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[Hollingshead]

I'm sure this info exists, but I have looked and looked and I can't find it. My office PC is using a NUC as a library server and I want to put a playlist on it to use for a party. I thought from one of the answers here that, if I was using the NUC as a server when I made the list, it would show up on the NUC. It doesn't. Is it supposed to, in which case it is a network problem on my end? Or am I supposed to build playlists on the server and then I can run them from another PC? IF so, that's inconvenient for me. Where are playlists stored? Can I just copy the .mpl file to a usb drive and move it to the other PC?

I am having a networking issue with the NUC,  but the library sharing seems to be working fine. But when I search for the NUC on my network, I see many instances of it as a media server, but it doesn't show up as a computer, so I can't export the playlist to it either. I think I know how to fix that networking problem, but I'm not sure it will fix the playlist problem.

Thanks for helping,
Kevin

[RoderickGI]

Playlists will synchronise from your Office PC MC Client back to your NUC MC Server, but you need to have Authentication turned on in the MC Server settings.

So on the NUC go to "Options > Media Network (which will already be turned on) > Authentication". Tick the box and you will be asked for a NUC Username and Password to use. Save that and you are ready to build Playlists on your Office PC, and they will be synchronised back to the NUC.

Note: It takes a little time for a MC Client to sync back to a MC Server, anything from seconds to minutes, so don't shut down the Client until that has happened. If you need to do it quickly, or want to check it works straight away, on your Office PC just find the NUC MC Server Library you are connected to under Playing Now > Playing from..., click on it, and then click the "Sync Changes with Library Server" button. The sync will happen immediately and you will get a confirmation message.

PS: If you don't want to turn on Authentication for any reason, you can Export a Playlist from the MC Client and Import it into the MC Server. The commands are under the File menu. But there are few reasons not to turn on Authentication.

[Hollingshead]

Thanks much. I tried to turn on authentication, but I didn't know what user name/password they wanted. Do I just make one up?

[Hollingshead]

I just turned on authentication and created a username/password. Then went to sync with library server and got

"There was a problem sending changes to the server.

Unknown error, please make sure the server is running and your connection is available."

I solved the networking problem. (Interesting, had to turn on the PNRP Machine Name Publication Server and make it an automatic start.) But that is all working great now. Any ideas on what is upsetting MC?

Thanks again,
Kevin

[~OHM~]

have you rebooted both machines

[RoderickGI]

I thought it had to be an existing Windows Username and Password (Credentials) from the MC Server. But maybe it doesn't. The Wiki isn't clear. Maybe it just requires a restart of MC on both PCs to get it to work. Or a reboot of both.

I use the credentials I use to log on to Windows on the Server, as it is easiest to remember. The password isn't displayed, so no-one can copy it from the Options page. It's not completely secure though as some will say, since I think the password is sent in plain text from the Client to the Server, which is visible using a packet sniffer.

What you are doing by setting up authentication and providing the MC Server Username and Password is giving the Client permission to update files on the Server. Hence, it needs credentials from the Server. You may need to delete the record of the library from the Client and then re-add it to the Client using the Server Access Key, at which time MC will ask again for the Authentication Username and Password.


Interesting solution to the networking issue. Microsoft recently broke the Windows Browser functionality, in version 1703, 1709, and later no doubt. They removed Samba 1.0 from Windows 10 because of security issues, But that is relied upon for some old Network Discovery features. So Network Neighbourhood no longer works in all situations on Windows 10 machines. It shouldn't work at all, but it does on one of my PCs. i.e. My HTPC can see my Workstation in Windows Explorer, but my Workstation can no longer see my HTPC.

You can get around that issue by sharing directories on the target PC, and then using a UNC address in Windows Explorer to look up shares on the target PC. i.e. I can still save files from my Workstation to my HTPC by putting \\HTPC\ into the Windows Explorer address bar.

Your NUC is the Linux version, right? In that case it may still be running a Samba 1.0 service, and may have been elected as the Master Browser, which could be why your solution worked.

I might have to look at turning on PNRP on my PCs, and see if the HTPC reappears in Windows Explorer on my Workstation. Nice hint.

[JimH]

Thanks much. I tried to turn on authentication, but I didn't know what user name/password they wanted. Do I just make one up?

Yes.

[Hollingshead]

Well, that was disappointing. Hadn't rebooted the office PC, just the NUC (Windows 10 NUC, by the way). After I did and clicked on synchronize server, it said that it already had. Ran downstairs and the playlist still wasn't there, Came back to the office and THE PLAYLIST HAD BEEN DELETED FROM THE OFFICE PC. So, yep, they're synchronized.

Fortunately, I had exported the playlist to the NUC already and it is still safely there. But I don't know where to put it so MC will find it and use it. And the authorization says that it is "Read Only" access. How can that help? Is it possible to do what I want, which is to have the NUC act as an MC server, while I rip, update the library and build playlists from my office PC? And, if so, what am I doing wrong? And where do playlists live in MC?

Thanks for the help,
Kevin

[RoderickGI]

Yes.

Thanks, Jim. I'm still learning MC. That was an area I never bothered to try anything other than what worked first go. I probably should change the Username and Password I use to something other than the credentials of a User on the HTPC. Security implications and all.

THE PLAYLIST HAD BEEN DELETED FROM THE OFFICE PC

I cleaned up a bunch of test Playlists yesterday working on my Workstation MC Client, only to find that they didn't delete from the MC Server. So it would seem that Playlist deletes aren't synchronised. I've noticed that before but not been bothered. Deleting them from the MC Server and synchronising got rid of them. Closing the Client and restarting it always loads a fresh copy of the Server Library onto the Client, so anything fixed on the Server will be fixed on the Client.

And where do playlists live in MC?

They live inside the MC Library, and not separately in Playlist files. That is why MC has the Playlist Export/Import functions.

But I don't know where to put it so MC will find it and use it

As you are running Windows on both NUC MC Server and Office PC MC Client, just put the exported Playlist file anywhere visible to the NUC, and then run File > Import Playlist... on the NUC. You will get a file dialogue box to navigate around and find the file to import.

And the authorization says that it is "Read Only" access. How can that help?

There are two separate types of Authentication. The one with the Checkbox is the one you need to set up to allow synchronisation.

I haven't had a need to use the Read Only Authentication, but it is used to allow MC Clients to connect to the MC Server and play media files, but not update the Server Library. You will notice that there is an option to allow Everyone to have Read Only access, which doesn't require a Username and Password. Or you can require a Username and Password so only Clients with those credentials can gain read access to your media files. If you ever plan to access your MC Server from outside your network, it would be a good idea to use one of the methods that require credentials, rather than give Everyone access.

Is it possible to do what I want, which is to have the NUC act as an MC server, while I rip, update the library and build playlists from my office PC? And, if so, what am I doing wrong?

Okay, this is where it gets difficult. A bit of a can of worms actually. Yes the NUC can act as a MC Server.

But there are certain things that a MC Client can't do, that either need to be done on the Server, or you need to get into drive mapping from the Client to the Server and other workarounds.

I can never remember everything that a Client can't do, but it can't;
Move files around using the F6 Rename, Move, & Copy Files function.
Collect Cover Art for storage on the Server, where it needs to be.
Build or edit Views that will be synchronised back to the Server. View changes done on the Client are not synchronised and are lost the next time you restart the MC Client.
Rip CDs directly on the Client to the Server.
Delete Playlists from the Server, apparently, but it can edit them.

Basically, any task that involves saving, moving, renaming files can't be done on the Client, except for changing Tags in the Library, which the Server will then save to the files in its Library.

A search of the forum would probably find a more complete list.

So, what I and many people do is use a local Library on the PC that is normally the MC Client to rip CDs to media files, tag them, collect Cover Art for storage inside the media files or next to the files in the Album directory, rename them, put them in the sub-directory structure I want, and then copy the new sub-directory over to the correct directory on the Server, where the MC Server is watching for new files, and then MC will import those files into the MC Server Library. Then those Library changes will be synchronised back to the Client, next time it is run.

Once the new media files are imported into the MC Server Library, you can connect the MC Client to the MC Server and build Playlists on the Client, which will be synchronised back to the Server.

Simple really. Okay, maybe not so simple

It could be made more complex by using the Office PC running a standalone local Library, with a drive mapped back to the NUC Music directory to rip CDs directly onto the NUC. But that only avoids the copy step, introduces a network mapped drive into the ripping process which could slow the process and cause issues, and is even more confusing than doing it all locally and then copying the result across.


PS: If anyone thinks I am missing something and could be doing it easier, speak up! I don't mind being corrected. 

[Hollingshead]

Wow! Thanks for all that info. I'll need to study it some more to get all that. I did figure out that the import playlist function is the key. I get it now that it doesn't live anyplace distinct. What I'm doing that seems to work is using sync toy to keep my big desktop, where I rip and tag and delete and move tracks, synchronized with the drive attached to the NUC over night. Sync Toy just runs every night and looks for changes and then copies both ways.

Are there pitfalls here I'm not seeing?

And I'm not seeing any authentication except for Read Only. Is it somewhere besides under Media Network in Options?

Thanks again. I do really like JRiver, glad I'm getting a little more proficient.

Kevin

[RoderickGI]

Are there pitfalls here I'm not seeing?

That will work fine as long as you are storing tags and Cover Art inside all files, and have "Update for external changes" set in Auto Import. Well, you would also need the drive naming and directory structure to be the same on both PCs, and all settings related to File Locations. Possibly other settings. Then MC will pick up new or updated files and update its Library when Auto Import runs.

Plenty of people seem to be doing what you are without trouble.

And I'm not seeing any authentication except for Read Only. Is it somewhere besides under Media Network in Options?

Authentication for Library synchronisation is set up on the MC Server, not on the MC Client. When a Client first connects to a Server the user is asked for a Username and Password, if I remember correctly. But that isn't seen as a setting and can't be changed on the Client.



Green is Authentication for Library synchronisation, only shown on a Server. Blue points to the two settings for Read-only Authentication, shown on a Server, but also visible on a Client.

I'm not sure why the Read-only Authentication shows up on the Client. I would have thought it would work the same way as Authentication for Library synchronisation. But I don't use Read-only Authentication so haven't looked into that.

[Hollingshead]

Excellent. Thanks. Both drives are E: and only have the music files. I'll check those server settings.

You've been a very big help. Thanks very much,
Kevin