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[whoareyou]

I'm new to using JRiver for video.  It's mostly excellent, however once in a while I'll start Blu-ray playback (MakeMKV backup), and the video will play fine for about 5 seconds then take a jump / slight stutter.  Play fine for another 5 seconds or so, then take another kind of stutter jump.   

99% of time playback is perfect, but when it occurs the time interval between skips seems very consistent. 

The only way I've found to work around this is to start and then stop a 2nd video (which has always played correctly).  I then stop the 2nd video and restart the original, which will now play without the jump. 

Any suggestions/settings to look at that might help with this?

[RD James]

Try enabling VideoClock.

[whoareyou]

Thanks.  I was already running with that setting enabled.  I've also tried disabling video clock -> restarting video.  No effect.
Reenabling video clock and restarting video.  No effect.


There just seems to be some kind of timing issue that is slightly off, but I can't figure out which setting is responsible. And once a video acts up, it just gets "stuck" with that issue.

I've tried Red October HQ / standard.  Enabled/disabled windowed mode. Enabled / Disabled hardware support.

[tij]

what antivirus do you use?

[JimH]

Try looking here for ideas:

https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,24031.0.html

[whoareyou]

I'm using Windows defender.  As far as that, I'll double check the exclusion list, but I already configure system to exclude the JRiver stuff.   I'll also take a look at the link.

The odd thing is how intermittent it is.  Initially, after starting with the whole video usage, I had same issue with an older graphics card / computer, but I thought it was due to being underpowered. I upgraded to new processor and graphics.

That greatly improved other aspects of JRiver video, but the occasional skip remains.

What I find unusual is how this occurs only at initial playback.  But … if playback begins correctly, it will play to end no issues.  Then, when playback starts incorrectly I can only correct by starting playback on a second video, stopping that one, then restarting the original. 

So, I'm not sure why simply stopping and restarting the original will not correct the issue.  Something to do with the playback seems to be cached, and the only way to reset everything is to play that 2nd video before restarting the original. 

Also, the skip/jumps seem to repeat at the same exact time intervals.  They don't appear randomly. 

I've also looked at resource monitor.  There was no unexpected disk activity on the directory of video in question.

For now it's not so bad since it's a quick fix to get going.

Any other suggestions, let me know.

Thanks

[tij]

What do you normally use?  RO Standard or HQ?

Also what video card do you use?

Which video skips? 1080p or 20160p or both?

Are your videos on a local HDD or on a NAS? (if NAS how you connect to it - 1Gb ethernet/100Mb ethernet/wifi)?

Are you playing from your PC to TV or sending video to TV using DLNA (if later, how TV connects to network - 1Gb ethernet/100Mb ethernet/wifi)?

PS: I use RO HQ, all my video stutters for few seconds at the beginning as TV is switching to correct resolution/refresh rate and video buffers are initially filled - then it's smooth

PSS: if you are using RO HQ - could you please attach a screen shot of MadVR overlay info (press Ctr+J to bring it up) when video stutters

[whoareyou]

What do you normally use?  RO Standard or HQ?
HQ / windowed mode

Also what video card do you use?
Nvidia 1650 Super

Which video skips? 1080p or 20160p or both?
I only play 1080p

Are your videos on a local HDD or on a NAS? (if NAS how you connect to it - 1Gb ethernet/100Mb ethernet/wifi)?
Local

Are you playing from your PC to TV or sending video to TV using DLNA (if later, how TV connects to network - 1Gb ethernet/100Mb ethernet/wifi)?
HDMI

PS: I use RO HQ, all my video stutters for few seconds at the beginning as TV is switching to correct resolution/refresh rate and video buffers are initially filled - then it's smooth
Yes I occasionally see that at startup, but that stutter is completely different from my intermittent issue. Perhaps I shouldn't be calling this a stutter.  It's more a slight glitch that happens at regular intervals. 

