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[Piranhahaha]

Hi, I'm new to MC10, having downloaded it on July 2 and am trying to get it to work before purchasing.

I downloaded the trial version because I hear it's the best for turning LP's and cassettes into discs that I can then put on my iPod.

My problem is that it's recording only the left channel.

The right channel remains silent, so MC10 plays the left as mono in both sides -- no stereo sound.

My set-up is as follows: source to preamp, preamp into a Sony 777ES tape deck, line out from the Sony is a dual RCA connecter that ends in a 1/8 plug that goes into the microphone input of my new Dell Latitude D600.

I just confirmed that the setup and cabling are not the problem: I plugged the exact same 1/8 plug into a boombox, ran a right/left test, and heard both in stereo.  

What am I doing wrong?

Is it impossible to record stereo via the Dell microphone input?  Is there a workaround?

Any help is greatly appreciated!

(PS: I'm running the sound through the Sony tape deck so I can use the monitor function to decrease the volume going into the computer -- when I tried to run the preamp outputs into the Dell, the MC10 volume test kept telling me that I had the source level volume up too far and should decrease it.  Perhaps this is an associated symptom of my problem?)

[Chris Shaw]

Under the Windows Control Panel, choose Sound, and under the Audio tab, click on Recording - Volume.  You should check that Microphone is selected and that the balance is centred. