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[PCH1155]

 ?
Folks, I've really tried hard to fix this issue on my own. I've read dozens of entries in Interact, and tried many of the remedies suggested to similar issues with no luck. I am simply trying to get MC22 to work across DLNA to allow my Oppo-105D to be a renderer. My current setup is:
Laptop/Win 10/MC22(with WiFi Android/Gizmo on phone)  >  USB cable  > Oppo-105D  > HDMI cable  >  Marantz SR5010 AVR  > Speakers

This all works fine, but wanted to move to DLNA to allow addition of a better server, add NAS, etc. Both the Oppo and Marantz AVR show up in Windows 10 as connected and working properly (as they also do on their own respective GUI menus). The Oppo and/or the Marantz AVR can both be used as DNLA renderers according to their manuals. Everything but the Android/Gizmo unit is hard-wired on my Ethernet in a Windows Home Group.

In MC22, I cannot see either the Oppo or the Marantz AVR units. I have tried everything I can think of to make them appear in the tree next to Player (Playing Now).  I have gone into the Media Network menu many times and tried to establish them as renderers, but nothing appears. Many boots and reboots – nothing.
I have disabled the Firewalls, Win Defender, etc….- Nothing.
Things I’ve noticed:
-   I tried to turn off “Windows Media Sharing Services”, but noticed that is wasn’t there in the list of Services (gone?)
-   In the Windows Sound Playback menu, it shows the Oppo proprietary ASIO driver for USB output, and the old (disabled) Realtek driver that comes with the laptop. Is there a JRiver sound driver (virtual sound card) that should appear (or be used), or is this unrelated to DLNA output?
-   I can go through the Oppo GUI menu and grab songs, playlists, etc. and play them through the Oppo, so it sees the PC and library folders across the network.
Your help is greatly appreciated…

[JimH]

Some devices work in one direction, but not the other.  Please try a search for other Oppo threads here.

[PCH1155]

I'm thinking that the Oppo 105D not working or recognizing MC is not really the problem. There are many Oppo threads I've read that show that many folks have got it to work just fine and I think I've tried most of what they show as applicable. Besides, shouldn't MC also see the Marantz AVR as another possible renderer? It's not seeing either unit. I'm thinking that there is some setting withing MC that I'm not configuring properly

[JimH]

Try powering down your entire network and all the devices on it and then powering it back up.

[amsco15]

Try running AndrewFG's Whitebear "Digital Media Renderer Analyzer."  Click the link on his signature.  Very helpful with troubleshooting these issues.  Also, I sometimes have to shut down MC and restart a couple times before my renderer is picked up by MC.  Never have to do this more than twice.  I have a PS Audio Bridge II renderer (it can be considered a little finicky).

[blgentry]

Laptop/Win 10/MC22(with WiFi Android/Gizmo on phone)  >  USB cable  > Oppo-105D  > HDMI cable  >  Marantz SR5010 AVR  > Speakers

I would guess that with the Oppo connected via USB, MC might not see it as both a USB audio device *and* a DLNA renderer.  I'm assuming that you have Media Network enabled, since you are successfully using Gizmo.

This all works fine, but wanted to move to DLNA to allow addition of a better server, add NAS, etc.

You can use NAS with MC without DLNA.  In fact, you shouldn't use the DLNA capabilities of a NAS device to talk to MC at all.  If you decide to use NAS, you should use it as a regular file share to MC.  As for "better server", I'm not sure what DLNA would have to do with that.

I recommend against using DLNA.  If your setup is working correctly and doing what you want via USB, keep using it.  DLNA has many potential issues that USB does not.

Brian.

[RCFlyer]

What are the settings for MC(22) that disable the DLNA feature when using a NAS drive (that has DLNA) that you are speaking about?

[blgentry]

^ Lots of NAS devices speak file sharing protocols *and* DLNA. MC will see (mostly) any DLNA device that's on the network.  So the only way to disable access of MC to the NAS via DLNA is to disable DLNA on the NAS device itself.  If you don't need that feature for some other reason, I think it's best to turn it off.

Or simply ignore it and just use the file sharing to access the files, as if they were on any other hard drive.

Brian.

[PCH1155]

Brian,
Thanks for the response. I think you may be right about MC seeing the Oppo on USB and also as a DLNA renderer, however, I thought you could set up multiple zones to allow it to work both ways. I'm kinda of a newbie to this, so I thought that eventually I'd need a NAS on DLNA so it could be networked from another room, etc.
As for the "better server", I have had a lot of issues with the laptop PC (came loaded with bloatware which took a while to clear, always running other programs in the background, virus software, etc.) I'm looking to get an Intel NUC ID or similar device that would have the OS and MC loaded in SSD, with a separate NAS with HDDs utilized for media files.

