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[ashawley]

Well, we can always bombard Apple about the Playcount file.  I've submitted my enhancement request.  If you want to, do so here.

Adam

[JimH]

It would be nice if you could also mention MC.  Good luck.

[moriarty]

Steven G:

Tried 9.097 w/ Windows ME and finally got the plug in to work (thanks).  Successfully transfered some files.

Only problem:  My 10 GB IPOD is still only showing up in MC as having 2.000 GB of space (interesting that it's an even 2.000).  I updated and reformatted, but that's all I get.  When I open it in Explorer it shows the true 9.4 GB of free space.  Hmm....

Worst is that if I try to transfer more than 2GB, I get an not enough space message and the transfer fails.   (note:  had the same problem in an earlier build).

Oh, and it still doesnt' recognize my CD player w/ my WIN ME config ... but that's for a separate thread.

[willrmc]

so if i select "select all" will it even put the songs not on any playlists? i will try it tonight, thanks again steve.

[ashawley]

It would be nice if you could also mention MC.  Good luck.

Jim:

The arrogance of Apple's employee's would probably make this more of a hindrance than anything else.

You should see what they are telling people.  Over the last few days I've heard comments such as:

"The iPod was really only designed for a Mac, if you're a windows user, well you've gotten as much help as you're going to get"

and,

"Well, the iPod was pretty much designed as a trojan horse for windows users to get them to switch, we're never going to build iTunes for windows" [good for you guys ].

Can you believe that?  The quotes are from folks at MWSF and an Apple store respectively.  With arrogance like this, I think I'm ready to switch, don't you think.  

I'll switch when they pull MC9 from my cold dead mouse(hand)  

Adam

[TimB]

"The iPod was really only designed for a Mac, if you're a windows user, well you've gotten as much help as you're going to get"

I also heard this, at my local (Tysons Corner, VA) Apple Store.

-=Tim=-

[Kurt Young]

Tim, Adam,

That's intolerable.  Write letters -- not just letters but letters to someone with clout.  If that doesn't work, you could write zdnet or Maximum PC.  

(However, adam, I wouldn't have chosen bombard heh.  Them's fightin words to server ops.)

[RandyP]

Dear Apple,

As a devoted user of your WinPod (iPod 4 Windows), I'd like to make a request. The "Play Count" file is not updated when WinPod plays files - I, and other programmers, have looked at this in detail.

We would all be most pleased if you would have the WinPod firmware perform like the MacPod firmware, and update the Play Count file. Since you haven't made iTunes for Windows, we have to make plug-ins and hacks to make the iPod truly functional under Windows. MusicMatch is quite limited in its scope; MediaJukebox / MediaCenter is far more powerful and friendly, and an excellent driver for the iPod. XPlay is also good, but they see no Play Count updates, either.

I hope you intend to provide WinPod a high level of support. The PC base is the world's largest installed base, and you have made a winning product. However, the word on the street is that iPod/Win is a "Trojan Horse designed to win Mac customers". I only bought iPod for its own design qualities, and can't possibly switch to Macs. Please provide Windows customers such as myself a high level of support, so we can tell our friends how well it all works.

Randy

That's what I sent Apple. If I hear anything back, I'll pass it on. I'm willing to bet they won't be so arrogant in an e-mail.  

[ashawley]

Tim, Adam,

That's intolerable.  Write letters -- not just letters but letters to someone with clout.  If that doesn't work, you could write zdnet or Maximum PC.  

(However, adam, I wouldn't have chosen bombard heh.  Them's fightin words to server ops.)

Hehe, good point Kurt.  But a few smartbombs into Cupertino might get their attention.....no, I didn't really say that..  

Oh, and for folks that haven't check out the post in the 'lounge MC9 board, you might want to check out this post for a solution to some MC9 performance issues.  Thanks to Randy (ipod_devotee).

Steve:

Rock solid build. Update tags is working again, Delete files is working and....drum roll......updating Playlists that are based off of other playlists works.  Yippy!!!  

The only bug that I could find was the "blank" playlist one.  I have all my playlists, but there's one that has no title and no songs on it (but there's an ">" next to it on the iPod).  It doesn't show up in MC9 so I can't delete it.  I started w/a fresh Format for MJ.


