INTERACT FORUM

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: [1] 2   Go Down

Author Topic: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data  (Read 37617 times)

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« on: September 02, 2015, 09:46:05 am »

I'm trying to get the program "XMLTVDB" (version 1.0.1) to work to add Season Numbers to the xmltv.xml data coming from mc2xml (Micosoft Rovi or Schedules Direct).

The program is supposed to monitor the (EPG data) file "xmltv.xml" for updates and when an update is detected it goes out and looks for additional EPG data (such as Season Number and Episode Number) and then creates a new file named "xmltv.enhanced.xml" which would then be imported into JRiver MC.

The XMLTVDB program has not been in development since 2012. It looks like it uses the source "ForTheRecord" to collect data from. However the FTR website is no longer functional. The code uses "http://FTR:49943". This is deadend from what I can tell.

There is another XMLTVDB program (version 1.1.1) that uses "ForTheLibrary", however this version of the program does not have folder monitoring so it doesn't appear to be of any use.

When I run the XMLTVDB program, it appears to detect the changing xmltv.xml file, but then it does not create xmltv.enhanced.xml file. I think the data source of FTR is no good. If anyone has this working - where is the enhanced data coming from?

Note the "FTR_WEBSERVICE_URL=http://FTR:4993".  Is this the same as your (working) program?


Thanks.
Logged

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data?
« Reply #1 on: September 02, 2015, 05:06:34 pm »

This is from RammingSpeed:
 (I hope you don't mind my moving/copying your post)
Quote
I got XMLTVDB working and here are a list of things to look out for.
1.) Use Java 7 (6 won't work, didn't try 8 )
2.) Make sure you are using the latest paid version of XMLTVDB mc2xml.  There was a previous release that worked with Rovi, but didn't handle ampersands correctly in the XML.
3.) review the "XMLTVDB.properties" file and change settings correctly.  There is documentation in the file
4.) If possible set up EXCLUDED_CATEGORIES as it will reduce the amount of lookups and time to complete.
5.) Consider setting "HTTP_REQUEST_RETRIES=" to a smaller number
6.) If you need to iterate testing, change the timestamp on your XML file by re-saving it.  XMLTVDB will pick that up as a new file.

Note that it takes a long time to complete, so be patient once it starts.  You'll see lots of errors in the window.  As long as it keeps running, everything is working.

I'm using java 8. I'm not using the "paid" version of mc2xml because I'm using the "paid" Schedules Direct as my data provider (not Rovi). Perhaps this is an issue.

So, how do you know if it's running?
I have no "cmd window" to view the program while its running.

I just know it's not creating the "xmltv.enhanced.xml" file. But I'm not sure why (although I think the link to use the "FTR" website may be the issue).
Logged

RoderickGI

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 8186
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data?
« Reply #2 on: September 03, 2015, 12:09:06 am »

09/01/2015 12:04:12 PM DEBUG   ONLY_LOOKUP_SCHEDULED_SHOWS = true

For a start, set the option for this line to false. You aren't (can't any more) using integration with ForTheRecord, so XMLTVDB can't look up what you have scheduled.
Code: [Select]
#Set to true to only lookup shows that you have scheduled to record in ForTheRecord. (Recommended true)
ONLY_LOOKUP_SCHEDULED_SHOWS=false

I would also recommend that you comment out the line referring to ForTheRecord.
Code: [Select]
#The URL for 4TR's web services. Default port is 49943
#For basic authentication, use http://username:password@FTRSERVER:49943
#FTR_WEBSERVICE_URL=http://FTR:49943

ForTheRecord and ForTheLibrary also referred to in the description of XMLTVDB were basically the same thing I believe, or components of a solution set. Now defunct, they have morphed into ArgusTV I think. There are lots of references to ForTheRecord in ArgusTV forum posts. I can't really tell if there was just a renaming, or ForTheRecord was just used by ArgusTV at some stage.

Note that I haven't tested this myself, but it just makes sense. You want to look up all programs that are in the XMLTV file on TheTVDB site.
Logged
What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

RoderickGI

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 8186
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data?
« Reply #3 on: September 03, 2015, 01:09:42 am »

I did a test run using one of my old IceTV XMLTV source files, just to see if it would work. With the above option set to False, XMLTVDB ran fine.