Is there any SQ advantage in using a USB to DAC setup vs using ethernet (DLNA) input?
Thanks again for your help
Pat

[PCH1155]

Hey, just to close the loop on this and provide anyone who may need similar info, I finally got everything working great between the MC software and the Oppo 105D as a DLNA renderer. It turns out that it really wasn't a firewall or Windows defender issue, but as Brian had mentioned, the need for separate "zones" within MC to work independently. One zone is PC (with Oppo USB driver) out to Oppo unit (rear asynch DAC), the other zone is disabling Oppo USB driver and enabling JRiver WDM driver with music stream out ethernet DLNA network to Oppo renderer. Both work great now.

One small issue: In DLNA renderer mode, the music track info appears on the Oppo screen (video out), but no album artwork metadata (even though I've activated gracenote in Oppo). Not a big deal, but just curious because when I use the Marantz AV receiver as a DLNA renderer, the metadata album artwork shows up okay.

Many thanks to Brian, Andrew and Jim for all your great support,
Pat

[AndrewFG]

One small issue: In DLNA renderer mode, the music track info appears on the Oppo screen (video out), but no album artwork metadata (even though I've activated gracenote in Oppo). Not a big deal, but just curious because when I use the Marantz AV receiver as a DLNA renderer, the metadata album artwork shows up okay.

This is an Oppo problem. MC is providing the meta data properly as a side payload in the UPNP command calls. But Oppo does not implement such side payload meta data fetching. I.e. they do not comply with the UPNP / DLNA specifications.

What Oppo does instead are two things:

a) if the media contains meta data inline in the stream itself (as opposed to in a side payload) the Oppo tries to display it. It works ok for files on a USB stick or hard disk because the Oppo can random seek to the meta data in the file. But it does not work on streamed media because most inline meta data is at the end of the file, so it can only display it once the track is finished.

b) if the Oppo can find the meta data in GraceNote it tries to display that. However since MC pushes tracks with an URL based on the index number of the track in its library, the Oppo has nothing but a number to lookup in GraceNote, so it fails.

You may want to take this up with Oppo. I have mentioned it to them before, but they did not take any notice. The problem may be that Oppo uses a UPNP software library from a third party supplier, and are probably not able to directly modify the code..

[PCH1155]

Andrew - thanks for the great explanation. I have an inquiry on this into Oppo. Will advise if I hear anything valuable.

Thanks again,
Pat

[stanzani]

Hey, just to close the loop on this and provide anyone who may need similar info, I finally got everything working great between the MC software and the Oppo 105D as a DLNA renderer. It turns out that it really wasn't a firewall or Windows defender issue, but as Brian had mentioned, the need for separate "zones" within MC to work independently. One zone is PC (with Oppo USB driver) out to Oppo unit (rear asynch DAC), the other zone is disabling Oppo USB driver and enabling JRiver WDM driver with music stream out ethernet DLNA network to Oppo renderer. Both work great now.

One small issue: In DLNA renderer mode, the music track info appears on the Oppo screen (video out), but no album artwork metadata (even though I've activated gracenote in Oppo). Not a big deal, but just curious because when I use the Marantz AV receiver as a DLNA renderer, the metadata album artwork shows up okay.

Many thanks to Brian, Andrew and Jim for all your great support,
Pat

Hello Pat
thank you for this post! I am strugglingle for weeks to make the Oppo capable to act as a DLNA renderer with no success. The only feedback I got was "you have network issue" or "other people did this w/o problems"
My setup is different from yours
-  the PC housing the JRiver server is in my dining room, driving a teac UD503. This works fine with ASIO Drivers and the Zone is named 'my house'
- an Oppo BDP-105D in my hobby room which is connected to the same LAN which does not not display as a DLNA Media Renderer among the possible player shown up in JRemote
I understand that I must
- enable WDM according  to https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/WDM_Driver
- create a new zone (say 'Movie Theater') which uses the WDM device as playback device
I then should be able to see the Oppo as DLNA renderer when I connect from (select the zone as)Movie Thater
Right?

Thanks again for moving this issue which made me crazy

[AndrewFG]

Also download the DMRA from my sig. Run it on the same PC as the one you run MC on, and post the results here.

[stanzani]

Thanks.

