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[Philippe]

Dave,

As a work-around, you may configure Converter Options in the conversion menu so that low-rate MP3's are copied onto another folder, leaving your High-rate MP3 sources intact.

Cheers,

[Dave T]

Phillippe:

Unfortunately, that won't work.  I only have 13 gig free, so I won't be able to fit 20 gig of music there.  Looks like I'm out of luck with MC until Matt fixes the temp file/encoder issues.

So.....

I reinstalled MusicMatch, and am in the process of re-transferring my music using MM.  And, I noticed that the transfer rate isn't as fast as I said, at least this time.  Either I was crazy (probably), or it's because I am now doing level-matching.  But, I'm now seeing 10-15 seconds per song, as compared to 30 seconds with MC (transcoding and level matching).  So, MM isn't as much faster at transcoding as I thought, but it's still over twice as fast.  

- Dave

[mclaugh]

SteveG and JimH:
I saw this thread this morning (http://www.musicex.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=beta;action=display;num=1042013878;start=0) and it got me to thinking- why don't we move this thread to the Media Center 9 forum?  While not everyone here is using smartlists (only available in MC9), it would seem logical that people, especially newbies, that follow the FAQ would go there to d/l the newest version, as well as ask questions.
Just a thought.

Back on topic- Start posting Smartlists again!  I just reformatted my computer and have been reconstructing mine, so I'm looking for creative uses of smartlists to help us all fill our Ipod better!

[newhere]

The iPod plugin does not transfer foreign characters? (I just read that in the other forum mclaugh posted (http://www.musicex.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=beta;action=display;n um=1042013878;start=0)). There also is a good suggestion about error messages there.

Payam

I am praying for the day MC and the iPod plugin will show and transfer music of all genders, races and characters.

[Quillo]

Is right, this thread would be better under MC9.  Having lost track of the thread over Christmas I just spent ten minutes trying to find it where I thought it would be - under MC9

[SteveG]

Everyone,

Sorry for the delay in a new Plug-in. Media Center is in a state of flux which is making it difficult to implement stuff right now. I will try to have something going tomorrow.

Steve

[mclaugh]

Latest "problems":

I took the plunge on Sunday and turned my Ephpod Ipod into an MJ Ipod.  I am presently using 9.088 and 3.038, on WinXP.
I see two issues.  First, regardless of whether you manually load the Ipod or sync it with smartlists, the amount of filespace being taken up on the Ipod is not being written.  While I can view on my computer how much space is being used, my Ipod shows this:
songs 946
9.2gig avail
9.2gig capacity

Second issue-  When I synced my Ipod using smartlists, I find the smartlists aren't being written to the Ipod (they should be seen in the 'playlists' menu on the Ipod).  Again, I see them in the Ipod's tree structure on my computer, but on my Ipod, here's what I see:
Essentials  >
                                        >
I've encountered a similar problem when I used Ephpod in the past- I simply plugged the Ipod back in, opened up the program again, and it seemed to take.  I tried this last night using MJ, and it didn't work.

One other question- are the versions I'm using of Media Center (which I shorten to MJ out of habit) and the Ipod plugin the latest?  I know several betas after 88 have been pulled, so I think this is the latest stable one.....

[SteveG]

McLaugh,

Your version of MC is not the latest. Sit tight until later today and I will have some new versions available.

Steve

[mclaugh]

I stayed with 88 because each newer beta was eventually pulled.  How will a new MJ beta affect the Ipod plugin?

[JimH]

 I just want to transcode all the mp3's I have.  You said that I can use any encoder - can you tell me where to find one, or where I can find docs on this?  If there's another mp3 encoder I can use that is faster than LAME, and doesn't have the limitation of leaving all its temp files around, then that sounds like it would solve my issues.

The gogo encoder is faster.  So is frauenhofer's, but you might just lower the bit rate, because it's generally believed that the Lame encoder produces the best sound.

