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Author Topic: Problem trying to resample files.  (Read 10022 times)

Peter_RN

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Problem trying to resample files.
« on: May 09, 2013, 12:19:20 pm »

I am unable to get either my Windows or Mac versions of MC 18 to resample files with sample rates above 96kHz and deliver them via DLNA to my renderers; so, resample 176.4 to 88.2 & 192 and above to 96kHz. I have set these settings in DSP studio – Output Format. All files are in wav format.

Under Media Network – Add or configure DNLA servers – Audio - I have set Conversion: Always convert.  Encoder: Uncompressed.
Under Advanced – Stereo downmix: is ticked and Sample rate: is set to 96000Hz. I have tried every combination of all the available settings here without success.

My frustration is greater because I am certain, (I think  ?) that I have played these files on numerous occasions in the past via my Windows PC’s and MC 17 & 18. I have rolled back MC 18 as far as build 106 in an attempt to get them to play without success.

My renderers are Naim NDX and Qute, both devices ‘Pull’ music from the server, (they cannot be ‘Pushed’ to). Both devices have a 24/96kHz upper limit for playback. On trying to play the resampled files they report ‘Can’t Play – unsupported file format’

So my question is am I mistaken in my belief that I have and/or should be able to play these higher sample rate files via media server having asked MC to down-sample them?

Am I missing something in the setup? I am not aware of having changed any setting that would have caused these files to have stopped playing.

I would be grateful to anyone who could clarify what I should be able to achieve in playing these files via MC.

Many thanks
Peter



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bob

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Re: Problem trying to resample files.
« Reply #1 on: May 13, 2013, 11:01:59 am »

I am unable to get either my Windows or Mac versions of MC 18 to resample files with sample rates above 96kHz and deliver them via DLNA to my renderers; so, resample 176.4 to 88.2 & 192 and above to 96kHz. I have set these settings in DSP studio – Output Format. All files are in wav format.
The DSP Studio settings are not used for DLNA.
Quote
Under Media Network – Add or configure DNLA servers – Audio - I have set Conversion: Always convert.  Encoder: Uncompressed.
Under Advanced – Stereo downmix: is ticked and Sample rate: is set to 96000Hz. I have tried every combination of all the available settings here without success.
This looks correct.
Quote
My frustration is greater because I am certain, (I think  ?) that I have played these files on numerous occasions in the past via my Windows PC’s and MC 17 & 18. I have rolled back MC 18 as far as build 106 in an attempt to get them to play without success.
I don't think those higher sample rate DLNA conversions existed in 106, they are pretty recent.
Quote
My renderers are Naim NDX and Qute, both devices ‘Pull’ music from the server, (they cannot be ‘Pushed’ to). Both devices have a 24/96kHz upper limit for playback. On trying to play the resampled files they report ‘Can’t Play – unsupported file format’

So my question is am I mistaken in my belief that I have and/or should be able to play these higher sample rate files via media server having asked MC to down-sample them?

Am I missing something in the setup? I am not aware of having changed any setting that would have caused these files to have stopped playing.

I would be grateful to anyone who could clarify what I should be able to achieve in playing these files via MC.

Many thanks
Peter
One thing you could do to test this is to try to play the file via DLNA, note the URL in the DLNA status screen, put the URL into a browser to download the converted audio file then import it into MC and verify the sample rate/bit depth in MC (or use VLC to look at the downloaded file).
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Peter_RN

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Re: Problem trying to resample files.
« Reply #2 on: May 13, 2013, 11:53:03 am »

Hello Bob

Many thanks for your clarification that the DSP Studio settings are not used for DLNA, I must have been mistaken in thinking that sample rate down-rating (192kHz to 96kHz etc) used to work. This does work in Foobar, which I used prior to discovering MC.

Do you think you may consider implementing this in DLNA at some time in the future?

