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[haggis999]

My media collection has all been ripped for storage on a NAS unit. Stereo audio files are played via a Naim network player, while my MKV rips of Blu-rays used to be played via an Oppo BDP-105 Blu-ray player (a machine that also handles most computer-based media formats).

I have run MC on my primary PC workstation for many years, using it mainly for updating metadata settings and managing my media collection. I only recently became aware that it could also handle the playback of my MKV files much more slickly than my Oppo. This made me decide to buy my first ever dedicated HTPC. After much deliberation, I chose one of the latest eighth generation Intel NUCs, specifically the 8i3CYSM, running under Windows 10 Pro, which is installed on a 256GB SSD.

This NUC has only been in use for a few days, but I am already impressed that such a small box can pack so much power without making any noticeable noise. Even after running for several hours, the case stays cool and you have to be very close before you can hear the fan. The NUC is on a shelf behind my TV and center speaker, which makes it utterly inaudible when watching a video.

My current TV does not support 4K, but I plan to take the NUC and NAS to my son's house at the weekend for a 4K test on his 55" LG OLED screen.     

[RoderickGI]

It will be interesting to hear how the AMD Radeon™ 540 video goes.

[haggis999]

One potential issue is that I have had several occurrences of a crackling noise affecting the audio. This has affected the playback of both DSF and MKV files. In each case, it has been fixed by rebooting the NUC. I have not yet noticed any common pattern of behaviour leading up to the problem, but clearly it will become a matter of some concern if it happens too often.

Are there any known causes of audio distortion in MC? 

[RoderickGI]

Are there any known causes of audio distortion in MC?

Mostly buffer settings and drivers.

But that is a huge topic. A search in the forum will find many cases, and many with different causes and solutions. Because there is a huge range of hardware MC works on and with.

[haggis999]

Mostly buffer settings and drivers.

But that is a huge topic. A search in the forum will find many cases, and many with different causes and solutions. Because there is a huge range of hardware MC works on and with.

Thanks for the advice. I will start trawling the forum on this subject.

[DJLegba]

What audio device have you selected in MC? I'm using much older i3 NUCs - one in my audio system and one connected to the TV - feeding exaSound e22 DACs and I never hear crackling or have any other audio problems. I seldom use DSP, but even when I do, the i3 NUCs have enough processing power to handle normal DSP tasks. The Intel graphics in the i3 NUC have handled everything I've tried, but I don't have a 4k TV.

[haggis999]

What audio device have you selected in MC? I'm using much older i3 NUCs - one in my audio system and one connected to the TV - feeding exaSound e22 DACs and I never hear crackling or have any other audio problems. I seldom use DSP, but even when I do, the i3 NUCs have enough processing power to handle normal DSP tasks. The Intel graphics in the i3 NUC have handled everything I've tried, but I don't have a 4k TV.

It was set to the default audio device. I have now changed this to "DENON-AVAMP (AMD High Definition Audio Device) [WASAPI]", to reflect the equipment actually in use. I'll post back here if it appears to make a difference.

Thanks for bringing that setting to my attention. 

EDIT:  That setting stopped my videos from playing! I have reverted to the default settig for the time being.

[haggis999]

Unlike the WASAPI version, changing the audio device to "DENON-AVAMP (AMD High Definition Audio Device) [Direct Sound]" appears to work fine, though it will take time to find out if that stops my intermittent audio distortion issue.

[Awesome Donkey]

DirectSound goes through the Windows mixer though, so if you care about bit-perfect audio playback, DirectSound should be avoided if possible.

[DJLegba]

Do you see an error message when videos refuse to play? My first guess is that the audio device thinks it can't handle 48,000 Hz material. Either that or it's trying to send multichannel audio (source number of channels instead of Stereo). Select your WASAPI driver again and then check the Output Format settings.

[haggis999]

Do you see an error message when videos refuse to play? My first guess is that the audio device thinks it can't handle 48,000 Hz material. Either that or it's trying to send multichannel audio (source number of channels instead of Stereo). Select your WASAPI driver again and then check the Output Format settings.