As expected the check says that the OPPO is not a media renderer in my network

https://www.dropbox.com/s/boq1jcrhi401t23/Screenshot%202017-04-13%2010.26.35.png?dl=0

It is maybe something I should configure in the Oppo itself? I just enabled 'My Network' (sopposedly this hould be enough)

Whith BubbleUpNP I can see all te renderers (sometimes I can the Oppo, sometimes not, this is 'temeprament', which lead me crazy)

[AndrewFG]

Obviously you need to do the basic checks that the Oppo is turned on, has the DLNA feature enabled, and is connected to the LAN. Then you need to check your network configuration. Check that all devices are on the same subnet. Check that all have IP addresses in the same address band that your router is routing. Check that the IP addresses are issued via DHCP. Check that there are no devices using the same IP address. Check that your router is able to route UDP mono cast and UDP multicast datagrams (SSDP discovery). Check that there are no firewalls or AV programs blocking LAN access in general, or for the specific IP addresses being used. If your network topology is not "flat" then make it so. If you have more than one router then remove all but one. Etc.

[stanzani]

Obviously you need to do the basic checks that the Oppo is turned on, has the DLNA feature enabled, and is connected to the LAN. Then you need to check your network configuration. Check that all devices are on the same subnet. Check that all have IP addresses in the same address band that your router is routing.

They are @192.168.1.x

Check that the IP addresses are issued via DHCP.

They are

Check that there are no devices using the same IP address.

This is also OK

Check that your router is able to route UDP mono cast and UDP multicast datagrams (SSDP discovery).

Do not know how to check this ...

Check that there are no firewalls or AV programs blocking LAN access in general, or for the specific IP addresses being used. If your network topology is not "flat" then make it so. If you have more than one router then remove all but one. Etc.

here it is my network topology https://www.dropbox.com/s/r06j33ofecwooq7/Screenshot%202017-04-19%2012.48.11.png?dl=0
a. the WAN enter the ADB2200 modem / router / access point (AP1) / switch . The DHCP is ON. This unut is connected in my hobby room
b. LAN1 of the ADB2200 is connected to a Netgear WNDR-4500 router / access point (AP2) with DHCP OFF. This unit is located in my apartment and is suspicous to be the problem here
c. H3 is a DVB receiver (supposedly it will not hurt)
d. a Chromecast device is in the hobby room and connects to AP1 access point (IP @192.168.1.9)
e. the oppo 105D is connect to LAN4 of ADB220 (it is named as udhcp, do not know why ...)
f.  The JRiver media server is on a PC with a (static) IP address @192.168.1.149
g.  The media file database is located ina QNAP NAS with a (static) IP address @192.168.1.150
d. a Chromecast device is in the main house and connects to AP2 access point (IP @192.168.1.4)

What I see
- I connect an Android smartphone to AP1: Bubble UPnP can see the Oppo 105D renderer (it takes a while but finalle it appears among the suitable renderers), JRemote can't
- Both the JRiver client/server on MEDIA-SERVER PC and JRemote cannot see the Oppo 105D amonge the displayed 'zones'
- I installed a Bubble UPnP server on MEDIA-SERVER PC: during configuration it cannot see Chromecast 192.168.1.9

It looks like the WNDR-4500 is blocking something but I am surprised the Bubble UPnP can still see MEDIA SERVER and Oppo 105 if connected to AP1. Is the any configuration I should consider for the WNDR4500? It is used as a simple AP and switch so I cannot figure out how does it hurt ...
My JRiver settings can be found here https://www.dropbox.com/s/va1wtr5ws3hwn21/Screenshot%202017-04-21%2012.57.10.png?dl=0

Thanks so much for helping me

[AndrewFG]

UPnP uses the SSDP protocol, comprising the two methods below, for its device discovery processes..

1. Devices send a UDP multicast NOTIFY ALIVE message via a reserved upnp multicast IP address and port, and

2. Control Points send a UDP multicast M-SEARCH message via the same reserved upnp multicast address and port, to which the device responds with a UDP mono cast response

The NOTIFY messages are sent by the device every 15 to 30 minutes or so, depending on the device. The M-SEARCH messages are sent by the control point on demand depending on the control point. Different control points use different discovery strategies of either 1. or 2. or both.

All multicast messages carry a hop count limit mechanism (TTL) to prevent the multicasts being routed too far. To avoid so called multicast storms.

So you need to check if your boxes a) are enabled at all to send multicasts, b) in which direction (option 1. multicasts and option 2. multicasts go in opposite directions), and c) if any of the boxes are imposing a hop count limitation. You also need to check that the monocast responses in option 2. are being routed back to the sender.

[stanzani]

So you need to check if your boxes a) are enabled at all to send multicasts, b) in which direction (option 1. multicasts and option 2. multicasts go in opposite directions), and c) if any of the boxes are imposing a hop count limitation. You also need to check that the monocast responses in option 2. are being routed back to the sender.

OK, I am installing wireshark right now.
I cannot find a way to check either a. or b. or c. on the Oppo DMR or JRiver server settings ...

[AndrewFG]

When I mentioned "boxes" I meant the router(s) and the access point(s). With WireShark you can check for NOTIFY and M-SEARCH messages on both sides of the "box". You should see the same messages on both sides..