Adam

[bellipod]

Mine has the exact same thing, but I still have the playlist problem.  It did transfer more of my playlists than other versions/builds but still not all of them.  And, I have reformatted/started over a few times with it.

[bellipod]

And now when I hook up my iPod, MC9 just shuts down (but tries to send error reporting to Microsoft first  ).

Yes, I am using 9.0.97 with the plug-in .43    I'll look for more updates tomorrow.  

[SteveG]

Everyone,

As always thanks to all for lobbying on our behalf here and abroad.

In regards to Randy's (iPod Devotee) bug that is referenced in Adam's post, this should be resolved in the build of MC 9 from yesterday.

Will,

If you select all playlists, it will only put music on that is in a playlist.  However, by default (or you could create it) there is a smartlist for "All Music" which will cover all your tunes.

Adam and Bellipod

Can you give me any tips on how to duplicate the blank Playlist thing?


Bellipod,

The MC9 shut down thing is weird. Can you give me more details. Is the pattern that you have iPod connected, you run MC9, click on iPod and then the crash? This could be possible if you have a corrupt database on iPod. Could you try formatting the iPod from within Windows (not just the right-click in MC) and then reconnect?  

[willrmc]

Steve,
Initially it looked as though everything were fixed, my tags all updated as they should have been and all. then i tried to sync my playlists and it started but said there were 14000 files to transfer. i only have 2200 in my library and only 1000 of those are actually in playlists so i was suspicious there. once it finished everytime i clicked on the ipod letter in mc9 it would crash, so then i tried formatting it with the ipod updater, once i did that i could view it again without the crashes. so then i did a complete sync again and it seems all of my files made it over, but only half of my playlists and now again if i try to view the ipods contents in mc9 it crashes. i know we had some similar crashes early on with the plugin, maybe its the same bug. and as for the playlist thing im not sure. i hope i've been specific enough, if not i will test further tonight. thanks
-will

[cct1]

Windows ME:

First synch (after a reformat) last night went great--all lists/songs synched, no blank playlist at the bottom.

But then....I changed some tags, added some files, and tried a synch with the delete files option checked, and all hell broke loose.  I got a partial synch, and a blank file at the bottom.  Following this partial synch, MC9 would no longer recognize the ipod--the handheld PDA-like icon was still there, but it did nothing if I right clicked on it.  Left clicking caused a "DLL Handheld" error and shut MC9 down.

I restored my ipod, reformatted, resynched  (delete button unchecked this time as I didn't need it) and everything went just fine.

Incidentally, on the first synch, I was getting a message of a transfer rate of ~8kb/sec--but in reality it was much slower than this.  After the restore/reformat I get a transfer rate of about  7.0 kb/sec, and its for real  (very nice)--so it wasn't a total loss.

At least I can get my tunes on the ipod now.  

[benmaxwell]

Steve,

I just had the same bug as Bellipod.  The irony is that everything was running fine with the new version .97 and the new .43 ipod plugin until I flushed the library (cleaned then reimported all songs) and then restarted my system.  

I restored the ipod using apple's updater, formatted for MC, then resynced.  At the end of the sync, MC crashed.  I restarted it, and all the songs were on the ipod.  I then added three new tunes to the library, and did a sync... afterwards, I then checked the "~d=a" search to see what the database was showing, and just like adam posted above, I had duplicate entries in the database...  Cleaned it out, synced again, and sure enough there are four duplicate database entries for every song (all residing on the ipod) back in the database.

kooky.

-ben

Everyone,

Bellipod,

The MC9 shut down thing is weird. Can you give me more details. Is the pattern that you have iPod connected, you run MC9, click on iPod and then the crash? This could be possible if you have a corrupt database on iPod. Could you try formatting the iPod from within Windows (not just the right-click in MC) and then reconnect?  

[SteveG]

Everyone,

I just found and fixed a bug that is probably causing the problems you are seeing. Please look for a new build of the Plugin and MC at the end of the day.


Will,

Do not be alarmed by the large number of files when synching all playlists. This is a result of files being in multiple playlists which causes the count to swell.

Ben,

Some duplication will occur but is not a problem. The duplicates should flush when you close and reopen MC. This will be improved in this afternoon's build.

[moriarty]

Steve,

Any thoughts on why MC is only seeing 2.000 GB of free space on my 10GB IPOD?  