I've tried using the WASAPI driver again but my MKV videos (derived from Blu-ray rips) still refuse to play. All that happens is that the video briefly flashes up on screen. No error messages are displayed. I have tried a variety of different settings in the DSP Studio/Output Format dialogue box without any success. My normal settings are to use the source number of channels and to reduce the sample rate only for signals above 192kHz. 

[RoderickGI]

Reset your audio device back to the default audio device, play a video, switch to Standard View using Ctrl+1, take a look at the Audio Path.

Then check what your Denon is receiving for audio. How many channels? How many channels is the Denon outputting?

Report what you find.

[haggis999]

Reset your audio device back to the default audio device, play a video, switch to Standard View using Ctrl+1, take a look at the Audio Path.

Then check what your Denon is receiving for audio. How many channels? How many channels is the Denon outputting?

Report what you find.

My MKV video files all have both a stereo and a multi-channel audio stream. Audio Path reports the appropriate number of channels for the stream I have chosen to select.

The HDMI input on my AV amp used by the NUC is normally set to a 5.1 multi-channel mode and drives my 5 speakers when it receives a multi-channel signal (I have no subwoofer), or just the front pair when it receives a stereo signal.

[haggis999]

One potential issue is that I have had several occurrences of a crackling noise affecting the audio. This has affected the playback of both DSF and MKV files. In each case, it has been fixed by rebooting the NUC. I have not yet noticed any common pattern of behaviour leading up to the problem, but clearly it will become a matter of some concern if it happens too often.

I made the above post shortly after starting this thread. This audio distortion (and occasional gaps in the audio signal) continued to occur on a fairly frequent basis. Purely on a hunch, I decided to stop allowing the NUC processor to go to sleep after 30 mins of inactivity and changed that sleep setting to 'Never'. That was about 10 days ago and the audio problems disappeared. Earlier today, I reinstated the previous sleep setting and the problems reappeared immediately after I first woke the NUC from sleep mode.

Does anyone know why the Windows 10 sleep mode should have any effect on audio performance?

[JimH]

It's probably not Windows.  Maybe the network hardware or USB hardware is getting powered down automatically.

[haggis999]

It's probably not Windows.  Maybe the network hardware or USB hardware is getting powered down automatically.

All my testing is being done using MKV video files stored on my Synology NAS (which is configured to hibernate after 15 mins of inactivity). It is therefore perfectly possible that the NAS was sleeping at the same time as my NUC, but both machines were clearly responding to me using Gizmo or JRemote to request MKV playback. If the NAS were still asleep, I would be hearing nothing at all.

[JimH]

You could try setting the timeout for the NAS to a higher value.

Explore the settings for the network interface.

[RoderickGI]

Does anyone know why the Windows 10 sleep mode should have any effect on audio performance?

Did you actually just change the Sleep setting to make it work properly, or did you select the High Performance power plan?

Whichever plan you are using when it doesn't work, check all the detailed setting under "Change plan settings > Change advanced power settings". If using Wireless, check the Wireless settings, then USB and Processor power settings. If Windows is trying to minimise processor power usage it could be affecting audio performance. Also the Multimedia Setting of course.

Basically, check everything and compare them to the settings used when the issue doesn't occur.

[haggis999]

You could try setting the timeout for the NAS to a higher value.

Explore the settings for the network interface.

I'm struggling to understand the reasoning behind these suggestions. As I understand it, the NAS will either be asleep or awake (i.e. a binary choice). However, you are implying a third option, where the NAS is awake enough to allow my Intel NUC to read a variety of MKV files, but still asleep enough to deliver these files in a compromised manner.

An Ethernet network is a digital communication medium, so my simple mind expects it to deliver a bit-perfect signal from one end to another or to fail completely, not something in between. Am I missing something here?

[haggis999]

Did you actually just change the Sleep setting to make it work properly, or did you select the High Performance power plan?

Whichever plan you are using when it doesn't work, check all the detailed setting under "Change plan settings > Change advanced power settings". If using Wireless, check the Wireless settings, then USB and Processor power settings. If Windows is trying to minimise processor power usage it could be affecting audio performance. Also the Multimedia Setting of course.