PSS: if you are using RO HQ - could you please attach a screen shot of MadVR overlay info (press Ctr+J to bring it up) when video stutters
I'll try and get that next time issue occurs - but it's very intermittent.   Could take a while.

Thanks

[tij]

You don't have to capture madVR info screen exactly when stutter occur … when video start showing problem you describe, just press CTR+J and take a screenshot (with mobile phone) at any time … just want to see the environment under which this occur

From what you describe, you know which video have this problem … just run them and if issue starts - capture madVR info screen (again - does not have to be at the exact moment when stutter occur)

[JimH]

whoareyou,

You can use the quote tag like this:

[ quote ]
What tij said
[ /quote ]
What you said

but you need to remove the spaces that I put inside the tags.  Then it looks like this:

What tij said

What you said

[arcspin]

Hi,
If you have an NVIDIA-card, try set the Vertical sync to "ON" in the Manage 3D settings in NVIDIA control panel, that completely solved the micro stutter I had in MadVR Fullscreen Windowed mode.
You can also,in MadVR, try to set present frames in advance to 1. That has also fixed the issue for many, including me.

[whoareyou]

Thanks.  I'll try those settings for Nvidia and MadVR

[whoareyou]

madVR settings overlay attached

[tij]

madVR settings overlay attached

You playing 24fps material at 60fps ... allow MadVR to switch frame rate ... and specify what it can switch to ... 1080p23, 2160p23

I am not at home now ... so don’t remember where those settings are in MadVR ... will post later when home

EDIT: sorry ... you playing 30fps on 60fps ... that should be OK ... will look at this in more details later

[tij]

Try to increase present queu to 8 ... in MadVR option [rendering] ->[windowed mode]->[how many video frames shall be presented in advance]

It’s strange ... rendering times are well within limits ... yet not so small amount of drop and repeated frames (unless you have been fast forwarding)

Is there anything on your system that might be using GPU ...  f.lux is known to interfere with MadVR

PS. What GPU are you using?

PSS. Also it seems you playing 1080i ... I am not aware of Blu-ray with interlaced content ... can you confirm that what you playing is interlaced (otherwise it seems MadVR is trying to deinterlaced your progressive video)

PSS. If you could attached your MadVR setting.bin file too

[whoareyou]

Machine is dedicated to JRiver.  I'll sometimes use browser while video is playing.  I continuously switch from movie to movie and track to track via the menus.  Perhaps it's the constant starting of new videos and moving between tracks?    That's my wild guess. 

But keep in mind that the video looks excellent.  If I was really having a problem with dropped frames I'm fairly certain I'd notice it.  As comparison, comparing 1080p playback between my oppo 205 & PC I can't tell the difference (maybe someone with better eyes).  It's a very long time since I last tried PC video, and I'm truly amazed that I can get such high quality

And remember, my issue is the very occasional timed stutter that I described in previous post.

Meanwhile I'll configure present queue and see if that makes a difference.  Also, I'll configure my TV's resolutions.

BTW - Perhaps you can explain a bit more about frame drop?

The overlay info shows 1 drop / 1.71 hours.  Ok, that seems negligible.

So what does dropped frames / repeated frames represent?

Thanks for the help

[tij]

1 drop in 1.71 hours refer to your video and audio clock deviation (they are not exactly same) ... madVR will drop one frame in 1.71 hoyrs to keep audio and video in sync

other drop frame indicates how many frames were drop because your GPU could not render that frame in time (maybe scalinng algorithm you chose is too complex for your GPU to handle)

for 30 frames per second contents ... madVR has 1/30=0.033s=33ms to render each frame ... if rendering takes longer ... that frame will be dropped

your rendering times are waaay within that limit (you actually using quite simple scaling algorithm ... there are higger quality available in madVR if your GPU can handle it)

to actual problem though ... if other programs you running together with MC try to update their windows while you watching movie full screen ... there will be stutter

for example ... if i run programs thay keeps tabs on exchange rates and uptates its window to show results, everytime that updates happen - madVR will stutter (minimizing it that program dont help ... only minimizing it to tray solves the problem)

so if you run something similar while watching mivie ... stutter will happen

EDIT: repeated frames are used when content frame rate does not match screen frame rates ... in your case this might be applycable https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=117282.0

[RoderickGI]

When activating the madVR OSD to debug video I always find it useful to start the video playing, display the madVR OSD, let the video settle, and then press Ctrl+R to reset the various measurements, and only then take notice of what the madVR OSD is showing.