[cct1]

I stayed with 88 because each newer beta was eventually pulled.  How will a new MJ beta affect the Ipod plugin?

I'm kind of in the same boat here.  MC 9 is doing exactly what I need it to do; the only issues I have  (and these are extremely minor issues) are with the ipod plugin.  Will the new plugin update interact differently   (or work better) with the 92 update?  If you would prefer we update to the 92, I'll certainly do it, but if it doesn't make a difference, I'd just as soon stay with the 88 version for now.

[TimB]

As I'm (a) a fairly timid beta tester and (b) in the middle of ripping my CD collection I'm holding off until there's a stable .9x.

-=Tim=-

[SteveG]

Everyone,

Please get MC version 9.0.93 and the latest Plug-in (v 3.0.39). These two together have some major internal reworkings.  The benefit should be that all of the hassling with duplicates should go away.  Also for anyone who was experiencing crashing because of strange characters in the filename, this too is now hopefully resolved.  

Synching may be a little weird until you format for MC because the tracknaming has been reworked.

Please let me know of any problems and I will address them tomorrow.

Thanks,

Steve

[Kurt Young]

Steve, dude,

Now that the composer field is a standard MC9 field, any chance we'll be getting some composer action on our iPods?  

[Dave T]

Steve:

It's kind of a hassle to get this all set up, and then have to re-upload via MM, if there are problems.  So, could you be more specific about what's fixed?  Will this version no longer keep copies of temp files around (will I be able to upload 20 gig of files, with ~only~ 13 gig free on my hard drive)?  Will this version give you an estimate of whether or not the playlist to upload will fit, so you don't have to wait a day or so before you find out that you needed to specify more compression?  Finally - is it any faster?  I don't think I want to use MC9 to upload if it will take longer than 12 hours or so.  

Thanks for your work on this!

- Dave

[benmaxwell]

Steve,

Do you recommend an uninstall of .88 to go to .93, or can the new version be installed overtop the old?  Any ipod plugin reprecussions with this?

-ben

Everyone,

Please get MC version 9.0.93 and the latest Plug-in (v 3.0.39). These two together have some major internal reworkings.  The benefit should be that all of the hassling with duplicates should go away.  Also for anyone who was experiencing crashing because of strange characters in the filename, this too is now hopefully resolved.  

Synching may be a little weird until you format for MC because the tracknaming has been reworked.

Please let me know of any problems and I will address them tomorrow.

Thanks,

Steve

[JimH]

Ben, please wait.  Build 93 will make your hair turn gray.  Tomorrow we should have another build.

[benmaxwell]

Whew! That was close.

Thanks, Jim... I just finished downloading it, and was waiting for a reply.

I must have just gotten an influx of some good karma!

[mclaugh]

JimH- what about the Ipod plugin (vers 39)?  Is this safe to d/l, or is it not worth it?

(It's almost time for me to do my nightly Ipod format/refill- I just want to know if I should d/l and install the new plug!)
Thanks.

[JimH]

Move cautiously tonight.  Best to stand still, if possible.  Ghosts are about tonight.  You can hear chains dragging if you turn the lights off.  Don't do it.

[Seviien]

I've been having a big issue with my ipod when using the two most recent plugins.  I've done some tinkering, and here's what's going on:

Some hardware issue (probably the firewire card) causes occasional, random files to not transfer on their first attempt; these files have only standard characters in their filename and different songs will have issue when transfering the same list multiple times.
When synching, this problem results in the improperly transfered songs being skipped, while all others transfer properly.  On prior builds of the plugin, i could just synch a few times until all files transfered properly.
Doing this with the two most recent builds, however, is not possible becuase of a problem with the playlists: the list of playlists is truncated at the first list containing a song which did not transfer properly at the first synching.  From then on, the ipod's list of playlists does not update upon subsequent synching/file transfers.
I'll probably be getting a new firewire card, but there seems to be some kind of software issue too.  My most recent attempts at synching were with plugin v39 and MC 9.093  (I feel brave ... ;-)
Thanks
~Bryan

[MrVegas]

I have been sitting on the fence for about two weeks.  I want to "convert" my iPod to MC readiness, but the fact that MC9 gives me buffer overrun messages all the time keeps be from doing it.

