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Author Topic: IPOD SUPPORT  (Read 45652 times)

SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #50 on: May 28, 2003, 01:27:46 pm »

schwaa,

Your iTunes database file is most likely corrupt. If you do not want to lose your files on iPod, you can try deleting the iTunesDB file from your iPod (DriveLetter\iPod_Control\iTunes\iTunesDB) and then run MC and right click on your drive letter. Select "Rebuild Database from iPod". This should make your files visible again. The downside to this is you will lose your playlists. Also, before you do this, get the Plugin I will post later today (v 9.0.22) because it fixes a bug in this procedure I just came across.

Another plan would be to run iPod updater, reconnect your iPod and then right click on your iPod drive letter and select "Format". This is probably best, but you will lose all your files.

Jeff,

Not a bad suggestion. I do not know if we will do it.

Steve
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dougf

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #51 on: May 28, 2003, 05:53:04 pm »

Steve -
thanks for the help - much appreciated.  I feel stupid, because I see others with tech specs quoting v178, but when I go to the download page, all I get is v175.  I just downloaded/installed a new vers, and still 175.  Help/Get Updates says "none available"

thanks for the help!
dougf
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JimH

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #52 on: May 28, 2003, 06:59:56 pm »

Please see the first thread here.  The latest build is always here, but it doesn't get moved to the downloads page until we think it's pretty sure to be good.
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Endymion

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #53 on: May 28, 2003, 08:27:03 pm »

Quote
Ipod support disappeared.  It was working, but when I go to Plugin Manager, Ipod is no longer there.  When I click on I: under Handhelds, MC crashes immediately (Media Core has encountered a problem...).  I am using the most current plug-in, 9.0.21.  I have never installed Musicmatch, but of course have installed all other Ipod files for my 30Gb Win Ipod.  It is viewable under Explorer, set as Drive I: named IPOD.



schwaa, sounds like the same problem I was having.  I did not have Musicmatch installed either.  Had the same problem on 2 different PCs..  My solution: I installed Musicmatch and use it to sync to my IPOD.  Haven't had any problems since I switched except that Musicmatch is god awful slow at syncing.

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dallardice

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #54 on: May 28, 2003, 10:06:35 pm »

Quote
If I want a particular playlist at the top, I prefix it with an exclamation point (!).  The !playlists always show up at the top of the list.


Thanks for this, Kurt.  Oddly, this works for playlists, but not for albums - eg the album "!Double Hipness" appears after "Affectionate Punch".  Anyone found a similar trick for album names?  Thanks in advance
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SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #55 on: May 29, 2003, 06:05:27 am »

dougF,

Here is the thread to get the latest version...

http://www.musicex.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=MediaCenter;action=display;num=1054071386

Endymion,

Whatever problem you were having is almost certainly solvable. If you want to pursue it further, let me know.  It will require carefully going through some steps, but I am confident it will work out.  


Schwaa,

Please follow the advice above and let me know how it turns out.

Steve

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Kurt Young

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #56 on: May 29, 2003, 08:57:47 am »

Quote


Thanks for this, Kurt.  Oddly, this works for playlists, but not for albums - eg the album "!Double Hipness" appears after "Affectionate Punch".  Anyone found a similar trick for album names?  Thanks in advance


Huh!  I didn't see that coming.  You're right, that is a bit odd.  You're probably experiencing some blowback from the logic that makes "The Doors" get filed under "D" -- I get the feeling that there's nothing you can do about it.

An alternative then, would be to prepend a "1." or something like that... I know that the album "1" by the Beatles always shows up at the top of my albums list.
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jgourd

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #57 on: May 29, 2003, 09:29:40 am »

I have the latest build of everything. MC9.178 and hand held plugin v9.0.22.

When i click on my iPod I get a tiny little error dialog with no words. If I dismiss it and click on the iPod again, MC9 crashes and dies.

If I delete my iPod's iTunesDB file everything is great. If I rebuild the database from file, I get a message every time i do anything to the iPod that states something like "illegal argument". Shutting down MC9 and starting it back up again brings right back to where I started.

Reformatting the iPod and loading it again seems to have corrected the problem.

I wonder if there was a bad MP3 on the device? The last time I had used the iPod connected to MC was probably in February and as I recall the plugin was pretty flaky at that time.
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SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #58 on: May 29, 2003, 09:59:22 am »

Quote
I wonder if there was a bad MP3 on the device?


Possible, it is hard to say. If everything is OK now, hopefully you are all set.
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TimB

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #59 on: May 29, 2003, 10:20:49 am »

Quote

An alternative then, would be to prepend a "1." or something like that... I know that the album "1" by the Beatles always shows up at the top of my albums list.
Or try zero?

-=Tim=-
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coxkevin

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #60 on: May 29, 2003, 04:20:45 pm »

Hi Steve!!!

I've been playing quite a bit with synchronizing and the new conversion feature and have the following to report:

Methodology:  
Restored the iPod usings Apple 1.2.6 Updater.
Formatted the iPod from inside Media Center.
Created a Smartlist that had a single artist for a small sample size.  
Synchronized with
- Delete files not in list checked
- Update tags checked
- Autosync unchecked
- Options: force file conversions during uploads checked, normalization set to 90%, conversion to 160, high speed.  (For reference, all my MP3s are ripped at 320.)
Resynched with no changes.
Added second artist.  Resynched.  
Added third artist.  Resynched.  
Deleted second artist.  Resynched.
Left clicked on iPod drive in Media Center, selected the second artist's songs and deleted them.
Right clicked in iPod drive in Media Center and formatted the iPod (to try and return the iPod to a known state).  Resynched.
Right clicked in iPod drive in Media Center and formatted the iPod.  Resynched with:
- Delete files not in list checked
- Update tags checked
- Autosync unchecked
- Options:  force file conversions during uploads unchecked

Observations:  

First sync worked flawlessly (converted to music 160 and normalized).  

Second sync worked as well.  It was great that Media Center recognized that the files didn't need to be reconverted as this saved a lot of time.  I was surprised, however, that it took about 5 seconds to verify that each song was on the iPod and didn't need to be converted.  Is there anything you can do to speed up this process?

Third sync broke down.  Media Center falsely determined that the songs from the second artist did not need to be converted and uploaded them at their original quality of 320 and without normalization.

Fourth sync performed exactly as the third sync did.  Media Center falsely determined that the songs from the third artist did not need to be converted and uploaded them at their original quality of 320 and without normalization.  At this point the iPod had the original artist converted, normalized, and uploaded correctly, while the second and third artists were uploaded at the original quality.

Fifth sync did not delete any of the songs from the second artist.  The iPod was left in the same state it was after the fourth sync.

Deleting the songs directly from the iPod didn't work correctly.  The Artists, Genres, and Playlists were all updated correctly, but the second artist's albums were still left in the iPod's Albums list.

Formatting the iPod from inside Media Center appeared to work fine as all the songs, albums, artists, genres, and playlists were cleared from the iPod.  However, when I resynched the sixth time, I immediately got a dialog that said "Failed to normalize".

Seventh worked for all the songs that weren't tied to the original three artists.  For those artists I got a "File Error Information" dialog box that said "The following is a list of file that failed to transfer with an error code."  I assume the error code is the "- 2" that is after each filename in the list.  When I went to look at those files on my hard drive, THEY WERE GONE!  I can assure you they were there originally.  This is bad, bad, ju ju!

This is entirely reproducible on my PC / iPod combo.  

By the way, any idea when I'll be able to normalize against replay gain?  Is there a simple man explanation as to why this so difficult to do since you can normalize against ?

One more thing.  I've been playing a lot with the "Full Albums" smartlist modifier and the "completealbums" keyword.  From what I can determine, it looks like for a given playlist that the "Full Albums" modifier should identify all the albums that correspond to the given playlist and then return all the songs that are on those albums regardless of whether the albums are missing any tracks or not.  The "completealbums==1" keyword also identifies all the albums that correspond to a given playlist, but differs from "Full Albums" by returning only the subset of tracks from the original playlist that belong to a complete album (i.e. albums that are not missing any tracks).  Do I have this figured out correctly?  If not, then can you explain the difference?

I'll be out of town until Tuesday so I won't be able to do any follow up testing until then.  But I promise to bang some more if you can get rid of these bugs!  

Cheers,
Kevin

Second generation winiPod (20GB) v1.2.6

Media Center Registered 9.0.179 -- C:\Program Files\Media Center\

Microsoft Windows XP  Workstation 5.1 Service Pack 1 (Build 2600)
AMD Athlon 697 MHz MMX / Memory: Total - 392 MB, Free - 168 MB

Internet Explorer: 6.0.2800.1106 / ComCtl32.dll: 5.82 (xpsp1.020828-1920) / Shlwapi.dll: 6.00.2800.1106 (xpsp1.020828-1920) / Shell32.dll: 6.00.2800.1145 (xpsp2.021108-1929) / wnaspi32.dll: 4.60 (1021) , ASPI for Win32 (95/NT) DLL, Copyright © 1989-1999 Adaptec, Inc. / Aspi32.sys: 4.60 (1021)

