly.

Thanks for you attention on this.

[Yaobing]

I am still baffled.  We now use LAV filters.  They have been working fine - for HD/SD switch - in Australia this involves AC3/MPEG2 Audio switch.  In some European countries this involves AAC/MPEG switch.

Email me a log.  yaobing at jriver dot com

[safebet]

I am still baffled.  We now use LAV filters.  They have been working fine - for HD/SD switch - in Australia this involves AC3/MPEG2 Audio switch.  In some European countries this involves AAC/MPEG switch.

Email me a log.  yaobing at jriver dot com

Emailed yesterday.  I cleared the log, launched the app then switched between a couple of channels alternating between SD and HD channels.

Hopefully you'll find something useful.

Thank you.

[Yaobing]

Finally had chance to read the logs.  I can not find anything indicative of something wrong in the logs.  I did not realize you are in a location where TV is ATSC (US?).  So far all ATSC TV channels use AC3 audio as far as I know.  Therefore I can not image having an audio problem.  More baffled. 

[safebet]

Finally had chance to read the logs.  I can not find anything indicative of something wrong in the logs.  I did not realize you are in a location where TV is ATSC (US?).  So far all ATSC TV channels use AC3 audio as far as I know.  Therefore I can not image having an audio problem.  More baffled.  

Yes, ATSC in the state of Maine.  What could I possibly try to remedy this?  

I noticed last night that of 2 major network HD channels that have no sound (WCSH for example) but their SD sub-channels do, there is also one other station (CW network, WPXT) that DOES have sound with an HD picture.

Sound works fine with both Beyond TV 4.9 and WinTV 7.  Sadly it looks like there might still be some sound/picture sync issues with any application which makes me question the HVR-1600 and the whole idea of a decent PC based DVR.  If things worked well I was going to buy a dual tuner card (AVER or Haupauge) to avoid single tuner restrictions.  Oh well...but I ain't givin' up just yet.

[Yaobing]

Yes, ATSC in the state of Maine.  What could I possibly try to remedy this?  

I noticed last night that of 2 major network HD channels that have no sound (WCSH for example) but their SD sub-channels do, there is also one other station (CW network, WPXT) that DOES have sound with an HD picture.

Sound works fine with both Beyond TV 4.9 and WinTV 7.  Sadly it looks like there might still be some sound/picture sync issues with any application which makes me question the HVR-1600 and the whole idea of a decent PC based DVR.  If things worked well I was going to buy a dual tuner card (AVER or Haupauge) to avoid single tuner restrictions.  Oh well...but I ain't givin' up just yet.

Have you tried updating device driver?

Do you know if any of your TV stations use Enhanced AC-3 audio format instead of AC-3 format?

[safebet]

Have you tried updating device driver?

Do you know if any of your TV stations use Enhanced AC-3 audio format instead of AC-3 format?

I have not updated the device driver, however I believe it was the latest when I built the platform PC a couple months ago.

It might be a smart guess to think that the two major network channels with audio issues might use an "Enhanced AC-3" format where the smaller independent affiliate might not.  You may be on to something with that.

How do I test?  I don't have a common AV receiver with an S/P DIF input to try decoding options.  What is different in JRiver that causes the issue (if Enhanced AC-3 is the fault here)?

I really appreciate you sticking with me on this one.

[Yaobing]

We have assumed all ATSC channels use AC3.  If E-AC3 is used in some channels, and if the difference is large enough, the decoder may not be able to handle it.

You can try using AC3Filter in MC instead of the default set of filters.

AC3Filter is available here.

In MC go to Tools > Options > Video > Video Mode: -- choose Advanced / Custom

Then click Custom video mode settings..., and add a new rule with the following conditions:

Type: Audio Decoder
Filter: AC3Filter
Condition: jtv

[safebet]

You can try using AC3Filter in MC instead of the default set of filters.

BINGO!  I have sound!

Great guidance - I downloaded in another browser tab, installed and followed your instruction to the letter.  Thank you.

With that out of the way, because let's face it sound is pretty important, I've got some more learning to do.

There still seems to be some audio/video sync issues, but I see in the AC3Filter system tab there is a way to modify lag/lead.  My worry is that the error does not stay consistent, at least this was a big issue in BeyondTV.

Best to you.  

[Yaobing]

BINGO!  I have sound!

Great guidance - I downloaded in another browser tab, installed and followed your instruction to the letter.  Thank you.

With that out of the way, because let's face it sound is pretty important, I've got some more learning to do.

There still seems to be some audio/video sync issues, but I see in the AC3Filter system tab there is a way to modify lag/lead.  My worry is that the error does not stay consistent, at least this was a big issue in BeyondTV.

Best to you.  

I am glad you get sound now.

Now I still wonder what caused LAV filter not producing sound.  Can you record a few seconds of an HD channel and separately a few seconds of an SD channel and share with us?  Use transport stream format for recording.  If the segments are short enough, you may simply email them to me. 

[safebet]

I am glad you get sound now.

Now I still wonder what caused LAV filter not producing sound.  Can you record a few seconds of an HD channel and separately a few seconds of an SD channel and share with us?  Use transport stream format for recording.  If the segments are short enough, you may simply email them to me. 

Sent 2 files in separate messages, each about 20MB.  Hope they make it between our servers.

If they aren't as expected I can try again.

[Yaobing]

Sent 2 files in separate messages, each about 20MB.  Hope they make it between our servers.

If they aren't as expected I can try again.

I received the clips.  Thanks.  Sorry I have to ask you repeat this with jtv as well, at least one recording of an HD channel (the one you had trouble with).

[safebet]

I received the clips.  Thanks.  Sorry I have to ask you repeat this with jtv as well, at least one recording of an HD channel (the one you had trouble with).

To be fair I wanted to close out this thread and say farewell.  I hadn't made the progress I would have liked and was in the final days of the Media Center trial period.  Instead, I gave Beyond TV another try and found it works very well with a new GT430 video card I've installed so all is well.  No sync issues and my wife will like the easy to use interface.

Thanks for your time and all the best to you.