I've reset/reformatted a couple of times now, but it alwasy shows only 2GB (and exactly 2GB) free.  

Thanks.

[IDSmoker]

Audible Files/Playlists not transferring to iPod

While trying to use MC9 to get my music on my iPod over the weekend, I noticed that nothing I did would get any of my Audible files (FileName: *.aa ) to transfer to the iPod.

Originally, I created a Smartlist with the rule that restricted it to only "*.aa" files.  This correctly listed the files within MC9.  But when I finally got most of the other play/smart lists transferred, I noticed that the "Books" list hadn't transferred.  I tried a couple more times to "sync" this list without luck.

Finally, I tried to select the Audible files within the Media Library and use the "Send To..." command.  This correctly queued the files for transfer, but when I gave it the "Transfer now" command, it almost immediately came back as if the files had transferred at warp speed.  But they never showed up on the iPod.

I finally ended up using Ephpod to get the audible files over to the iPod and to create a "Books" playlist for them, but I would really like to be able to do this from within MC9.

Has anyone else seen this issue?  

If someone else has managed to get playable audible files onto the ipod using MC9, could you give me a step-by-step description of how you did it?

I'll give it another shot this weekend with the latest version(s), but I thought I should mention this issue, in case it's a recent 'break' in the plugin functionality.

[SteveG]

Everyone,

I have posted a new Plug-in (3.0.44) which should be used with MC 9.0.98 which will be available later today.  This will hopefully resolve some of the synching issues that were introduced recently.

PS I am leaving for the day soon and will not be back until Friday. If I cannot get online before Friday, I will reply then.

Moriarty,

Sorry I didn't reply before. I do not know why this is. I will need to set up a ME box to test this.

IDSmoker,

This should work. Can you try again with the latest versions?  If not, can you send me a file that is failing for you (steve @ jriver.com) and I will fix it.

[moriarty]

Steve,

I think cct1 is operating on ME as well and he hasn't reported the problem.  Sorta makes me think there's an issue w/ my IPOD or setup (although it works fine w/ Ephpod).  

cct1 - can you confirm that MC is recognizing the full free GB capacity of your IPOD.  Also what version of firmware are you using (longshot I know)?

[benmaxwell]

After downloading .98 and .44, I just had the same problem with MC9 crashing when I click on the iPod.  

No big deal, had to do a "Restore" again, reformat in MC, and resync.  Is anyone else getting this problem?

Are these database changes interfering with the recogniz-ablity of the iPod from within MC9?

Everyone,

I have posted a new Plug-in (3.0.44) which should be used with MC 9.0.98 which will be available later today.  This will hopefully resolve some of the synching issues that were introduced recently.

PS I am leaving for the day soon and will not be back until Friday. If I cannot get online before Friday, I will reply then.

[willrmc]

i am having these problems with the new build as well ben. everytime i click on the ipod letter mc9 crashes.

[benmaxwell]

ahh... feels good not to be alone...  

[willrmc]

actually, i just tried to sync my playlists again and it seems only a random portion of them made it on. each time i would sync them, different playlists would make it on.

[RobOK]

Steve,

Any thoughts on why MC is only seeing 2.000 GB of free space on my 10GB IPOD?  

I've reset/reformatted a couple of times now, but it alwasy shows only 2GB (and exactly 2GB) free.  

Thanks.

I am having the same problem, also using Win ME.

[cct1]

I am having the same problem, also using Win ME.

Me too  (also using Win ME).

Moriarty:  I'm using the 1.2.1 firmware  (In fact I had to restore last night after trying a delete synch).  And if you get the chance, see if you are having the problems I posted in the 98 thread  (I know you're having the problem with CDs being recognized; are you able to customize your toolbar, and are you able to use your library to delete files from your hard drive?)

[ashawley]

I too am having the same problem as Willmrc and Ben.

Click on iPod and crash.

Don't want to format w/the Apple updater and not be able to sync w/MC9 either.  I'd have to go back to ephpod.  YUCK!  

Darn Steve, and yesterday's build was so sweet.  

Adam

[RobOK]

and are you able to use your library to delete files from your hard drive?)

When I delete from my hard drive from the library I get a UNICOWS crash, ugly!  moo.