My source XMLTV files was 3,139KB, and the output file was 3,497KB, so quite a bit of data was added. Checking through the output, the first thing I noted was that it formatted the output file better than the original IceTV file, so that it was now readable using Notepad. The source didn't have line breaks and I had to view it in Explorer. Yuck. Notepad is much easier, particularly when searching for fields.

It seemed to do a pretty good job of finding the Season and Episode numbers for all well known America TV shows, where the source file had both the <title> and <sub-title> fields included. It wrote the results to the output file in xmltv_ns format. For local Australian shows it didn't work very well, and for any that didn't have the <sub-title> field it didn't work at all, that I could see. I didn't check if it did any fuzzy lookups where names weren't a perfect match. I believe some of the tools written for ArgusTV and other products can do fuzzy lookups. At least some of the descriptions imply that, such as for "UltraXMLTV Enhancer", which also seems to be a dead product.

I used version 1.0.1 of XMLTVDB. It used 1% to 3% of CPU, mostly just 1%. It ran 18 threads, downloaded at around 25KB/s, and cached over 1100 files during the process. I used Windows Task Manager and Resource Monitor to watch all that. Theoretically you should be able to have the Java Console open when you run any Java program, and you can watch what it is doing in there as well. I didn't this time.

The log included the lines below.

09/03/2015 03:29:49 PM NOTICE  Total: 1190 successful lookups, 893 failed lookups.
09/03/2015 03:29:49 PM NOTICE  Of 4112 total programs, 623 unique series were looked up.
09/03/2015 03:29:49 PM NOTICE  Performed 1323 total TheTVDB.com queries (11.87 MB of data), and 3185 locally cached TVDB.com queries

All that took about 10 minutes to run.

So I guess XMLTVDB would work as a method of adding Season and Episode numbers to an XMLTV file that lacked them. I couldn't find any independent tool that was still being supported, which would have been better. But it works, for now. As long as TheTVDB doesn't change its API, which apparently it hasn't for quite a while.
 
Logged
What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data?
« Reply #4 on: September 03, 2015, 05:14:09 am »

Thanks again for help.

I commented out "FTR" (I thought that FTR was the source of the enhanced data.) - So the program instruction to look for enhanced data at TVDB must be in the java code. I don't see any reference to TVDB.com in the xmltvdb.properties/settings. I know nothing about java code.

I changed the "true" to "false".

I'm still ending with the "DEBUG   LISTENER: Skipping Event ENTRY_MODIFY. File is: xmltv.xml".

I'll try again with the Java Console open.

When you run the program, are you getting a new file called "xmtlv.enhanced.xml"?

 I think I am the only one who cares about getting Season Numbers. Maybe I just need to convert my TV series database from Season Number to Season Year and move on.
Logged

RoderickGI

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 8186
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data?
« Reply #5 on: September 03, 2015, 05:53:26 am »

FTR was a TV recording application, long gone now. So XMLTVDB was trying to check it to see what was on the recording schedule, and then only check TheTVDB for those programs, as a way of reducing load on TheTVDB.

Yep, I get a nicely enhanced xmtlv.enhanced.xml file.

The last part of my log is;

09/03/2015 03:29:49 PM NOTICE  Performed 1323 total TheTVDB.com queries (11.87 MB of data), and 3185 locally cached TVDB.com queries
09/03/2015 03:29:49 PM NOTICE  --------------------------------------------DONE PROCESSING XMLTV FILE--------------------------------------------
09/03/2015 03:29:49 PM DEBUG   Not sending e-mail notification because it is disabled in config file.
09/03/2015 03:29:49 PM DEBUG   LISTENER: Skipping Event ENTRY_MODIFY. File is: icetv.xml
09/03/2015 03:29:51 PM NOTICE  LISTENER: Processing xml file: xmltv.enhanced.xml
09/03/2015 03:29:56 PM INFO    Logger has been initialized after a reset
09/03/2015 03:29:56 PM NOTICE  Processing: F:\Junk\MC\XMLTV\xmltv.enhanced.xml

As you can see in the last line, it tries to process the enhanced file, because I put the enhanced file in the same location as the input file. If I hadn't done that I think the log would have ended at the bolded line, which is XMLTVDB looking at the input file a second time, seeing it is the same as last time, and that is probably when it renames it to "icetv.xml.old", which is the file left in my input directory. So my log would end with the same line yours did.

If you aren't getting the output file, check your directory specifications carefully. Make very sure that your "XMLTVDB.properties" file doesn't have a .txt extension on it, hidden or visible. Also, make sure that it is saved in UTF-8 format, and not ANSI, using the File/Save As menu item in Notepad.