Also, I just read in this thread that it might take a long time to load songs into the iPod.  Were you kidding when you said 12 hrs for 20 gig?  What are realistic estimates?  I have found Ephpod to be lightning fast.

[mclaugh]

Seviien:
I'm having a similar problem getting all songs to sync over, and my playlists are similar to yours- Ipod shows the first playlist (with about four songs on it) and then nothing else.
Not all the songs are transferring over- I'm at work now, but I seem to remember getting around 1108 on my Ipod when my computer showed I should be receiving 1441 or so.  I'm using 9.0089 and 3.0038.
Also, check your Ipod's 'about' screen and see if the capacity available has changed after you load up your Ipod.  Mine hasn't- if yours is similar to mine, then it's something we can ask SteveG to look into.

MrVegas:
I don't know where you read that the speeds of transfer were slow- I'd bet that if you ask any former Ephpod users here (I'm one of them), you'll find that the speed of MJ is comparable, if not faster.  
From my Ephpod days, I remember to immediately assume that any user complaining about transfer speed is using win98/ ME as their OS.  I first had winME on my system when I got my Ipod, and upon upgrading to winXP, saw it go from 0.1MB/sec to 5.5MB/sec.  Since then, my speeds are generally around 6MB/sec.

SteveG:
I've looked through the archives for the past Ipod threads, and not really found a fix for the playlist not transferring issue.  I know we've discussed songs not completely transferring over, and the former issue of most songs ending up in F19, but I didn't see a resolution for the playlist thing.  Is this the next "big issue" you plan to tackle?  (I'm just curious.)

[SteveG]

Plug-in 3.0.38 fixed a problem with overwriting certain files with duplicate file names but introduced some synching bugs. The latest Plug-in 3.0.39 will resolve these, but they require a new version of MC9 which is somewhat hard to come by. Hopefully we will have one today.

Seviien, Benmaxwell and McLaugh,

I think your problems will go away with new versions.

Mr. Vegas,

I do not think you will find transfers with MC any slower than with other programs.

DaveT,

In regards to the conversion, this is not yet resolved but will be.

Kurt,

I will get composers in today. This will require another build of the Plug-in and a new release of MC.

Everyone,

Please check back at the end of the day for more information.

Thanks,

Steve

[Dave T]

Mr. Vegas:

I think you were referring to my post about the IPod being slow to transfer.  Let me clarify.  If you're not transcoding (changing the source bitrate/encoder to a different one on the IPod), then transfer is lightening fast - faster than MusicMatch.  It's when you're transcoding that it's slow - very, very slow.   This is because of the (high quality, but slow) encoder used by MC.    I estimated that it would take over 30 hours to fill my 20 gig ipod with music.  Since I encode my mp3's at a much higher bitrate for use in my home theater, than the bitrate I'd want for the IPod, this makes using MC with my IPod not a viable solution in my situation.  YMMV.

- Dave

[newhere]

Hi

I tried to upload my songs to the iPod today. The good news: it seemed to work well. No crashes.

The bad news is that no playlists transferred. I did a syncronize all files and checked Transfer all files. It took about 50 minutes (average of 3.5 mbs not very fast), and after seeing that no playlists were transfered, I decided to try antother syncronize. This time I checked all the playlists I wanted to transfer, that caused the upload que to go to about 27000 (twenty seven thousand) songs. Since I knew that that was beyond the capacity of the iPod (and my nerves) I cancelled that. I though Playlists are just supposed to be small lists, not the actual songs. Also I heard that there is a problem with duplicates. Will that be (or is it already) fixed?