The issue with it transferring thousands of files.... when i cancelled midstream I could still look at the iPod fine.  It has a play list called "All Music" which I have never created.  Does that exist on the iPod by default?  How can I clear that up?

[RobOK]

answer to my own question...  my Sych was synchronizing the Auto Playlist called All Music.  I did not expect that the contracted list would have the playlists checked by default (or maybe I hit select all at some point).

I still show only 2.000 GB though.

[benmaxwell]

Adam,

As soon as I restored the ipod, and reformatted for MC9, I was able to sync -- maybe even a little faster than before...  I'm hoping that I won't have to to it a 3rd time... but I chalk it up to growing pains...  

selfish grovel: don't go back!  We need your expertise!

That ~d=a thing is fixed, btw.  

I too am having the same problem as Willmrc and Ben.

Click on iPod and crash.

Don't want to format w/the Apple updater and not be able to sync w/MC9 either.  I'd have to go back to ephpod.  YUCK!  

Darn Steve, and yesterday's build was so sweet.  

Adam

[moriarty]

are you able to customize your toolbar, and are you able to use your library to delete files from your hard drive?)

I get the same unicow error when deleting.  ME strikes again.  I've never messed w/ the toolbar before so I'm not sure what it should do but ... it looks like I can delete things but I can't add them back (w/out resetting).  Also the text on the icons all says 'import media' which may be right, but shouldn't it say what the icon does functionally?

Robok/cct1 - thanks for the confirmation on the 2GB deal ... I thought it was just me and I can't tell you how many times I reformatted (even reloaded MMJB just to start the whole process over from scratch incase I missed something).  

Misery loves company.

[ashawley]

Adam,

As soon as I restored the ipod, and reformatted for MC9, I was able to sync -- maybe even a little faster than before...  I'm hoping that I won't have to to it a 3rd time... but I chalk it up to growing pains...  

selfish grovel: don't go back!  We need your expertise!

That ~d=a thing is fixed, btw.  

hehe, Ben, I'd never go back.  I just meant that I wasn't going to do the restore through Apples updater for fear that I still wouldn't be able to get MC9 to work.

But, you've convinced me.  Imma gonna go for it.  

****EDIT***
You are correct sir.   Doing a Restore, then connecting to MC9 and doing a Format for MJ solves the problem.

YIPPY!!!!  

Adam

[SteveG]

Everyone,

I am out of town. Sorry for any problems. I will get on this on Friday and try to sort out whatever is going on.

Steve

[ashawley]

actually, i just tried to sync my playlists again and it seems only a random portion of them made it on. each time i would sync them, different playlists would make it on.

Found the same problem-not a playlists are making it over on subsequent syncs.  

Steps to reproduce:

1. Format iPod w/Apple Updater
2. Format iPod for MJ
3. Upload Playlists (note: like most I have one master playlist and 4 others that are based off of it)
4. Checked iPod, all playlists present
5. No changes made, sync'd again (done w/nothing checked, Delete checked, Update checked and Delete and Update checked w/same results)--not all playlists are displayed on the iPod.
6. Check Playlist in MC9, they are all their.
7. Delete all Playlists in MC9
8. Re-sync: All Playlists are now present.

Seems any subsequent sync will delete some of the playlists (the songs are there, but the Playlist entry gets messed up).

Adam

[RandyP]

MC did tell me that my iPod might not be formatted for MC.  So....I hit OK and right-clicked on the iPod before Windows could shut it down

Do you have any other iPod software installed? I have to uninstall XPlay to use MC and vice versa, or they interact with each other. Both take notice of an iPod connecting and start to work with it... it is just a disk drive from an OS standpoint, so nothing is preventing both programs from reading and writing to it simultaneously. I saw it earlier today when my transfers to the iPod were around 6Mb/s (unusual). I uninstalled XPlay, re-re-formatted the iPod, and the transfer was back to 9Mb/s in the display (2.5 GHz P4). The display typically starts a 3000-file transfer at 9.0Mb/s, and ends up at 8.1Mb/s at the end of the transfer.

(The displayed rate seems to apply to any given transfer between the PC and the iPod. If I divide the overall time by the Mb's transferred, the net rate is 7.2 - still very pleasing!)


Back to the question at hand: do we need to right-click the drive button to format?