I think other people care, a lot, but perhaps not as many MC users as Kodi, ArgusTV, NextPVR, etc. users. The forums are full of people trying to get and improve EPG data. If you change to using Year instead of Season number, somewhere down the track it will bite you, and all you records will be wrong in MC. I would persist with XMLTVDB, or use EPG Collector to do the same thing, if XMLTVDB won't work for you.

PS: I'm attaching a text version of my "XMLTVDB.properties" for you to compare. Note the full directory specifications, which I have now changed to separate Input and Output locations.
Logged
What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data?
« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2015, 10:39:30 am »

check your directory specifications carefully. Make very sure that your "XMLTVDB.properties" file doesn't have a .txt extension on it, hidden or visible. Also, make sure that it is saved in UTF-8 format, and not ANSI, using the File/Save As menu item in Notepad.

Thanks! It's running now. I was saving in ANSI (didn't even notice there was a choice).

Thanks again RoderickGI and rammingSpeed.
Logged

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data?
« Reply #7 on: September 03, 2015, 02:50:18 pm »

Sorry, I see you have this resolved, but I am also using it.  I ended up creating a batch file that would kill the application (by deleting the file mentioned in the folder the .jar file is running in), did a loopback ping (just to delay the net command), and then runs the .jar file. 

I found that if I just left it running all the time, it would eventually close (possible crash?) after a couple weeks.  Now that I am running a fresh copy every night, it works fine.  I just created a windows task to call the batch file.  Then I run MC2XML a while later, and then kill the .jar file again.

Been running like this since July I think, and it works great.
Logged

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data?
« Reply #8 on: September 03, 2015, 03:36:21 pm »

Thanks for the additional info. I'll keep an eye on it and watch to see if it crashes after a couple of days or week.
I currently have it setup in Task Manager to run on startup (then it stays running, monitoring the mc2xml file for a change). It could probably be set up in task manager to run the mc2xml.exe file first (per schedule) then run the jar file, then shut down. For now, I'll just leave it running and see how it does.

Musicman are you in USA, and are you OTA or Cable card?
Logged

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data?
« Reply #9 on: September 03, 2015, 03:38:11 pm »

I am in the USA.  I have 4 tuners that are OTA, and 6 tuners that are cable card.  I use stacking to match up the OTA with the cablecard, and set it to prefer the OTA if available (on all but one channel - ABC - where the OTA has some minor quality issues).
Logged

RoderickGI

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 8186
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data?
« Reply #10 on: September 03, 2015, 06:17:01 pm »

Good to hear you got it working. The UTF-8 issue was listed as an issue on the XMLTVDB source site, and there is another version that fixes that requirement attached to a comment. I didn't download it but it might be a good idea, to avoid future issues, particularly as that source site is going to be archived next year. The program and fix may not be available after that happens. See https://code.google.com/p/xmltvdb/issues/detail?id=1
EDIT: I have now downloaded the fix, but not tested it yet.

You highlighted the wrong line, and missed the most important one!

Yaobing talked about importing "onscreen" Season and Episode format data, but I'm not sure if it was implemented, as it can be in any format. It looks like the XMLTVDB author has chosen the logical format though. Anyway, he has included the xmltv_ns format, which MC does read correctly.

    <episode-num system="xmltv_ns">7.18.0/0</episode-num>
    <episode-num system="onscreen">S08E19</episode-num>


I ended up creating a batch file <snip> did a loopback ping (just to delay the net command), <snip>

A TIMEOUT command would be more reliable than using ping. See http://www.robvanderwoude.com/wait.php
But either works I guess.
Logged
What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data? [solved]
« Reply #11 on: September 05, 2015, 06:37:31 am »

I have the fix download now. Thanks.

I don't know which line is used by MC (Onscreen or xmltv_ns) but I am getting Season Number now when XMLTVDB runs.

I'm having some trouble getting XMLTVDB in Task Scheduler to reliably run. Sometimes the XMLTVDB program doesn't want to run when MC2XML changes. Sometimes if I run the program manually the Command-prompt window will display showing XMLTV running, but XMLTVDB only runs a few lines of code then sits idle. Maybe I'm not waiting long enough - but seems like its frozen so I just close the window.