Payam

[Phil Lee]

This time I checked all the playlists I wanted to transfer, that caused the upload que to go to about 27000 (twenty seven thousand) songs. Since I knew that that was beyond the capacity of the iPod (and my nerves) I cancelled that.

When you synchronise playlists the dialog shows the total number of songs in all playlists. This means that if a song appears in more than one playlist it will be counted once for each playlist it is in. The total number of songs uploaded will be less than the total number of songs displayed on the synch dialog.

For example, I have 1666 songs on my iPod. When I do a synch in MC it says that it is uploading 2900 songs because of songs appearing in more than one playlist.

[newhere]

So it will not take any longer to upload the songs and the playlists than it takes to upload all the songs. Now why can't I transfer playlists when I check Transfer all files?
Also, if I have songs in multiple playlists will they (like with ephpod) display as duplicates in the iPod menu 'Songs'? I.E. if I had one song in 3 playlists will it show the song 3 times in the menu Songs on the iPod?
Is there any way to speed up the Sync process? I hear 6 mb/s but I am getting only about 3.5 (although in the beginning it starts with about 4 mb/s)? With ephpod I could increase the buffer size a little...
I also read somewhere that I can upload the songs in two different ways. I can either right click the ipod and select the Syncronize files or I can select the files, right click and send them to the ipod (however I understand that they are only queued then), is one method better than the other?

Payam

[Phil Lee]

The number of songs shown on the iPod About screen shows the number of actual songs, not the number of songs in playlists.

It should take the same time to upload all songs as it does to upload them using playlists.

The upload speed is hardware dependant. I get 6Mb/s on my PC.

[mindracing]

I too have the slow sync syndrome.

I was using conversion during synching and it was really slow. Now that I've stopped using conversion it is still just as slow. I estimate about 3 seconds per track.

The rate counter I think displays an average not actual as it begins at 200MBPS and slowly reduces down to about 4.

In my experience MMJB is faster.

Now I set it to sync before going to bed and it is done when I get up in the morning!

I am also getting no playlist/smart list synching at the moment.

MC .88
iPOD plug in:.38

Loathe to upgrade because of the current problems.

[SteveG]

MindRacing,

I understand your hesitation to update, but it will be a necessary evil.

Newhere,

Sync All files will not transfer Playlists. To transfer playlists, select any or all playliststs and then synch.

Steve

[newhere]

Ok thanks for all your help.
I hate to be a wise guy but why can't I sync all files (transfer them) while at the same time transferring the playlists? I could only do it by transferring the automatically created playlist 'All Music.' This seems to be an ok way but why the loop?

Payam

P.S. Did anyone try to increase the transfer buffer of the mp3 files? I don't know why, but when I just transfer a large file (500mb) by drag and drop onto the iPod in Windows, it transfers at close to  50 mb/sec. I am thinking that a large buffer might stop the connection from being idle or getting chuncked up but then again, the slow transfer could be because iPod needs to write to its own database.

[SteveG]

Payam,

"Transfer All Files" was added for people who aren't using Playlists and just want the files on the iPod. I know that sounds crazy to you, but some people use iPod in this way. To do what you are after, deselect Transfer All Files, and then click "Select All" for Playlists. This will send all files and all Playlists to the iPod and keep them synched for you.

In  regards to the buffering, I tried it before with no change.

Steve

Steve

[SteveG]

Everyone,

I have just posted iPod Plug-in 3.0.40. This will be the one to use with MC 9.0.95 or greater which will be available sometime in the next hour.  Most of the changes are internal so you won't see anything too different. The fixes I mentioned yesterday regarding synching should still be good.

Next week I will include fields such as Date Modified, Comment and Creation date. I would like to add Composer. That info is in the Plug-in but I don't think it is possible on the iPod. Does anyone know of any application that shows this field for a Windows formatted iPod?