Steve... how about incorporating the Format function inside the "might not be formatted for MC" dialog? If they press the button in the dialog, you can set up MC the way you want it and do the format right then. Even though I personally know what steps to follow, I'd find this preferable, given how often I reformat the iPod.

Good news: I synced a newly-formatted iPod with no problems. I read the stuff on the list and didn't have enough time this evening to do the test, then reload the pod.


Wish list 1: is it time to get the file count right? As I watch the display, it appears you're going through each playlist to register it in the iPod - thus, the file count includes each file's appearance in each Playlist. If you could incorporate all Playlist updates when the data file is first transferred, the appearance would be more natural, and the time estimate more accurate.

Wish list 2a: You mentioned that a file could be queued for transfer by dragging it to the iPod icon. But what if the iPod isn't attached? Could you make a Context Menu option that says "Include in next Synchronization" when the user Right-Clicks a file in the list?

Wish list 2b: If you do 2a, could you expose the flag through IMJFileAutomation, so plug-ins could designate files to be included in the next sync? This would give us lots of flexibility to do things that you might not want to include in the base product. (please, please) The whole issue of file synchronization with an iPod is interesting, as several of us have masters at a given bitrate with iPod copies at sizes that meet our preferences.

thx... see ya Friday... Randy

[cct1]

I get the same unicow error when deleting.  ME strikes again.  I've never messed w/ the toolbar before so I'm not sure what it should do but ... it looks like I can delete things but I can't add them back (w/out resetting).  Also the text on the icons all says 'import media' which may be right, but shouldn't it say what the icon does functionally?


Misery loves company.

Yep--those are the problems I was talking about--thanks for trying it out--I agree  "misery love company,"  it gives me some perverse sense of relief that I'm not the only one experiencing these problems....

[TimB]

I haven't posted on the iPod threads for awhile as (as noted elsewhere) I've been ripping my CD collection and I've been scared on .9x releases particularly as I have Win98 on my desktop/MP3Server.

Well I've finished the mega-rip and just installed .98 on my laptop (which is where I load my iPod from), still a little chicken on the desktop. )  I lost all the Playlists I had had before on my laptop which was unfortunate as I'm not sure I remember half the commands I'd learned here, but I'll be asking.

I formatted my iPod with MC and I'm doing a very straightforward sync based on highlighting files, right-click moving to Playlist and then sync'ing with that playlist.

So far, so good.

(Just thought I'd post a positive note!)

-=Tim=-

[newhere]

Hi all

I have two questions, one is a little off- plug-in topic but probably easy to answer:
What is the standby time of the iPod (I have a 20gb model)? It seems to me that, if I do not listen to any music, the charge of the iPod is gone after about four to five days max. My cell phone has a battery that is probably smaller and its display is constantly running and it lasts for eight or more days. Now the iPod does not even have the display running so what is eating up the charge? Is my iPod broken (4 months old)!? I know the pure playtime of the iPod is 10 to 11 hours but I never used it that long without interruption.

The other question I have has been answered in part earlier: I was wondering if there is a way to get my smart and playlists back from my iPod, since they got erased from my hard drive (and I did try recovery programs wich found things that I erased months ago but not something I erased one day ago, nuts!!!). Steve said it can't be done, so does anyone have a better idea than to sit down and redo the playlists by hand (going through all songs while looking at the list on my iPod)? For the smartlists I do remember the rules I used, sort of, so that won't be that bad. There were two dozen playlists or so... yeah it hurts...

Payam

[RobOK]

I am not at my software to check it out, but to avoid this problem (for me) in the future, is there a way to save Playlists or export them?  (seperate from saving the whole library).  Building on that, would it ever make sense to have an area on this site where we could exchange exported Smartlists?  (I know everyone has different interests and tastes, but whenever anyone tells me what they do with SmartLists, I learn a whole lot!!!! (but I'm a newbie)

[cct1]

Hi all

I have two questions, one is a little off- plug-in topic but probably easy to answer:
What is the standby time of the iPod (I have a 20gb model)? It seems to me that, if I do not listen to any music, the charge of the iPod is gone after about four to five days max. My cell phone has a battery that is probably smaller and its display is constantly running and it lasts for eight or more days. Now the iPod does not even have the display running so what is eating up the charge? Is my iPod broken (4 months old)!? I know the pure playtime of the iPod is 10 to 11 hours but I never used it that long without interruption.

