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Author Topic: Missing features  (Read 3466 times)

dejwi

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Missing features
« on: December 09, 2015, 02:31:55 pm »

Dear JRiver developers,

I'm using your software since version 18. And I always recommend it to my friends and customers (custom home theaters) due to great audio and video features. Today I've got email from you, which claims "Did you know that MC21 has one of the best implementations of television on Windows?". Sorry guys, but what you have is a very, very basic implementation of television, it's miles from best. Here goes the list:

Three missing elements that renders TV in JRiver unusable:
  • lack of support for multiple audio streams. I like watching Euronews which is delivered in Italian, German, English, Russian and French. But I can't watch it, because by default it's delivered in German and I can't change the audio stream in JRiver. I have a PPV channel with Formula 1. It's transmitting two audio streams - one with commentary and second without. I would love to hear only engine roar with all JRiver audio goodness. But I can't - no support for multiple audio streams.
  • bouquets. Typical satellite installation in central Europe use two satellites (Hotbird & Astra) and gives you around 2500 channels. Maneuvering around that without any grouping is a chore. Typical solution is to put channel in several categories (e.g. FreeToAir, English, Music, Radio, Favorites, etc.) so I can quickly find a channel I'm interested in.
  • subtitles. Transmitted in data stream or pulled out from teletext.

A feature that should be there, but aren't yet:
-pulling EPG from data streams. Every TV and STB can do that, but in JRiver I have to load an XML file, that I have to find on the internet...

Icing on the cake:
  • subtitles downloaded from net
  • watching/recording multiple channels on the same transponder
  • transmitting tv channel over network & conversion on the go (eg. .TS to .MP4)
  • softCAMs
  • storable teletext
  • channel's icons

Correct me if I'm wrong. Make me happy saying that these features are already in the software or will be in next two months. But till that time don't claim "best implementations of television on Windows". It's not. Yet.

Best regards,
David

Ps. I'm using a DVB-T and DVB-S cards in windows 10 PC. I was comparing your functionalities to DVB Viewer on PC, set top boxes using Linux solutions (e.g. dreambox) and my standard living room TV (DVB-S/C/T).
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imugli

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Re: Missing features
« Reply #1 on: December 09, 2015, 03:06:48 pm »

Quote
watching/recording multiple channels on the same transponder
People (including myself) have been asking for this for a while now. I agree it would be nice to have this functionality.

Quote
transmitting tv channel over network & conversion on the go (eg. .TS to .MP4)
Already can and it works well. Use the PC with the tuners as a Library server, then connect the machine you want to stream to to that library. Alternatively, JRemote does streaming to devices.

Quote
subtitles. Transmitted in data stream or pulled out from teletext.
I agree this is important, if only for accessibility reasons

Quote
channel's icons
I'm pretty sure they're working on this at the moment ;-)

RoderickGI

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Re: Missing features
« Reply #2 on: December 09, 2015, 11:11:18 pm »

Lack of support for multiple audio streams.
MC certainly supports multiple audio streams, and selection of the stream you want, when multiple streams are available on a DVD or Blu-ray. I can't test your situation because I don't have any TV channels that support multiple audio streams. This stream selection capability may not work with TV broadcasts.

You can select from available audio streams using the OSD (On Screen Display) or the Right Click menu when the program is playing. See that attached images.

The stream that you select will be saved in the "Playback Info" tag. You may even be able to use a tagging rule on a Recording Rule to set the audio stream.

Bouquets.
This is supported now. It requires a little bit of work to set up, but the capability you want is fully supported. Imugli split the question out to a new thread, so I have described how to do it over there: http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=101884.0

Subtitles. Transmitted in data stream or pulled out from teletext.
I suspect that the America format of Closed Captions is supported, but I can't confirm that as I'm in Australia. The European and Australian format that uses teletext data in television broadcasts isn't supported yet, but I believe it is still on Yaobing's list of things to do. I suspect that a bunch more Europeans need to ask for it before it will get some priority.

A feature that should be there, but aren't yet:
-pulling EPG from data streams. Every TV and STB can do that, but in JRiver I have to load an XML file, that I have to find on the internet...
MC can pull down EPG data from ATSC broadcasts in the USA. Covering the rest of the world is also still on the list.