That will clear up the initial dropped and repeated frames associated with starting the video, and give a better indication of what is going on.

I think these questions are pretty important. You should answer them Whoareyou.

PS. What GPU are you using?

PSS. Also it seems you playing 1080i ... I am not aware of Blu-ray with interlaced content ... can you confirm that what you playing is interlaced (otherwise it seems MadVR is trying to deinterlaced your progressive video)

PSS. If you could attached your MadVR setting.bin file too

This certainly sounds like a web page, or some other application that uses a display such as a browser, refreshing content.

And remember, my issue is the very occasional timed stutter that I described in previous post.

But your method of clearing the issue, as described in the first post, probably wouldn't work if it was just a web page refresh. Although Chrome has been doing some weird stuff lately, and seems to be running a lot of processes for the number of tabs it has open. It could be the cause.

[whoareyou]

I think these questions are pretty important. You should answer them Whoareyou.

Thanks for that.  Somehow I missed the questions - and they are important (Sorry tij). 

GPU

Nvidia 1650 Super

.bin file

I'll have to get that at later time.

PSS. Also it seems you playing 1080i ... I am not aware of Blu-ray with interlaced content ... can you confirm that what you playing is interlaced (otherwise it seems MadVR is trying to deinterlaced your progressive video)

This is the interesting one to me.  I have no idea why it's being deinterlaced.  I can't find anything (upstream?) that is configured that would cause this and the Blu-ray is definitely 1080p.

So based on that, I configured madVR settings to never try to determine if it should deinterlace, but I don't think I should have to do this. 

So couple things about those dropped frames. The Ctrl-r refresh was key to getting to the bottom of this.  Most of the dropped frames resulted from all the junk playing leading up to the main menu.  And that's what the jpg that I attached in this thread represented. 

Pressing Ctrl-r after the actual movie was playing then showed very few dropped frames. 

Then, after configuring madVR to make sure it used progressive playback the dropped frames remained at 0. 

So that's where I am.  From what I understand about these stats, everything looks much better, but..... 

it seems as though something is still off in that MadVR doesn't correctly recognize the progressive material.

But progress.

Thanks very much RoderickGI and tij !!!

You've both been very helpful.

Now, when I get a chance, I'll need to learn some more about MadVR.

[tij]

Upstream in this case is LAV filter ... so LAV filter is telling MadVR content is interlaced

Use mediaInfo to look at tech properties of your video ... post it here if you want us to look at it ... if it’s really LAV at fault ... then maybe Hendrick can look at it ... after all he wrote that filter

[whoareyou]

Not really sure what best report from mediainfo is.  Let me know if you need something else.  To me it looks like the video is really interlaced.  I compared this to another video which shows a scan type of progressive.

I also encountered that occasional skip while testing.  I'm going to pay closer attention but I believe the issue only occurs on interlaced.  I also suspect that the way I "clear" the issue is by switching to a progressive video and then back to this one.   I'll need to verify that.

[tij]

Ahhh ... it’s concert ... that can certainly be interlaced material

Not much control of deinterlacing in MadVR ... try forcing film mode and compare to force video mode ... sometimes MadVR might choose not optimal way to deinterlace” ... bad deinterlacing can certainly cause some stuttering

If force film mode is correct ... in Ctr+J info MadVR should list detected cadence like 3:2 or some other ... if it can detect no cadence, then likely force video mode is better for deintelacing

EDIT: this might help and shed some light on concerts videos https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=117693.0