Thanks again,
Peter
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bob

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Re: Problem trying to resample files.
« Reply #3 on: May 13, 2013, 12:25:02 pm »

Hello Bob

Many thanks for your clarification that the DSP Studio settings are not used for DLNA, I must have been mistaken in thinking that sample rate down-rating (192kHz to 96kHz etc) used to work. This does work in Foobar, which I used prior to discovering MC.

Do you think you may consider implementing this in DLNA at some time in the future?

Thanks again,
Peter

Sorry Peter, I wasn't clear. I meant that the general DSP studio settings that you can set in a Zone aren't used. However, the sample rate option you are setting in the DLNA server configuration should work. When the mode is set to "Specified output format" the options under audio->advanced are used. The source material should be getting sampled to the target sample rate you set there. That's why I suggested you pull the conversion URL with a browser and see if it was converted properly.

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Peter_RN

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Re: Problem trying to resample files.
« Reply #4 on: May 14, 2013, 01:05:50 pm »

Hello Bob

Many thanks for the clarification; I’m afraid I simple don’t know how I would carry out your suggestion in the last sentence.  ?

However, following your other information I have been able to stream my 192kHz files at 96kHz, unfortunately with the settings required to do this ALL sample rates are played at 96kHz including my readbook files, this is not what I was trying to achieve.

I did switch on the local output via computer speakers (these are normally off with MC set to Null Output) and the desired output of all files up to Sample Rate 96kHz are played with No Change – 176.4 play at 88.2 and 192kHz and above are played at 96kHz as set in DSP – Output Format. I can’t find any way to achieve this playback when streaming, which is normally the only way we use MC.

Many thanks for your help, it is much appreciated.

Peter


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bob

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Re: Problem trying to resample files.
« Reply #5 on: May 14, 2013, 03:53:34 pm »

Hi Peter,
There currently isn't a way to achieve that level of granularity with DLNA.
In general, DLNA renderers don't properly report exactly what sample rates, bit rates, etc that they support. In fact when playing wave files, there currently isn't a way for them to do so. The "specified output format" means to convert EVERYTHING to that output format. The "when necessary" option only handles different codecs, not sample rates, etc.

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Peter_RN

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Re: Problem trying to resample files.
« Reply #6 on: May 15, 2013, 06:37:53 am »

Hi Bob

Ah I see; that makes the meaning of each setting crystal clear, thank you.

With regard to your explanation regarding DLNA renderers and how they do (or more likely do not) report what sample and bitrates etc they support. Would it not be possible to bypass such requirements altogether by having a setting in Media Server that allowed a user to set a maximum sample rate, to be set according to their particular renderers capability, and for MC to automatically resample all rates above that?

I have used a program that does just that but unfortunately MC out-performs the rest of that program in just about every other feature IMHO.

I hope my general ignorance of how you go about writing such an addition to a program isn’t making me look too foolish – it seems a reasonable suggestion to me.  ;D

Thanks again for you help, it really is appreciated.

Peter
   
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bob

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Re: Problem trying to resample files.
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2013, 10:04:20 am »

Hi Peter,
Having a maximum sample rate setting would be an improvement, it's not likely to be foolproof though, I've seen devices (the WD comes to mind) that can play different sample rates based on the bit depth and selected file format.
The format of the options in DLNA was designed to keep the complexity down as much a possible. It's already using DSP studio to do what it does (sample rate conversion and volume leveling) but there's a disagreement here over whether exposing all of the DSP studio controls is the "right thing to do".
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Peter_RN

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Re: Problem trying to resample files.
« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2013, 11:38:06 am »

Hi Bob

Well, sound quality is king of course and only you guys can decide how much you could or should expose the DSP studio controls. Personally I only use the output format part of DSP studio as I prefer to interfere as little as possible with the signal, this is probably just down to my lack of understanding – I just want to listen to my music at the best quality I can.

I’m actually very happy with the sound I have now, I will simply remove the high sample rate files from the library and this will prevent the music suddenly stopping when one of these files is encountered.

I won’t bother you further; your help has been invaluable, thanks again.

All the best to you all at J River.

Peter
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