Is there a way to force the DOS/Command-Prompt window to open/show so I can see what the program is doing? I have Java Console set to "show" and the checkbox for "hidden" in Task Scheduler is unchecked.
Logged

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data? [solved]
« Reply #12 on: September 05, 2015, 11:27:49 am »

what command are you using to launch the .jar file?
Logged

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data? [solved]
« Reply #13 on: September 05, 2015, 11:46:52 am »

In Task Scheduler, the Action is this: "C:\Program Files (x86)\Java\jre1.8.0_51\bin\java.exe" -jar "C:\mc2xml\xmltvdb.jar"

The xmltvdb folder is a subfolder of mc2xml in the root of C:. The XMLTVDB program ran on 9/3, but mc2xml has updated twice since then and XMLTVDB has not run again.
I've been checking security permissions and making sure the virus scanner was not blocking anything.

I can edit the mc2xml file and then "save as" to change the file date and XMLTVDB Logs show that the change was noticed.
Logged

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data? [Almost solved]
« Reply #14 on: September 05, 2015, 06:36:02 pm »

I'm using some batch files.

This one is StartXMLTVDB.bat
Code: [Select]
del "C:\Users\Steven\Documents\XMLTV\DELETE_ME_TO_STOP_XMLTVDB_LISTENER"
ping 127.0.0.1
ping 127.0.0.1
java -jar "C:\Users\Steven\Documents\XMLTVDB v1.0.1\XMLTVDB.jar"

This one is StopXMLTVDB.bat
Code: [Select]
del "C:\Users\Steven\Documents\XMLTV\DELETE_ME_TO_STOP_XMLTVDB_LISTENER"

at 12:50 AM every morning I run the StopXMLTVDB batch file.  Just in case it is running.  This may not need to be done, but I figured it was safer.
At 1:00 AM every morning, I run mc2xml to get the new xmltv file.
At 4:00 AM MC20 imports the new enhanced XML file that was created after the 1:00 AM batch file was run.
At 5:00 AM, I run the StopXMLTVDB.bat file.
Logged

RoderickGI

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 8186
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data? [Almost solved]
« Reply #15 on: September 05, 2015, 08:19:00 pm »

The XMLTVDB logs are pretty good. You should be able to see if it looked at the new files, and whether it tried to enhance the XMLTV file. The current logs are in the root directory of XMLTVDB, while the previous logs are in the "logs" directory.

Also, as shown by Musicman0's timing, XMLTVDB has to be running before mc2xml creates the new XMLTV file in the watched directory.

I found that just changing the "Date modified" of a file in the directory being watched wasn't enough to trigger XMLTVDB. The input file had to be created in the directory XMLTVDB was watching, and it didn't matter if it was exactly the same file that had been processed before, with the same "Date modified". I just deleted the previous file and copied a new version of it from the original I was using for testing. I assume that mc2xml deletes the previous file at some stage, then saves the new one, which should be sufficient to get it to run.

I couldn't get the Java Console to display either. According to the documents at Oracle "It is available for applets running with Java Plug-in and applications running with Java Web Start." So it isn't available for XMLTVDB. I looked at Tracing and Logging, but they don't provide much info either. So stick with the XMLTVDB logs.

I am going to keep XMLTVDB in my kitbag of tools, now that I have had a play with it and know it works. I don't need it while I am using EPG Collector, but you never know what will be needed in the future.  8)
Logged
What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data? [Almost solved]
« Reply #16 on: September 06, 2015, 06:22:22 am »

Thanks for the tips.

XMLTVDB ran okay last night.

I was unable to manually trigger it to run,  and your information about triggering a test run (delete first, then copy same version back to folder) is very useful.

Some times I get a Command Window when I "Run" mc2xml or XMLTVDB from the Task Scheduler. I'm not sure why the Command Window displays sometimes and other times it does not. I don't know if the Java Console and the Command Window I get are the same thing (it may be that the Java Console has never shown itself).

I tried EPG Collector on another computer. The results where not very good (North America terrestrial, OTA).  A number of stations had no EPG data. So in my case, mc2xml + XMLTVDB seems to be the best solution.