In Australia I use EPG Collector to pull EPG data from the DVB-T stream. It works very well, can use satellite, cable and terrestrial. I know there are users in the Netherlands, UK, and some other parts of Europe. It is worth investigating for your needs. It isn't perfect, but provides whatever data is available in the stream. I am working with the developer at the moment to improve the output of its metadata lookup feature, which finds Season and Episode numbers of TV Series when it is not included in the stream, in addition to other metadata, by looking up TheTVDB and TMDB.

Of course if you are in a location supported by Microsoft EPG data, the mc2xml version built into MC will downloads the EPG data for you and loads it into MC, fully automatically (once configured) and all free of charge. No need to go looking up other internet sources. Note that the Microsoft EPG data is now provided by Rovi, at least in the USA, and probably other locations, but I don't know if Microsoft has rolled that change out to all location yet.


Subtitles downloaded from net
Provided by the third party Subtitle Downloader plug-in. I haven't implemented that one yet though, so can't comment on how good it is. Read the thread.

Watching/recording multiple channels on the same transponder
Still a possibility I believe, but not a priority. Probably still on the list. I just bought a four tuner card and haven't needed to worry about running out of tuners . . . so far.

Transmitting tv channel over network & conversion on the go (eg. .TS to .MP4)
Answered by Imugli. Already there. Some limitations.

SoftCAMs
No idea. Probably not.

Storable teletext
MC doesn't use teletext information at all as far as I know. So no.

Channel's icons
Answered by Imugli. Watch the build threads of the next few releases.
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What specific version of MC you are running:MC27.0.27 @ Oct 27, 2020 and updating regularly Jim!                        MC Release Notes: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Release_Notes
What OS(s) and Version you are running:     Windows 10 Pro 64bit Version 2004 (OS Build 19041.572).
The JRMark score of the PC with an issue:    JRMark (version 26.0.52 64 bit): 3419
Important relevant info about your environment:     
  Using the HTPC as a MC Server & a Workstation as a MC Client plus some DLNA clients.
  Running JRiver for Android, JRemote2, Gizmo, & MO 4Media on a Sony Xperia XZ Premium Android 9.
  Playing video out to a Sony 65" TV connected via HDMI, playing digital audio out via motherboard sound card, PCIe TV tuner

dejwi

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Re: Missing features
« Reply #3 on: December 10, 2015, 01:40:51 pm »

ATSC is a USA, Canada & Mexico standard for terrestial and cable TV.


For DVB which covers most of the (terrestial / cable) world +all satellite (inc. Dish Network and Globecast in the U.S. and Bell TV in Canada) JRiver doesn't handle multiple audio streams, teletext subtitles or EPG data (several standards).

The first feature to implement should be multiple audio streams on DVB standard. Here in Europe we use a lot of that - too many languages :)

This is Euronews channel data from kingofsat.net - http://en.kingofsat.net/find.php?question=euronews&Submit=Zap. There are 13 audio streams transmitted  Hotbird:
2231 fra
2232 eng
2233 ger
2234 ita
2235 esp
2236 por
2237 rus
2238 ara
2239 tur
2240 far
2241 ukr
2242 gre
2243 hun

JRiver sees and plays the first one. Enumerating available audio streams & switching between them shouldn't take more than few hours to implement... my guess. :)
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imeric

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Re: Missing features
« Reply #4 on: December 10, 2015, 08:15:06 pm »

Answered by Imugli. Watch the build threads of the next few releases.
RoderickGI Where can we see the thread of new releases??
Or are you referring to release notes..
I sure would LOVE to know more about what the priority list is for JRiver development and fixes...

thx
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imugli

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Re: Missing features
« Reply #5 on: December 10, 2015, 10:19:03 pm »

RoderickGI Where can we see the thread of new releases??
Or are you referring to release notes..
I sure would LOVE to know more about what the priority list is for JRiver development and fixes...

thx

Latest release available here - http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=101903.0 :-)

There isn't a public list or priorities, but it's fair to say TV is getting a lot of attention at the moment.

imeric

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Re: Missing features
« Reply #6 on: December 16, 2015, 09:57:27 am »

That's what I meant by release notes...I read these religiously and keep hoping my 2-3 issues pending are there so that I can ditch Sage  ;)
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