Basically, check everything and compare them to the settings used when the issue doesn't occur.

I simply changed the PC sleep setting from 30 mins to 'Never', or vice-versa. All other power management settings were left untouched (and are presumably still at the Windows 10 defaults). I'm using a wired Ethernet connection.

[JimH]

You could use Google to learn about power management and network interfaces.  Here's an example of what you can find:

http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-2876663/win-sleep-problem.html

[haggis999]

You could use Google to learn about power management and network interfaces.  Here's an example of what you can find:

http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/id-2876663/win-sleep-problem.html

As far as I can see, that just takes me to discussions about problems with sleep mode not working as expected. In my case, sleep mode seems to be working fine - apart from the apparent side-effect of degrading my audio (not a topic that appears to be addressed via this link).

I had tried previously searching for information about my audio problem without finding any relevant results, but Google searches often depend on the precise wording of your question. I can't remember what search text I used before, but I've just tried again using "audio problems after waking up from windows sleep mode" and this was much more successful. The results appear to be focused on the total loss of audio after waking up from sleep mode, whereas I had intermittent loss of audio and audio interference, but this is close enough to be worth further investigation.

As a result, I am now going to check if I have the latest AMD drivers on my NUC.

[haggis999]

....... I am now going to check if I have the latest AMD drivers on my NUC.

I've just updated the NUC to use the very latest AMD Radeon drivers, but it has made no difference. I still have audio quality issues after it awakes from sleep mode. The search for answers continues....

[RoderickGI]

Did you actually just change the Sleep setting to make it work properly, or did you select the High Performance power plan?

Whichever plan you are using when it doesn't work, check all the detailed setting under "Change plan settings > Change advanced power settings". If using Wireless, check the Wireless settings, then USB and Processor power settings. If Windows is trying to minimise processor power usage it could be affecting audio performance. Also the Multimedia Setting of course.

Basically, check everything and compare them to the settings used when the issue doesn't occur.

By comparing detailed settings when it works, and when it doesn't, find the setting that is causing the problem by changing them one at a time. If it doesn't make sense to leave the setting at the working value permanently, at least it will narrow down the cause for further investigation and correction.

[haggis999]

By comparing detailed settings when it works, and when it doesn't, find the setting that is causing the problem by changing them one at a time. If it doesn't make sense to leave the setting at the working value permanently, at least it will narrow down the cause for further investigation and correction.

Thanks for the suggestion. It could obviously take some time to step through all the advanced power settings one by one, but I can't think of any other way to nail this problem.

[haggis999]

By comparing detailed settings when it works, and when it doesn't, find the setting that is causing the problem by changing them one at a time. If it doesn't make sense to leave the setting at the working value permanently, at least it will narrow down the cause for further investigation and correction.

I started by switching from the Balanced power plan to the High Performance plan. My next two tests of awakening from sleep mode both resulted in a repeat of the crackling background noises in the audio when playing a video via Media Center. I have never used this power plan before on this NUC, but there is a possibility that the suppliers (SimplyNUC UK) might have adjusted some of its settings, so my next step was to restore plan defaults within the Advanced Power Options for the High Performance plan.

Since then, I have tested the NUC after waking from sleep mode on around ten occasions and no audio problems have occurred. Time will tell if I have stumbled across a permanent solution.

However, my changes have screwed up the awakening process. Before, if I woke up the NUC by opening Gizmo it would then display the Windows 10 desktop and wait for me to select a video. No Windows log in screen appeared, as my normal user account has no password and is configured to log in automatically. Now, as soon as the NUC wakes up, it rather pointlessly shows a Windows log in screen for this account. If I then select a video via Gizmo the audio starts to play but the picture doesn't appear until after I have cleared the log in screen using a keyboard or mouse (neither of which is normally connected to my NUC).   

I reverted back to the Balanced plan and once again got a slick log in (plus my audio issues). Once the audio distortion occurs the only way I have found so far to stop it is to do a reboot. After a reboot, I returned to the High Performance plan and waited for the NUC to go to sleep (for testing purposes I have this set at 3 mins). On reawakening, the audio problem had gone and the pointless log in prompt also reappeared.

[RoderickGI]

What you are actually seeing is an Account setting, not a Power setting. Your Windows 10 is requiring a login after waking from sleep. You can fix that easily as per this (the first option): https://www.top-password.com/blog/stop-windows-10-from-asking-for-password-after-sleep/

I don't know why changing the power plan would change the login process.

I use a normal (non-administrator) User ID for my HTPC, with a password, and have it log in automatically after every reboot. Works fine, and reliably. I would advise adding a password to the account you use, and then setting it to auto login. A quick Google and you will find out how to get that auto login working.

BTW I wasn't suggesting that you permanently use the High Performance power settings, or that you never allow Sleep. Just that you compare the detailed settings between when audio works, and when it doesn't, to try to understand which setting, such as Processor Power Management Minimum Procesor State, as an example, may be causing the issue. So I would be comparing the Balanced Plan with Sleep, to the Balanced Plan without Sleep.

As the issue occurs after Sleep, something isn't being woken to the same state as immediately after a reboot, and based on your reports, never gets returned to that state. It may take a bit of digging to find out what that is.

[haggis999]

What you are actually seeing is an Account setting, not a Power setting. Your Windows 10 is requiring a login after waking from sleep. You can fix that easily as per this (the first option): https://www.top-password.com/blog/stop-windows-10-from-asking-for-password-after-sleep/

I don't know why changing the power plan would change the login process.

I use a normal (non-administrator) User ID for my HTPC, with a password, and have it log in automatically after every reboot. Works fine, and reliably. I would advise adding a password to the account you use, and then setting it to auto login. A quick Google and you will find out how to get that auto login working.

Like you, I fail to see why changing the power plan should have any effect on the login process. However, I followed your advice and gave my HTPC user account a password. I was then surprised to find that Windows only lets you remove the requirement to enter a password after sleep when logged in as an administrator and then it applies to all user accounts, including the admin account. I was assuming it would let me make that setting at the account level, as that seems a safer approach. If I end up returning to using a Balanced power plan, I may revert to my previous user account settings where auto login worked fine.

BTW I wasn't suggesting that you permanently use the High Performance power settings, or that you never allow Sleep. Just that you compare the detailed settings between when audio works, and when it doesn't, to try to understand which setting, such as Processor Power Management Minimum Procesor State, as an example, may be causing the issue. So I would be comparing the Balanced Plan with Sleep, to the Balanced Plan without Sleep.

As the issue occurs after Sleep, something isn't being woken to the same state as immediately after a reboot, and based on your reports, never gets returned to that state. It may take a bit of digging to find out what that is.

Sadly, since my last post I experienced my audio distortion problem after twice waking up from sleep while using the High Performance setting, which has made diagnosing the cause more difficult.

BTW, I always get the following JRiver error message after rebooting my NUC. I haven't mentioned it before, as it seemed to be irrelevant to my sleep-related issues. Opening Media Center manually after a reboot seemed to eliminate any continuing problems (until the next reboot). Despite reinstalling Media Center 24 a couple of times, this problem has not gone away.

   Critical error
   The following module has failed to load:
   C:\Program Files\J River\Media Center 24\Media Center 24.exe

   It has reported the following error:
   A JRiver Media Core component failed to load the product info file:

   Please reinstall the latest version of the program.   

[RoderickGI]

Yes, I would expect that login requirement to be at the User Account level, not global. But I see what you mean.

Microsoft has continually removed that level of control that used to be available for User Accounts under Windows NT. It looks like they have simplified further. Maybe there is a way to set it at the User Account level through Group Policies or similar. I haven't looked for that, but a search may find a way to do it. At the moment it doesn't bother me, as the only time my HTPC is logged in with an Administrator Account is when I am doing maintenance on it. If I have to leave the HTPC while logged on as Administrator and there are people around, I can just lock the PC and a password will still be required to unlock it.

You will need to start to look at CPU and Memory load when the problem occurs. GPU load as well if you are running complex visualisations. Task Manager and Process Explorer (Googe that) can help with doing that among other utilities.


The "The following module has failed to load:" message is usually an Antivirus problem. Search the forum and web for hints on how to fix it. Usually it just means configuring your Antivirus solution to allow MC components. If you are just using Windows Defender there is an extensive thread on Taming it on the forum. Search for "Taming Windows Defender". Using a Registry Cleaner can also cause these sorts of issues, as it breaks MC Registry entries. But a reinstall should fix that.

Note also that if your Antivirus is being overly aggressive in doing its job, that could be the cause of your audio distortion, as the Antivirus delays access to files while it checks them. Using High Performance power settings would mask that somewhat, as the CPU isn't being throttled and so there is no ramp-up time to get the CPU up to speed in order to cater for the Antivirus load.

[haggis999]

Yes, I would expect that login requirement to be at the User Account level, not global. But I see what you mean.

Microsoft has continually removed that level of control that used to be available for User Accounts under Windows NT. It looks like they have simplified further. Maybe there is a way to set it at the User Account level through Group Policies or similar. I haven't looked for that, but a search may find a way to do it. At the moment it doesn't bother me, as the only time my HTPC is logged in with an Administrator Account is when I am doing maintenance on it. If I have to leave the HTPC while logged on as Administrator and there are people around, I can just lock the PC and a password will still be required to unlock it.

I'm also not too bothered by this, for the same reasons as you have quoted. However, in other scenarios it could perhaps lead to security issues, which is why I was surprised that Microsoft chose to go down that route (if a Group Policies solution exists it's unlikely to be simple).

You will need to start to look at CPU and Memory load when the problem occurs. GPU load as well if you are running complex visualisations. Task Manager and Process Explorer (Google that) can help with doing that among other utilities.

I will make a point of firing up Task Manager next time I hear any audio distortion.

The "The following module has failed to load:" message is usually an Antivirus problem. Search the forum and web for hints on how to fix it. Usually it just means configuring your Antivirus solution to allow MC components. If you are just using Windows Defender there is an extensive thread on Taming it on the forum. Search for "Taming Windows Defender". Using a Registry Cleaner can also cause these sorts of issues, as it breaks MC Registry entries. But a reinstall should fix that.

Note also that if your Antivirus is being overly aggressive in doing its job, that could be the cause of your audio distortion, as the Antivirus delays access to files while it checks them. Using High Performance power settings would mask that somewhat, as the CPU isn't being throttled and so there is no ramp-up time to get the CPU up to speed in order to cater for the Antivirus load.

I have never used a registry cleaner on my NUC, but I followed your advice to search for 'Taming Windows Defender' and found an article of that name in the JRiver knowledgebase. It advised me to exclude the 'C:\Users\<USERNAME>\AppData\Roaming\J River' folder from Windows Defender. This has now been done, but it had no effect on my "The following module has failed to load:" error message.

I then tried disabling every option in the Windows Defender settings, which also failed to prevent that MC error after a reboot.
 

[haggis999]

You will need to start to look at CPU and Memory load when the problem occurs. GPU load as well if you are running complex visualisations. Task Manager and Process Explorer (Google that) can help with doing that among other utilities.

Note also that if your Antivirus is being overly aggressive in doing its job, that could be the cause of your audio distortion, as the Antivirus delays access to files while it checks them. Using High Performance power settings would mask that somewhat, as the CPU isn't being throttled and so there is no ramp-up time to get the CPU up to speed in order to cater for the Antivirus load.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by 'complex visualisations', but JRiver Media Center is the only end-user application I am running on my NUC and I am not making use of MadVR.

Process Explorer is new to me. I was about to give it a try, but got the warning message 'Windows Defender SmartScreen prevented an unrecognised app from starting. Running this app might put your PC at risk'.

I checked Task Manager this afternoon during a period of mild audio distortion (after waking from sleep mode). CPU was no more than 10%, with MC being the highest user at around 3.5%. Memory usage was 31%, with MC again the highest user. GPU was at 33%, though I was a little puzzled that every app was always shown as using 0% GPU even after watching it for several minutes. 

Sleep mode was then disabled and the NUC rebooted to fix the audio issues. The Task Manager GPU reading was then a little lower at around 28% and this time three apps flash up occasionally as GPU users. They are MC, Desktop Window Manager and Client Server Runtime Process (at around 22, 6 and 0.1% respectively). 

 

[DJLegba]

As you're having trouble with Windows direct audio I suggest you'll be better off using WASAPI and redirecting your troubleshooting to making video playback work that way.

[haggis999]

As you're having trouble with Windows direct audio I suggest you'll be better off using WASAPI and redirecting your troubleshooting to making video playback work that way.

I tried using the "DENON-AVAMP (AMD High Definition Audio Device) [WASAPI]" setting nearly two weeks ago and it stopped my videos from playing. However, I've just tried it again and it works fine. Very strange...

I will report back tomorrow if it fixes my audio issues when awakening from sleep mode. Thanks for prompting me to check out WASAPI again.

[haggis999]

My previous "The following module has failed to load:" error message from JRiver has now been fixed by uninstalling Media Center 24 (including the removal of all registry settings) and then reinstalling it.

Sadly, I can't say the same about switching to the WASAPI audio driver. I still get scratchy background noises after waking the NUC from sleep mode. During a particularly noisy period I noticed that GPU usage had risen to around 50%.

I'm also now getting the following error message every time I try to initiate video playback.
 
     Playback could not be started using the format: 48kHz 24bit 5ch.
     This format would work: 48kHz 24bit 2ch.
     Would you like to have your DSP Studio > Output Format settings changed automatically?

When I decline this offer and take the option to Cancel Playback, the video is then quite happy to start playing in 48kHz 24bit 6ch mode! This behaviour seems a little perverse. My DSP Output Format settings are to use 'Source number of channels' with 'Silent subwoofer'. Any inputs at or under 192kHz are left unchanged.

[Hendrik]

WASAPI typically doesn't support 5ch playback. You could setup mixing in Media Center to mix to your number of physical speakers.

[haggis999]

WASAPI typically doesn't support 5ch playback. You could setup mixing in Media Center to mix to your number of physical speakers.

Since my previous post, I've realised that my 'Playback could not be started using the format: 48kHz 24bit 5ch' error only appears to affect one of the Blu-ray rips in my collection, which may well mean that it is the only one to have been recorded in 5.0 format.

DSP Output Format doesn't actually offer an exact match for my number of physical speakers, which is 5.0, just like the Blu-ray rip mentioned above. The nearest option is mixing to 5.1 with a silent subwoofer, but I don't want stereo sources changed to 5.1. Does ticking the box for mixing stereo to 2.1 degrade the original stereo signal in any way when a subwoofer is not present?   

[jmone]

Yeah there can be all sorts of odd # of channels (LOTR and Star Wars has 6.1 mixes).  Anyway, you can create Zones for this - https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Zones and then use Zone Switch to detect it has a 5.0 mix and then switch to that zone and the rest for your current zone.  Sent up the new Zone to mix your audio to 5.1.

[haggis999]

Yeah there can be all sorts of odd # of channels (LOTR and Star Wars has 6.1 mixes).  Anyway, you can create Zones for this - https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Zones and then use Zone Switch to detect it has a 5.0 mix and then switch to that zone and the rest for your current zone.  Sent up the new Zone to mix your audio to 5.1.

I've had a look at using zones for this purpose, but am struggling with the final step of setting up an automatic zone switch with a rule that selects only 5.0 channel recordings. Checking the value of the Channels tag is no use here, as both 5.0 and 5.1 channel recordings are listed as 5 channels. Am I going to have to create a custom tag to make this distinction?

EDIT:  I've gone ahead and added a custom tag to distinguish my 5.0 channel videos (two found so far) from all others and ZoneSwitch successfully switches zones to match the value of that tag. However, when you ask Gizmo and JRemote to switch from a 'Player' Zone recording that is in full-screen mode to a '5.0 zone' recording, that 5.0 video only appears in the mini window in the bottom left corner of MC (the same applies if I switch zones in the other direction). The Playing Now window in Gizmo/JRemote also fails to reflect the change to a new video in the other zone.

Is there a way around these limitations?