UPDATE: XMLTVDB has run successfully two nights now. I'll keep an eye on it but I think it is now setup correctly. Thanks to everyone for the help.
Logged

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: Is anyone running XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data? [Almost solved]
« Reply #17 on: September 06, 2015, 09:45:21 am »

at 12:50 AM every morning I run the StopXMLTVDB batch file.  Just in case it is running.  This may not need to be done, but I figured it was safer.
At 1:00 AM every morning, I run mc2xml to get the new xmltv file.
At 4:00 AM MC20 imports the new enhanced XML file that was created after the 1:00 AM batch file was run.
At 5:00 AM, I run the StopXMLTVDB.bat file.
Realized I made a stupid mistake...at 12:50 AM I actually run the StartXMLTVDB.bat file.  This batch file will kill the XMLTVDB jar file if it is still running (although it shouldn't be running, it is a 'just in case' scenario).

Sorry about the confusion!
Logged

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #18 on: October 21, 2015, 08:31:55 am »

I'm reopening this old thread because I stuck trying to get XMTVDB program to finish running on my laptop (testing) computer.

I run mc2xml (stand-alone version 1.3) on my Server computer and then run the program XMLTVDB to provide Season and Episode Numbers for my recorded TV Shows.

The XMLTVDB program reads the mc2xml created file "xmltv.xml", then runs and creates a new file called "xmltv.enhanced.xm"l which is then imported by JRiver program.
No problems with either program on my Server computer. It runs everyday.

However, on my laptop computer, I have the exact same setup (same programs, folders/files locations, etc.) yet the XMLTVDB program does not complete. It starts running (I can watch it in the Command window) but seems to get stuck a few minutes into the process. it never completes, and doesn't create the "xmltv.enhanced.xml" file.

I have tried changing the settings "HTTP_Connection_Timeout", "HTTP_Read_Request_timeout", HTTP_Request_retries", and "Wait_seconds_between_retries" in the XMLTVDB properties file, but nothing helps. I don't know what the best combination for these settings are - and maybe the issue isn't involed with these settings.

Does anyone have any suggestions or ideas what I should look at to solve this?
Logged

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #19 on: October 21, 2015, 08:49:52 am »

What version of Java is installed?
Logged

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #20 on: October 21, 2015, 10:32:58 am »

1.8.0_60 (the latest).

I just manually ran it (I opened a Command Window and ran "Java -jar xmltvdb.jar", then I moved xmltv.xml out of the monitored folder and back in again to start the process, and it worked). I got the xmltv.enhanced.xml file. So the program works, manually.

I'll need to wait until tomorrow now to see if it works/runs automatically when the next xmltv.xml (from mc2xml program) generates.

The settings I'm using now are:

Max Series lookup = 5 (default)
Max Wait_Hours_For_New_xmltv = 49 (default)
HTTP_Connect_Timeout = 60 (default is 20)
HTTP_Read_Timeout = 60 (default is 60)
HTTP_Request_Retries = 5 (default is 3)
HTTP_Time_Between_Retries = 10 (default is 15).

I don't know if these latest settings changes help or if it was just coincidental.
Logged

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #21 on: October 21, 2015, 12:11:47 pm »

are you running the command "Java -jar xmltvdb.jar" in the folder where XMLTVDB.jar is located?  If not, you may need to specify the path to the jar file.  Put the path in quotes, but not the Java -jar part.  So it would be something like:

java -jar "C:\path to\XMLTVDB.jar"

if there are no spaces in the path then you probably won't need the quotes.
Logged

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #22 on: October 21, 2015, 02:02:04 pm »

When I run the program manually in "Command Prompt" I only change to the directory to where XMLTVDB is located (i.e.in Command prompt window I enter "cd c:\mc2xml/xmltvdb") before entering the command just as I listed it above. No quotes used. The path to the Java program is already stored in Windows "Environment Variables>System Variables". It runs okay manually (at least it did earlier today).

But the program (XMLTVDB) should run automatically whenever it detects a change to the "xmltv.xml" file. This is the part that I think is having trouble. It doesn't seem to want to run on its own. I can see in the Debug log of XMLTVDB that it detects the change in the xmltv.xml file but it doesn't seem to do anything after that.

As I mentioned before, this does work properly on my Server computer using the same XMLTVDB properties. I wonder if this is a Windows permissions issue.
I'm on Win10 x32 and was using the Windows Logon Account instead of Local Account for a little while - but now I'm logging in with local account (as the Windows Account cause networking permission issues and other problems). Maybe there is some left over garbage from the earlier setup.
Logged

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #23 on: October 21, 2015, 02:08:22 pm »

I think I may be confused...you say the .jar file should run automatically when the xml file is updated...this isn't true (unless you have something else going on)...the .jar file has to be started, then once the .xml file changes, the processing will start, but the .jar file won't start unless you tell it to.
Logged

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #24 on: October 21, 2015, 03:57:29 pm »

The XMLTVDB program is always running in the background. Providing you start it manually once or use Task Scheduler to start it whenever your computer starts. I have confirmed that it is running (it just doesn't seem to work consistently on my laptop. It does work consistently on my Server computer without any action from me).

From XMLTVDB website https://code.google.com/p/xmltvdb/wiki/UserGuide

Execution¶

To run this program, execute:
"path\to\java.exe" -jar "path\to\XMLTVDB.jar"

This only has to be done once (recommended to schedule it to be run when the computer starts) and the program will listen infinitely for new XMLTV files. You can configure the program by editing the XMLTVDB.properties file that is next to the .jar.

To stop this program, delete the file named DELETE_ME_TO_STOP_XMLTVDB_LISTENER in the listening folder.

Logged

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #25 on: October 21, 2015, 04:00:54 pm »

OK, that makes sense, I thought you were saying that the .jar file would start when a change was done.  If the .jar file is already running, then yes, once a change is made, then it will process the file.

I am not sure why it isn't working on your laptop.  I run it on my server as well, with no issues. 

I would check all of your tasks, and make sure they are created correctly, and also check the times everything runs, perhaps you are starting the .jar file after you get the xml file...
Logged

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #26 on: November 04, 2015, 03:50:29 pm »

UPDATE:

I found that on the laptop, I need to leave the "Command Window" open after the XMLTVDB program runs. If I leave it open, the next day the XMLTVDB will run again without any manual intervention (triggered by the "xmltv.xml" file update) and it works 100% this way.

Oddly, on my other computer (my home Server) I don't need to leave the Command Window open. XMLTVDB just does its thing every time.

So at least it is working on the laptop now. It's been a week or so now and XMLTVDB has run every day (with Command Window open but minimized to taskbar). I can live with that.
Logged

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #27 on: November 04, 2015, 04:03:24 pm »

I was just thinking I needed to come back and post in this thread.  I just discovered today that the new version of MC2XML has a Schedules Direct JSON option.  it appears that this pulls in Season and Episode info, so based on my tests, I will no longer be using XMLTVDB.  Of course if you aren't using SD, then XMLTVDB is still a good option.
Logged

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #28 on: November 04, 2015, 05:00:23 pm »

I have a SD subscription.

How does the JSON part work? Does JRiver need to add some programming/code to use this - or do you just get the latest version of Mc2xml and run it as stand-alone?
Logged

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #29 on: November 04, 2015, 05:12:44 pm »

Yeah, just get the latest version (v1.5), and run it, and select the Schedules Direct JSON version...it will create an XML file just like before, the only difference is that you will no longer need to process is with XMLTVDB.
Logged

RoderickGI

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 8186
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #30 on: November 04, 2015, 06:44:01 pm »

Have you tested it with PercData, which would be the more appropriate source?
Logged
What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #31 on: November 04, 2015, 06:56:36 pm »

this is a schedules direct feature, and not a general feature...SD includes the season and episode info in the json API, so now the mc2xml application can get it and include it in the xmltv file it generates.
Logged

RoderickGI

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 8186
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #32 on: November 04, 2015, 07:22:15 pm »

Yes, I understand. But PercData is just the commercial arm of Schedules Direct, and is intended for use with applications such as MC.

So the same data is available, from the same source, just with different licencing. I was just wondering if mc2xml has the option to select PercData and the JSON API. I think the PercData integration in MC uses mc2xml to download the data. But I'm not in the USA so haven't used it. . .

I just looked at the mc2xml site and there is no mention of PercData, so maybe not. Then again, didn't someone report getting Season and Episode data via PercData and while back? If so, no need for the JSON API, or it is already being used. But Yaobing said no, he is using a SOAP call to initialise the connection, and then . . . something else to get the data.

Ah, here: http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=100757.msg699403#msg699403
Logged
What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data - How to get it to work?
« Reply #33 on: November 05, 2015, 07:25:43 am »

I tested PercData with their free 7-day trial, and the data was the same, or as good, as I was getting with Schedules Direct. As you know, SD is not supposed to be used with JRiver according to the license, so a JRiver user would need to use PercData to be correct/legal.

However, the EPG data from PercData still did not contain all the correct Season/Episode numbers for my TV recordings. Some where correct and some where wrong. For example, I recorded two episodes of "the Big Bang Theory" back-to-back on the same channel, and one had correct Season "number" and the other had Season "year". That is why I went back to using XMLTVDB.

Now with this news of mc2xml ver1.5 and JSON, I will look into testing that.

UPDATE: I installed mc2xml (version 1.5) today and selected the "Schedules Direct JSON" data source in the popup. Then I ran the program and downloaded a new xmltv.xml file. 

Looking at this file (for the series: Big Bang Theory, episode: The Spock Resonance) I see there are two entries now related to "episode number", there is "episode-num system= dd-progid > EP00931182.021" and there is a "episode-num system="xmltv_ns" >8.6.  NOTE: that this show is Season 9 episode 7 (I know that the season and episode counting starts at "0" for season or episode #1, hopefully MC does too).
I suppose I will find out tomorrow if the recording scheduled for tonight will have correct Season and Episode numbers.

Thanks for bringing this to my attention!
Logged

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« Reply #34 on: November 05, 2015, 11:43:53 am »

Yeah, MC interprets the 8.6 in the xmltv_ns as season 9 episode 7.
Logged

RoderickGI

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 8186
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« Reply #35 on: November 05, 2015, 03:58:06 pm »

It is strange that you got bad Season data from PercData as it is exactly the same data as SD. Perhaps it was a one off glitch, or at least the sort of thing could be fixed by telling PercData about it.

In the post I linked to Yaobing said he would have to figure out if he could use the JSON calls to get more metadata, such as Season and Episode numbers. Elsewhere he had said he was surprised that you were getting any Season and Episode data, because either he wasn't requesting it or it wasn't supposed to be in there. So, MC may need to use JSON calls to get quality metadata, and that may be the fix.

Anyway, I just raised PercData because that is the correct source to use. If I evangelise for those guys, maybe they will add Australian data to their system!  ;D :D
Logged
What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« Reply #36 on: November 06, 2015, 05:00:19 am »

It is strange that you got bad Season data from PercData as it is exactly the same data as SD. Perhaps it was a one off glitch, or at least the sort of thing could be fixed by telling PercData about it.

In the post I linked to Yaobing said he would have to figure out if he could use the JSON calls to get more metadata, such as Season and Episode numbers. Elsewhere he had said he was surprised that you were getting any Season and Episode data, because either he wasn't requesting it or it wasn't supposed to be in there. So, MC may need to use JSON calls to get quality metadata, and that may be the fix.

Anyway, I just raised PercData because that is the correct source to use. If I evangelise for those guys, maybe they will add Australian data to their system!  ;D :D


I get bad Season and Episode "Numbers" using Schedules Direct data too. The problem is that a lot of the Season "Numbers" come in as Season "Year". That's why I started using XMLTVDB.

Hopefully, the new mc2xml (ver 1.5) using  the new Schedules Direct "JSON version" will - or I'll just keep using mc2xml with XMLTVBD.
Logged

imeric

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1476
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« Reply #37 on: January 17, 2016, 09:09:03 pm »

I'm getting the following error trying to use xmltvdb:

The reference to entity "w" must end with the ';' delimiter

does anybody know why?
thx
Logged

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« Reply #38 on: January 17, 2016, 11:00:01 pm »

Did you change the config file?  Perhaps something in there?
Logged

RoderickGI

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 8186
Logged
What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

imeric

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1476
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« Reply #40 on: January 18, 2016, 08:05:22 am »

I just tried this morning and I still get the following error

Code: [Select]
01/18/2016 08:55:22 AM INFO    Logger has been initialized after a reset
01/18/2016 08:55:22 AM NOTICE  Processing: M:\mc2xml_OTA\xmltv.xml
01/18/2016 08:55:22 AM ERROR   Error processing xml file: org.jdom.input.JDOMParseException: Error on line 304 of document file:/M:/XMLTVDB%20v1.0.1/xmltvs/xmltv.xml: The reference to entity "w" must end with the ';' delimiter.
                                   org.jdom.input.JDOMParseException: Error on line 304 of document file:/M:/XMLTVDB%20v1.0.1/xmltvs/xmltv.xml: The reference to entity "w" must end with the ';' delimiter.
                                   org.jdom.input.SAXBuilder.build(SAXBuilder.java:530)
                                   org.jdom.input.SAXBuilder.build(SAXBuilder.java:905)
                                   org.jdom.input.SAXBuilder.build(SAXBuilder.java:884)
                                   xmltvdb.xmltvdb.processXMLTVFile(xmltvdb.java:301)
                                   xmltvdb.xmltvdb.access$100(xmltvdb.java:67)
                                   xmltvdb.xmltvdb$1.onEvent(xmltvdb.java:178)
                                   btv.folderwatcher.FolderWatcher.run(FolderWatchers.java:79)
                                   java.util.concurrent.Executors$RunnableAdapter.call(Unknown Source)
                                   java.util.concurrent.FutureTask.run(Unknown Source)
                                   java.util.concurrent.ThreadPoolExecutor.runWorker(Unknown Source)
                                   java.util.concurrent.ThreadPoolExecutor$Worker.run(Unknown Source)
                                   java.lang.Thread.run(Unknown Source)
                                   