Payam

No, your ipod is not broken--there is a battery drain problem, most likely secondary to the clock, introduced with the ipod 1.2.1 firmware.  We are all eagerly awaiting the next update which will hopefully fix the problem.  Apple essentially refuses to even acknowledge the problem, but hopefully they will remedy it if and when there is another firmware update...

[moriarty]

Hi all

What is the standby time of the iPod (I have a 20gb model)? It seems to me that, if I do not listen to any music, the charge of the iPod is gone after about four to five days max.

4-5 days seems about normal.  There are claims you can improve battery life by basically turning everything off (backlight, equalizer, alarms, etc.) but I don't know if it really helps.  Some people claim that NOT putting it on 'hold' helps, but this really seems like a stretch.

[mindracing]

I installed .98 MC today with .44 plug-in and MC crashed as soon as I started to sync/upload - 1 file or hundreds - same result.

Upgraded to .99MC and the plug-in manager listed that I had a very old version of the iPOD plug-in.

Upgraded to 0.44 - same sync result.

Uninstalled .44 plug-in and shut down MC.

Installed .44 again without MC running and it's now synching fine, albeit slowly, 1.68Mb/s!

Thought this might help anyone having similar non sync problems.

[mindracing]

Just a thought whil watching my synching,

Could someone please tell me what the 'Update tags' option does on the Synch dialogue box.

Thanks.

[TimB]

WinXP Pro
.99
.44

Bit of a mess I...

XP Format
Restore iPod
MC9 Format
Sync to Playlists

One of the last files fails (I THINK its the very last one), message is "File Upload Error Transferring".  I click OK.  Tried this three times, it died on different files each time, no special characters in the name of the 3rd file (I didn't check the other two).

All the files are on the iPod but the last playlist (it has that file above that died) has a blank title and no files underneath it.  My most recent try all the playlists made it including a dummy one beginning with the letter "Z" I put in as a workaround.

I try to use EphPod's Utiltiies to recreate database, search for files, get the darn Playlist back etc.  Only one Playlist is visible after this, two more disappear.

I then run MC9 again, crashes in Media Core every time I select the E drive.  Only solution is to start at the Restore point again.

-=Tim=-

[TimB]

::sigh::

I added another playlist and there was no file failure at the end.  However I had had 6 playlists, after adding the new one I had 4.  Files had detached themselves from playlists.

I went into the iPod from MC9 rightclicking on files to recreate the 2 missing playlists.  WHen I unplugged the iPod the new playlists weren't there.

Went back into the iPod and rightclicked on 3 files to add them to a new playlist.  Unplugged and the new playlist was there.

I'm giving up for now and I'll check in later today.

-=Tim=-

[LarryJoe]

Just want to throw this out - Do you all think it may be a good idea to just have a basic Ipod plugin out there and a souped up beta version?  It seemed that about 20 versions ago, the plugin did the basic stuff right, at least for me anyway.  The introduction of "Update Tags" and other goodies is great, but they introduce other anomolies.  Not complaining here at all as I want the BMW, not the Escort, but would also like the ability to use a basic plugin to go back once I have kicked the tires of the latest beta.  This way I won't have to keep going back and forth from Ephpod to MC and formatting and restoring so much.

Just a thought.

[SteveG]

Everyone,

Things feel a little out of control because there have been so many changes lately.

To try to regain the upper hand, I am going to close this thread. I am going to start two iPod threads. One, for bugs, the other for features and requests. My priority now is to get most people stable and happy with what we have before adding new features. There have been major changes in how the Plug-in interacts with MC9 recently so it is very important that everyone verify that they have Plug-in 3.0.44 and MC 9.0.99. Crashing when clicking on iPod is probable if you are not up to date with MC. Also, if your iPod crashes when you click on the drive letter, try reformatting the iPod from Windows, or to save time, delete your iPodDb file (in iPod_Control\iTunes folder. If you do this, and click on the drive and THEN right click and do reformat, you should have a clean iPod to go forward.

In regards to Playlist handling, I made changes so that random smartlists synch correctly. This modified the way iPod recreates playlists on synch. If you have Playlists\Smartlists that are empty in MC and synch, they will be removed from iPod. This could cause the disappearing Playlist bug that some are reporting.

Steve