My apologies for the bumps in the road this week. MC9 is getting better but there is some pain involved with the improvements. I will be out of contact for a day now but will get caught up sometime this weekend.

Steve

[newhere]

Thanks for the reply

Payam,
In  regards to the buffering, I tried it before with no change.

...Too bad... I am still surprised that the iPod can be so surprisingly fast when used as a drive (500 MB in about 10 sec! is anyone else getting that?). Oh well

Oh and the new ephpod 2.60d now supports the composer field but I don't think it will show on the iPod.

Payam

[mclaugh]

Thanks for the reply
Oh and the new ephpod 2.60d now supports the composer field but I don't think it will show on the iPod.

Payam

Under "browse", you have-
artists, albums, songs, genres, composers.

[fex]

I'm using both new versions now (.40 and .95). The only bad thing i realized til now is, that still all tracks are uploaded again, if "delete all files not in list" is marked.

[benmaxwell]

Are you laying this build overtop of the older one, or clean uninstalling it?

[fex]

Are you laying this build overtop of the older one, or clean uninstalling it?

No uninstall, just overtop. Had no problems with all the last builds doing it this way.

[mclaugh]

40 and 95 for me, too.
It errors out as it uploads, saying it can't transfer a file- look onto the Ipod, and same as before- no playlists, but many files.  I tried twice, different songs, same result.

I'm going out now, I'll check back tomorrow.

[JNKH]

Hi,

Has anyone managed to copy chinese songs (with unicode) from MC9 to ipod on Windows? Not sure if iPod supports it?

[RandyP]

Next week I will include fields such as Date Modified, Comment and Creation date. I would like to add Composer. That info is in the Plug-in but I don't think it is possible on the iPod. Does anyone know of any application that shows this field for a Windows formatted iPod?

Steve,

XPlay supports the Composer field. After a sync, all entries are proper when browsed under "Composers" on the iPod.

Randy

[moriarty]

Ok, I just loaded version 9.0.88 w/ plugin 3.0.40 (the only one I could find).

Everything went fine except I only show 2.000 GB as free space when I click on the IPOD drive in MC (just reformatted so it should show 9.25 GB).  Further when I try to upload one or more songs i get an error: "Media Jukebox has caused an error in HH_Portable.dll" and it crashes.  

I read a reference which sounded like you needed 9.0.95 in combo w/ 3.0.40, but when i tried to install the latest 9.0.95 I got a message: "The microsoft layer for Unicode faile to initialize.  Please re-install".   Say what?

I'm completely stuck at this point, so if anyone has any ideas I'd be very appreciative.
Media Jukebox  9.0.88 -- C:\Program Files\J River\Media Center\

Microsoft Windows Me
Intel Pentium 4 1295 MHz MMX / Memory: Total - 261 MB, Free - 62 MB
Resource Info: System - 32 %, GDI - 55 %, User - 32 %

Internet Explorer: 6.0.2800.1106 / ComCtl32.dll: 5.50.4916.400 / Shlwapi.dll: 6.00.2800.1106
Shell32.dll: 5.50.4134.100
wnaspi32.dll: 4.71 (0001) , ASPI for Win32 (95/NT) DLL, Copyright © 1989-2002 Adaptec, Inc. / Aspi32.sys: N/A

Ripping /   Drive D:   Copy mode:ModeBurstBigBuffer   CD Type:Auto   Read speed:Max
 Drive E:   Copy mode:ModeBurstBigBuffer   CD Type:Auto   Read speed:Max
 Digital playback: Yes /  Use YADB: Yes /  Get cover art: No /  Calc replay gain: No /  Copy volume: 32767
 Eject after ripping: No /  Play sound after ripping: No  

Burning /  Drive E: YAMAHA CRW3200E   Addr: 0:1:0  Speed:24  MaxSpeed:24  Lib:2  GHS:1  Use MJ Engine:No
 Test mode: No /  Eject after writing: Yes /  Direct decoding: Yes /  Two second gap: No /  Write CD-Text: No
 Use playback settings: No /  Normalization: None

[benmaxwell]

steve,

still the same problem with selecting "Delete Files Not In Use" - when syncing with that checked, the ipod is reformatted and the songs are laid back into it.

oh, one more thing... go EAGLES!