01/18/2016 08:55:22 AM NOTICE  --------------------------------------------DONE PROCESSING XMLTV FILE--------------------------------------------
01/18/2016 08:55:22 AM DEBUG   Not sending e-mail notification because it is disabled in config file.
01/18/2016 08:55:22 AM DEBUG   LISTENER: Skipping Event ENTRY_MODIFY. File is: xmltv.xml

And you will find my properties file attached.

Help Please thx.
Logged

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« Reply #41 on: January 18, 2016, 09:01:59 am »

It looks like it is an error in the actual XML file.  Have you been trying on the same XML file, or have you been downloading a new one?  I would try to get a new XML file to process.

Also, if I remember, it requires Java 1.6 or higher, what version of Java is on your system?
Logged

CountryBumkin

  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« Reply #42 on: January 18, 2016, 09:19:18 am »

It's Java 7 or higher, so this should not be a problem on any current Windows OS.

Your XMLTVDB properties file looks fine.

Once you have the XMLTVDB program installed, you can manually run it by opening a Command Prompt Window, then type cd C:\mc2xml (or wherever it is located) Java -Jar xmltvdb.jar
Logged

muzicman0

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1239
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« Reply #43 on: January 18, 2016, 09:42:41 am »

Java is not installed by default in Windows, so depending on when Java was installed, it may be an issue.  it is certainly worth checking.
Logged

imeric

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1476
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« Reply #44 on: January 18, 2016, 10:26:55 am »

Installed latest Java update (8.1 rel66)
It also uninstalled 8.1 rel51
rebooted.  Tried again and it worked!

It's doing its thing now will post back on results.  A good old reboot always seems to fix things :)
ANyway to add other languages in the search criteria in the properties file?

thx
Logged

imeric

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1476
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« Reply #45 on: January 18, 2016, 10:41:39 am »

Looks like TVDB is offline again.? Started working but then stopped. DOn'T get anything either form their web page..
Logged

RoderickGI

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 8186
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« Reply #46 on: January 18, 2016, 03:20:37 pm »

It doesn't look like http://thetvdb.com/ was planned to be down. But they may still be having issues after the recent maintenance.

Perhaps check the site before running your next test, so you know it should work? Assuming, of course, that your internet connection is reliable.
Logged
What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

imeric

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1476
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« Reply #47 on: January 18, 2016, 04:32:58 pm »

Fiber to the Home.  Can't beat that :)

Anyone else experiencing issues? Have you tried running it RoderickGI?
Logged

RoderickGI

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 8186
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« Reply #48 on: January 18, 2016, 05:02:55 pm »

Fiber to the Home.  Can't beat that :)

Anyone else experiencing issues? Have you tried running it RoderickGI?

I dream of fibre. I have 30Mbps download now, and could get 100Mbps for some more $$$s. But I only have 1Mbps upload, and the best I can buy is 2 to 2.5Mbps. Bummer.

I ran XMLTVDB successfully some time back. See my posts early in this thread.

I would use XMLTVDB myself, but EPG Collector already does the same thing for me.
Logged
What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

imeric

  • MC Beta Team
  • Citizen of the Universe
  • *****
  • Posts: 1476
Re: using XMLTVDB to enhance xmltv.xml data
« Reply #49 on: January 18, 2016, 10:49:26 pm »

Yeah I saw your other posts...Mmm EPG collector..Should I look at that...Oh boy..Getting late, I'm spending WAY TOO much time on this..This is kinda why I'm always reluctent to re-try MC for TV...But now I feel I've gone too far :):)....Might be too late to go back!!
Logged
Pages: [1] 2   Go Up