Ripping /   Drive E:   Copy mode:ModeBurstBigBuffer   CD Type:Auto   Read speed:Max
 Drive I:   Copy mode:ModeBurstBigBuffer   CD Type:Auto   Read speed:Max
 Digital playback: Yes /  Use YADB: Yes /  Get cover art: No /  Calc replay gain: Yes /  Copy volume: 32767
 Eject after ripping: Yes /  Play sound after ripping: Yes  Soundfile:   chord.wav

Burning /  Drive I: HP       CD-Writer+ 9300    Addr: 3:0:0  Speed:10  MaxSpeed:10  Use MJ Engine:Yes
 Test mode: No /  Eject after writing: Yes /  Direct decoding: No /  Write CD-Text: Yes
 Use playback settings: No /  Normalization: None

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jioupahn

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #61 on: May 29, 2003, 05:38:02 pm »

I downloaded .178 yesterday and the latest iPod plug-in.  I have a 30G iPod.  I used .175 yesterday and it worked beautifully.

It worked for a while.  After I did some sync, removed iPod to listen to some music and put it back.  Now MC wouldn't work at all.  I am not sure about the timing but somewhere along the line I imported a lot of jpeg pictures.  Now it crashes almost everytime I start it.  It'd beep and flash a dialog box very quickly and crash. The one time it didn't crash, I was able to grab the system info (see below).

I tried to go back to the previous version of MC and it crashed too.  I have no way of saving the iPod plug-in from yesterday so they may not be compitable.  How do I get back to .175 and a proper version of iPod plug-in?


=====================================================================================================
Media Center 9.0.178 -- C:\Program Files\J River\Media Center\

Microsoft Windows XP 5.1 Service Pack 1 (Build 2600)
Intel Pentium 4 1188 MHz MMX / Memory: Total - 523 MB, Free - 261 MB

Internet Explorer: 6.0.2800.1106 / ComCtl32.dll: 5.82 (xpsp1.020828-1920) / Shlwapi.dll: 6.00.2800.1106 (xpsp1.020828-1920) / Shell32.dll: 6.00.2800.1145 (xpsp2.021108-1929) / wnaspi32.dll: N/A
Ripping /   Drive D:   Copy mode:ModeBurstBigBuffer   CD Type:Auto   Read speed:Max
 Digital playback: Yes /  Use YADB: Yes /  Get cover art: No /  Calc replay gain: Yes /  Copy volume: 32767
 Eject after ripping: Yes /  Play sound after ripping: No  

Burning /  Drive D: TOSHIBA  CD-R/RW SR-C8102   Addr: 1:0:0  Speed:16  MaxSpeed:16  Use MJ Engine:Yes
 Test mode: No /  Eject after writing: Yes /  Direct decoding: Yes /  Write CD-Text: No
 Use playback settings: No /  Normalization: None

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mindracing

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #62 on: May 30, 2003, 05:29:18 am »

The friendly chaps at Audible.com have said that I need to install MusicMatch so that iPOD Manger gets installed in order for Audible Manager to communicate with the iPOD.

Firstly, is this correct?
Secondly, will installing MusicMatch and the iPOD Manager cause problems with MC and the iPOD plug-in?

30G iPOD 2.0 firmware

Media Center Registered 9.0.178 -- C:\Program Files\Media Center\

Microsoft Windows XP 5.1 Service Pack 1 (Build 2600)
Intel Unknown 74 MHz MMX / Memory: Total - 383 MB, Free - 34 MB

Internet Explorer: 6.0.2800.1106 / ComCtl32.dll: 5.82 (xpsp1.020828-1920) / Shlwapi.dll: 6.00.2800.1106 (xpsp1.020828-1920) / Shell32.dll: 6.00.2800.1145 (xpsp2.021108-1929) / wnaspi32.dll: N/A
Ripping /   Drive D:   Copy mode:ModeBurstBigBuffer   CD Type:Auto   Read speed:Max
 Digital playback: Yes /  Use YADB: Yes /  Get cover art: No /  Calc replay gain: Yes /  Copy volume: 32767
 Eject after ripping: No /  Play sound after ripping: No  

Burning /  Drive D: TOSHIBA  CDRW/DVD SDR2102   Addr: 1:0:0  Speed:8  MaxSpeed:8  Use MJ Engine:Yes
 Test mode: No /  Eject after writing: Yes /  Direct decoding: Yes /  Write CD-Text: No
 Use playback settings: No /  Normalization: None
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SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #63 on: May 30, 2003, 06:41:17 am »

Kevin,

I will look into this today.

jioupahn,

Try getting 9.0.179. No need to get a different plugin, it is built into 9.0.179. If you are saying MC crashes when you try to start it, it is unlikely it is related to the Plugin unless you have "Auto-synch" enabled.  If the crash is when you click on the iPod drive letter, try a reformat.


mindracing,

I do not know for sure if what Audible told you is correct. If you want to heed their advice, install everything they say and then rename your MusicMatch directory to something else so it will be unable to try to auto start and interfere with our connection.

Steve
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jioupahn

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #64 on: May 30, 2003, 06:57:13 am »

Steve, I do have auto sync turned on.  I tried 179, it does not crash all the time.  Actually, it appears to be OK without iPod connected to it.  When I plugged the iPod in and right click on the G letter, a dialog box with "h" and an OK button showed up.  It did allow me to proceed but the same dialog box kept popping up.  I was not able to sync with it.

You suggested to reformat?  Is a particular reason why?  It appears to be a MC 9 problem. Thanks.

Jiou-Pahn
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SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #65 on: May 30, 2003, 08:06:34 am »

Jiou-Pahn,

If MC crashes when you click on the drive letter, your iTunesDB is probably corrupted. If you do not want to lose your files on iPod, you can try deleting the iTunesDB file from your iPod (DriveLetter\iPod_Control\iTunes\iTunesDB) and then run MC and right click on your drive letter. Select "Rebuild Database from iPod". This should make your files visible again. The downside to this is you will lose your playlists.

Another plan would be to run iPod updater, reconnect your iPod and then right click on your iPod drive letter and select "Format". This is probably best, but you will lose all your files.

Also, for now deselect "Auto-Synch". This could be causing problems for you. I am redoing this code in the near future.


Steve
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sub-24

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #66 on: May 30, 2003, 09:03:31 am »

Not a problem - more of a question.

I have the new 15G iPod and use it with MC - That side of things is working perfect.

Only problem i seem to have is it doesnt go very loud.
Ive tried a few different headphones and also normalised the tracks on transfer - and although it helps a little i need it to go louder.

Someone told me that because i live in the UK that the firmware restricts the max volume due to some EEC legislation etc and that the USA ones go a lot louder.

Has anyone heard of this - and if so where can i get a copy of the USA version.

Either that of i'm going deaf in my old age.

Any help appreciated.

thanks
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ChrisG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #67 on: May 30, 2003, 09:14:52 am »

Playlist sync problems:
Currently using v9.0178 & plugin v9.022.  I am not able to sync playlists on either ipod. One is a 3rd gen and the other a 2nd gen.  I did not have this problem with the 3rd gen ipod using v9.0175 with an older plugin.  

My setup is the same for both ipods: I have one main playlist (smartlist) that contains all songs I want on the ipod. The initial sync would work just fine.  But I can't seem to add or sync any add'l playlists after that.  (I can, however, continue to sync my main playlist though.) I do not get any error messages during the sync so it would look like it went ok.  Initially, I can even see the new playlists on the Ipod in Media Center. But when I eject the Ipod, I can see my main playlist but the new playlists do not show up. Eventually, this process would crash media center and I would need to reformat the ipod because Media Library won't recognize it. Strangely though, Ephpod can access the ipod just fine.  

However, I can create playlist manually on the Ipod without any problems.  As long as I go the handheld section and send files from within the ipod to the new playlists.

Prior to using Media Library, I've uninstalled MusicMatch completely and  I've run the updater on the 3rd gen ipod so I would have a fresh start (but not on the 2nd gen ipod, just a format).
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SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #68 on: May 30, 2003, 01:51:42 pm »

Kevin,

Based on your comments I made some modifications which will be included in the next build of MC and will hopefully resolve the issues you report.  

Your description of how Full Albums  and Complete Albums works is right on.

Replay gain is on the to do list.


mikeh,

I do not know the answer, maybe someone else can chime in.


ChrisG,

Can you try getting MC 9.0.179, run iPod updater on the iPod to clean it and then run MC and right click and select "Format". This will start your iPod clean with the latest version and then if you are still having problems I can troubleshoot from there.

Also, check if you have the "Delete Files not on Ipod" box checked. If you do, this could cause similar behavior to what you are seeing because it will delete any Playlists not checked in your Synch dialog.

Steve
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ChrisG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #69 on: May 30, 2003, 04:47:52 pm »

All is well... finally figured out my ipod problem!!  I had mentioned that I was able to sync my playlist with v.90175 but not with v.90178. It has nothing to do with the different versions. It seems like it has everything to do with the way I do my INITIAL transfer of songs to my ipod.  When I had it working with v90175 I created my smartlist of about 9gig of songs and "sent" it to the ipod.   But after I upgraded to v.90178, and ran the Updater & reformatted the ipod, I initally "synced" my main smartlist instead of "sending" it.  That would work just fine until I decide to add and sync new playlists. This would eventually corrupt the itunes db.

In order for me to successfully sync my playlists, I have to "send" and not "sync" my initial smartlists that contains all my songs.  Then, after that I can sync subsequent playlists properly. I'm happy to report that both ipods (gen 2 & 3) are now working  and syncing perfectly.  I did not even have to run the updater or reformat them.  I just deleted the itunes.db file & let MediaCenter rebuild the database.  This would let me retain all my songs but delete all my playlists, including my initial one.

I have since ran a couple of tests and I am able to duplicate the playlists sync problem everytime. I'm curious if it's just me or if others can duplicate this problem.

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ashawley

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #70 on: May 30, 2003, 07:31:46 pm »

ChrisG:

I've never used the send to feature (well, months ago I did, before sync was available) and I've been using the plugin since day one, so I really can't help you there, but I just wanted to say what you're experiencing is not normal.  I also sync w/ 2gen and a 3gen iPod's.

Mikah:
It is indeed true that the european firmware is slightly lower than the US firmware.  The US firmware goes to 104dbs, the EU firmware goes to 100dbs to comply w/a French law.

Check out the forums at the iPodlounge for more info on this (www.ipodlounge.com).

Adam
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jioupahn

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #71 on: May 30, 2003, 08:30:10 pm »

Quote
Jiou-Pahn,

If MC crashes when you click on the drive letter, your iTunesDB is probably corrupted. If you do not want to lose your files on iPod, you can try deleting the iTunesDB file from your iPod (DriveLetter\iPod_Control\iTunes\iTunesDB) and then run MC and right click on your drive letter. Select "Rebuild Database from iPod". This should make your files visible again. The downside to this is you will lose your playlists.

Another plan would be to run iPod updater, reconnect your iPod and then right click on your iPod drive letter and select "Format". This is probably best, but you will lose all your files.

Also, for now deselect "Auto-Synch". This could be causing problems for you. I am redoing this code in the near future.


Steve


Steve, Rebuilding iTune database did the trick.  Many thanks.  As a professional software developer, I would like to see the plug-in be more robust - don't crash because of a corruptted database. :-)

I am happy that the recovery is really straightforward and rather painless.  Thanks again.

Jiou-Pahn
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Endymion

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #72 on: May 30, 2003, 09:36:29 pm »

Quote


Steve, Rebuilding iTune database did the trick.  Many thanks.  As a professional software developer, I would like to see the plug-in be more robust - don't crash because of a corruptted database. :-)

I am happy that the recovery is really straightforward and rather painless.  Thanks again.

Jiou-Pahn


You're having the same problem I've been having.  My IPOD is one of the new 30G ones too.  Wonder if that's a factor.

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mindracing

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #73 on: May 31, 2003, 02:42:40 am »

Whilst playing around with the Audible Manager and AA files I have had to reformat the iPOD twice.

Each time I  get a selection of files that fail to transfer to the clean iPOD.

First time there were about 20 files with error code 2.

I deleted these from MC and re ripped them. They then transfered fine.

This time no files sync, all with error code 55.

In both cases the files have been on the iPOD before without any problem.

I am working from a clean install of MC and all Audible and iPOD Manager programs heve been removed.

When looking at the iPOD tree within MC, all that is listed after a sync is the names of the playlists - but no songs.

Any ideas?

30G iPOD 2.0
Media Center Registered 9.0.179 -- C:\Program Files\J River\Media Center\

Microsoft Windows XP  Workstation 5.1 Service Pack 1 (Build 2600)
Intel Unknown 65 MHz MMX / Memory: Total - 383 MB, Free - 80 MB

Internet Explorer: 6.0.2800.1106 / ComCtl32.dll: 5.82 (xpsp1.020828-1920) / Shlwapi.dll: 6.00.2800.1106 (xpsp1.020828-1920) / Shell32.dll: 6.00.2800.1145 (xpsp2.021108-1929) / wnaspi32.dll: N/A
Ripping /   Drive D:   Copy mode:ModeBurstBigBuffer   CD Type:Auto   Read speed:Max
 Digital playback: Yes /  Use YADB: Yes /  Get cover art: Yes /  Calc replay gain: Yes /  Copy volume: 32767
 Eject after ripping: Yes /  Play sound after ripping: No  

Burning /  No burners found.
 Test mode: No /  Eject after writing: Yes /  Direct decoding: Yes /  Write CD-Text: No
 Use playback settings: No /  Normalization: None
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mindracing

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #74 on: May 31, 2003, 07:39:09 am »

So, following a reinstallation of iPOD updator and another format the problem is gone.

I have a old 20G and a new 30G iPOD and now realise that MC keeps a database of what is on 1 iPOD (last one to sync) to manage the next sync. Clearly with 2 iPODs this is a bit of a problem.

How could 2 iPODs best be managed without having to rebuild the DB from each iPOD before synching?
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nyc-ink

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #75 on: June 01, 2003, 11:03:46 am »

Was running my ipod without the plugin with no problems.  Got curious and installed the plugin.  After installing the plugin everytime I tried to access my ipod via MC the progam crashed.  Long story short, I had to completely unistall MC and it's library and reinstall to be able to use the program with my iPod again (no ipod plugin installed.
Brian
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jioupahn

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #76 on: June 01, 2003, 01:25:31 pm »

Quote


You're having the same problem I've been having.  My IPOD is one of the new 30G ones too.  Wonder if that's a factor.



But, wait, there is more :-)  I tried to add more songs and got the Microsoft "send error rerport" everytime.  I reformated the iPod and re-downloaded all of the songs (including the two I watned to add initially), it seemed to work.  I don't use auto-sync anymore.  I just clicked on "synchronize" and got the error.

If I have to reformat my iPod to add new songs, ... :-(

Jiou-Pahn
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SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #77 on: June 01, 2003, 05:26:37 pm »

Jiou-Pahn and Endymion,

My best guess is there is something peculiar about a file or files that you are synching that is causing a corruption of your database. If MC crashes, try going to your iPod and copy the iTunesDB so that you can email it to me so I can take a look (steve @ jriver.com).  Also, you could try synching small playlists to try to isolate which one is causing the crash.

Mindracing,

MC does not keep a database of the files, but I need to test to see if I can duplicate the problem you are having. I will do this tomorrow when I am at work.

Brian,

The plugin to access the iPod is automatically installed with MC. If you were accessing the iPod from somewhere other than CD, DVD, Handhelds, you may have been copying files to the iPod, but they would have been unplayable on the iPod. How are you accessing the iPod?

Everyone,

When testing with iPod, please get MC 9.0.179. Newer plugins may not be compatible with older versions of MC.  Old plugins will run with newer MC versions.
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nyc-ink

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #78 on: June 01, 2003, 06:03:21 pm »

I access it by expanding CD, DVD, Handhelds, everything is okay now that I unistalled MC and reinstalled it.
Brian
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ChrisG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #79 on: June 01, 2003, 08:38:28 pm »

Playlist sort order?  I think I'm just missing something here but how do I sort songs on the playlist on my ipod.  It doesn't seem to matter how I sort the playlist in MC ... when I send it to the ipod, it sorts in artist order.  THanks.
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SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #80 on: June 02, 2003, 06:37:50 am »

ChrisG,

When you create a Playlist, whatever order you have created in the "seq" column is the order the files will be created on the iPod.

Steve
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ChrisG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #81 on: June 02, 2003, 07:11:47 am »

Thanks Steve,

How about smartlists? I do not see a sequence # column on smartlists that I have created nor do I see an option to select it under Visible Columns.
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SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #82 on: June 02, 2003, 09:06:59 am »

ChrisG,

Smartlists do not have a static order. They are ordered by whatever columns you have selected in their view.

Steve
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SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #83 on: June 02, 2003, 09:14:14 am »

Mindracing,

I just tested my two iPods at the same time with Windows XP and had no problem synching them. Can you give me a specific test that you know fails for you and I will try to duplicate it?

Steve
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mindracing

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #84 on: June 02, 2003, 11:53:50 am »

Quote
So, following a reinstallation of iPOD updator and another format the problem is gone.

I have a old 20G and a new 30G iPOD and now realise that MC keeps a database of what is on 1 iPOD (last one to sync) to manage the next sync. Clearly with 2 iPODs this is a bit of a problem.

How could 2 iPODs best be managed without having to rebuild the DB from each iPOD before synching?


Thanks for checking that out Steve. I don't have a specific problem. I was anticipating one so asked for some advice before running into problems.

I guess my question really refered to keeping 2 librarys - one for each iPOD - that contain different songs and different playlists.

How would that work with 2 iPODs.
Great service as usual!
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SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #85 on: June 02, 2003, 01:39:39 pm »

mindracing,

It can work a couple of different ways.  One way to do this would be to create smartlist groups, one for each iPod and then when you synch, just select the appropriate group.  If you can describe what you would like to do I can suggest how best to achieve it.

Steve
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ashawley

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #86 on: June 02, 2003, 08:08:57 pm »

That's what I do Mindracing....

One Playlist Group for my wife's iPod (a 2nd Gen) and one for my iPod (a 3rd Gen).

Works like a charm, never had any problems.

Of course, each playlist group starts off with a master playlist, that has all the tunes I want on each iPod.  Any other playlists in the group start w/the filter Playlist="master playlist".

Adam
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jioupahn

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #87 on: June 02, 2003, 10:30:42 pm »

Quote
ChrisG,

Smartlists do not have a static order. They are ordered by whatever columns you have selected in their view.

Steve


So if I get my smartlist view sorted just right, sync with my iPod then iPod will have the same order?
I understand playlists can be sorted the way I wanted.  I just like to have the ability to sort smartlists.  Thanks.

Jiou-Pahn
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SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #88 on: June 03, 2003, 06:19:44 am »

Jiou-Pahn,

No, currently when smartlists transfer the view order is not preserverd.  Perhaps I can add this in a future version. If order is important, use Playlists.
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bspachman

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #89 on: June 03, 2003, 09:58:14 am »

Quote
Jiou-Pahn,

No, currently when smartlists transfer the view order is not preserverd.  Perhaps I can add this in a future version. If order is important, use Playlists.


Ah-ha...maybe this has something to do with my On-the-Go album ordering problem. I use a single smartlist to synch my iPod with a selection of about 85% of my music library. The smartlist is sorted in Album->Track order.

As I posted earlier in this thread:
Quote
However, my problem is with the song order. I'm usually an album listener, so I like to pick a few albums and add them to the OTG playlist. The problem is that the track order is messed up. Sometimes only a couple of tracks are inverted, but other times, the entire album is in a random order.

I've made sure that shuffle mode and repeat modes are turned off on the iPod--it doesn't make a difference. My 2 guesses are:

1) MC9 is messing with the track order somehow when copying songs to the iPod, so I'm actually getting some kind of "internal DB order" instead of "track number order" with this feature.

2) Apple has something else wrong with this feature...


Someone on the Apple iPod forums mentioned he cured his problem with this by making sure iTunes had the sorting correct before he synched....

Any ideas?
Brad
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SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #90 on: June 03, 2003, 10:57:26 am »

Brad,

Try clicking on an Album from within MC under the iPod. You should be able to view the track numbers associated with the songs. You then should be able to verify if MC correctly assigned the track numbers. The ordering within a Playlist should not affect the track number.

Steve
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interested

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Re: IPOD SUP.  - 179 /22/ M. Server / Con
« Reply #91 on: June 04, 2003, 09:29:06 am »

Topic Moved.

Confirmed that the problem is that when the orginal file is served from Media Server, MC can't convert and then place file on IPOD.


MC has no problem transferring .mp3 files from Media Server to IPOD.

Workaround - convert on server, create separately Playlist, transfer that.  A pain, but works.
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SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #92 on: June 05, 2003, 06:55:56 am »

interested,

Try MC 9.0.180. On the fly conversion should work without doing the intermediate steps you describe.

Steve
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bspachman

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #93 on: June 05, 2003, 07:17:32 am »

Quote
Try clicking on an Album from within MC under the iPod. You should be able to view the track numbers associated with the songs. You then should be able to verify if MC correctly assigned the track numbers. The ordering within a Playlist should not affect the track number.

Steve,

I think you're on to something here. When I look at the files on the iPod under the drive letter, everything appears ok--track numbers are assigned correctly, etc. When I drill down to iPod->Albums->someAlbum, a new column appears called "Seq".

The numbers in the "Seq" column start at 0 and continue in order through the rest of the tracks. The interesting thing is that on many of my albums, "Seq #" does not equal "Track # - 1". If I go to the iPod itself and play an album, the album plays in track number order. However, if I add the album to the OTG Playlist on the iPod, the tracks get added in Sequence# order.

Although I can sort the tracks when looking at an Album in MC, I can find no facility for changing the sequence number. Drag-n-drop doesn't do anything. Is there a "reorder" command somewhere?

Is it possible to make MC assign things so Sequence # = Track #? How can I go about correcting this?

(obOddBehavior: Also, sticky views don't seem to stick when working in the Handhelds tree node....)

Best,
Brad
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SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #94 on: June 05, 2003, 02:02:51 pm »

Brad,

The next build of the Plugin will remove that "Seq" field. It should not be there. The correct way to modify the track order is to modify the track number field for the files. I found a new MC bug that causes this not to work so well ( the rename). I will fix this and it will be resolved in the next MC build.  I confirmed that the "On the go" playlist does not respect the track order. I do not think this is a MC issue but an iPod issue.

Steve
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jioupahn

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #95 on: June 05, 2003, 04:38:40 pm »

Quote
Brad,

The next build of the Plugin will remove that "Seq" field. It should not be there. The correct way to modify the track order is to modify the track number field for the files.

Steve


Steve, I actualy quite like the way seq works.  I am able to create a playlist, order the songs the way I like, and perform "update order."  If you remove the seq field, I assume I will lose this ability.  Is there a way to achieve the same results without permanently changing my MP3 files?

Jiou-Pahn
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coxkevin

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #96 on: June 05, 2003, 04:55:57 pm »

Hi Steve!

I have to say that I'm disappointed in the fixes of 9.0.180.  I didn't even get past the second step of my testing before I noted the same failure I reported last time.  Here's what I did:

Methodology:

Restored the iPod usings Apple 1.2.6 Updater.

Formatted the iPod from inside Media Center.  

Created a Smartlist that had a single artist for a small sample size.  

Synchronized with  
- Delete files not in list checked
- Update tags checked
- Autosync unchecked
- Options: force file conversions during uploads checked, normalization set to 90%, conversion to 160, high speed.  (For reference, all my MP3s are ripped at 320.)

Resynched with no changes.

Observations:

First sync worked flawlessly (converted to music 160 and normalized).   Although I didn't test it, I was wondering if music that is in the basic Media Center library at the correct bitrate will be transcoded?  These files should be skipped and uploaded directly if at all possible.  Heck, what about lower bitrates?  Will they be upconverted if the transcoding is set for a higher bitrate?  They should be skipped and uploaded directly as well.

Second sync worked to the iPod, but failed in Media Center.  It was great that Media Center recognized that the files didn't need to be reconverted as this saved a lot of time.  I was also surprised that it took about 5 seconds to verify that each song was on the iPod and didn't need to be converted.  Is there anything you can do to speed up this process?

Unfortunately, all the files were deleted from my hard drive after the second sync.  This is a terrible bug and could cost someone quite a few files in their library.

I didn't go any further this time as it seems to be a waste of time until this issue is delt with.  I'm keeping my fingers crossed for the next release.

Cheers,
Kevin
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neonhapy98

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #97 on: June 05, 2003, 08:58:09 pm »

HELP ME!!  I finally broke under the pressure and bought a 3rg gen 30GB Ipod after never really being happy with what else was on the market.  Apple has been no help and neither has MusicMatch.  After 3 days of just wanting to put my 5000 mp3's on it I am on the verge of cracking.  I downloaded your media Center 9 build .180 and I must say that I am very impressed with what this program can do, however I have yet to get it to work with my iPod.

My problem is that basically I can load any number of mp3's on it and then eject it.  Plug my headphones in and hope to God it worked but yet again, it doesnt.  It shows all the MP3's in the ipod as being there but then it tries to play each one and it cant.  It lists length, name, all that good junk, fiddles around for a sec and then gives up and tries the next song with the same result.  So  I went and plugged it back and looked at all the contents with explorer and it shows the mp3's as being there and I can even play them on my computer, but why wont they play on the ipod.  I have done it all, updated to the latest version, ran the updater on iPod 100 times to restore it and nothing works.  Please if anyone can help I would greatly appreciate it.  

Also, one other thing, when I upload my mp3's, I get a message at the end saying that it couldnt upload these songs and then lists them, why is that?  Then I go back and try again and it uploads a few of the failed but it still has a list that didnt work.  PLEASE HELP ME, I am starting to lose hope in Apple as a company after this sad example of the best mp3 player on the market.

Thanks to all for your insights so far.

~Ed
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JimH

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #98 on: June 06, 2003, 04:43:20 am »

Please read the instructions in the first post of this thread carefully.  See Adam's instructions there.

Some things I would try:

Uninstall Musicmatch.

Right click on the drive under CD,DVD, and Handhelds and choose format.

Then upload a few files.
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SteveG

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Re: IPOD SUPPORT
« Reply #99 on: June 06, 2003, 06:47:29 am »

Jiou-Pahn,

The seq column will not be removed from MC, just from the view within the Plugin where it has no meaning.

Kevin,

Please double check that you have Plugin 9.0.23 installed (it is the one on the website).

Quote
I was wondering if music that is in the basic Media Center library at the correct bitrate will be transcoded?


It should be skipped when sending the files to iPod.

Quote
Will they be upconverted if the transcoding is set for a higher bitrate?


Currently yes, but I will change this.

Quote
Second sync worked to the iPod, but failed in Media Center.  It was great that Media Center recognized that the files didn't need to be reconverted as this saved a lot of time.  I was also surprised that it took about 5 seconds to verify that each song was on the iPod and didn't need to be converted.  Is there anything you can do to speed up this process?

Unfortunately, all the files were deleted from my hard drive after the second sync.  This is a terrible bug and could cost someone quite a few files in their library.


A lot of this is confusing to me. What do you mean by "worked to iPod, but failed in MC"?

It does not take 5 seconds per song for me. This leads me to believe we may be out of synch by version. Perhaps wait to install tonight's release to get us on the same page.

When you say all the files were deleted from the harddrive, what do you mean? The original files?? This should not be and I cannot duplicate this. I do delete the temporarily converted files, but this seems logical.


Ed,

Jim is on the money. Try right clicking on the iPod drive letter and select "Format" You will lose all your data, but then you should be good to go.

Steve
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