[MrVegas]

To forum administrators ....

How's about creating a separate section in the forum just for us iPod fans.  This 3 page thread is getting a bit cumbersome for ALL iPod questions/issues.  I think there is enough interest in iPod to warrant a separate folder/section.

Thanks for your consideration.

p.s.
there is (as many of you know) a separate section for MC9 in the ipodlounge.com forums, but participation there is pretty light

[RobOK]

I read a reference which sounded like you needed 9.0.95 in combo w/ 3.0.40, but when i tried to install the latest 9.0.95 I got a message: "The microsoft layer for Unicode faile to initialize.  Please re-install".   Say what?

I got the exact same error with similar configuration (WIndows ME, ugh.)

Media Jukebox PLUS 9.0.88 -- C:\Program Files\J River\Media Center\

Microsoft Windows Me
Intel Pentium III 863 MHz MMX / Memory: Total - 392 MB, Free - 184 MB
Resource Info: System - 52 %, GDI - 69 %, User - 52 %

Internet Explorer: 6.0.2800.1106 / ComCtl32.dll: 5.50.4916.400 / Shlwapi.dll: 6.00.2800.1106
Shell32.dll: 5.50.4134.100
wnaspi32.dll: 4.57 (1014) , ASPI for Win32 (95/NT) DLL, Copyright © 1989-1998 Adaptec, Inc. / Aspi32.sys: N/A

Ripping /   Drive D:   Copy mode:ModeBurstBigBuffer   CD Type:Auto   Read speed:Max
 Drive F:   Copy mode:ModeBurstBigBuffer   CD Type:Auto   Read speed:Max
 Digital playback: Yes /  Use YADB: Yes /  Get cover art: No /  Calc replay gain: No /  Copy volume: 32767
 Eject after ripping: No /  Play sound after ripping: No  

Burning /  Drive D: HP CD-WRITER 6020   Addr: 0:4:0  Speed:2  MaxSpeed:2  Lib:2  GHS:1  Use MJ Engine:No
 Test mode: No /  Eject after writing: Yes /  Direct decoding: Yes /  Two second gap: No /  Write CD-Text: No
 Use playback settings: No /  Normalization: None

[Kurt Young]

MrVegas,

I don't think that we would rate a separate forum here, after all MC supports a wide variety of handheld plugins, and the iPod is just one of 'em.  This thread is best suited for bug reports and development of the iPod plugin, which is still in beta and under contstruction.  The forum over at iPodlounge is an excellent place to discuss usage, troubleshooting, and other non-development issues.

[SteveG]

Everyone,

I have posted a new Plug-in (3.0.41) which fixes the delete files problem. Please be sure to use MC 9.0.95 with this. Previous versions of MC are not compatible.

In regards to the "Composer" field. I will add the display of this from within MC next week. This is not hard. The trick will be to have iPod recognize this field.


Randy,

If, as you say, XPlay has this worked out, could you email me an XPlay iTunesDb file and I will see what I can do.  (steve @ jriver.com)

Fex and Benmaxwell,

You should be all set with 3.0.41.

McLaugh,

I am not sure. Can you send me the file that it can't upload. If you are still stuck, please email me on Monday.

Moriarty and RobOK,

You must get MC 9.0.95. If you are having problems with it, please start or check another thread.

Mr. Vegas,

I will close this thread and start a fresh one so it isn't so cumbersome.

JNKH,

I am curious about this too. I will test next week if no one replies with some results.


EVERYONE,

I am closing this thread and starting a fresh one.

Steve

PS Thanks Ben. GO EAGLES!!!!! Gonna fly now....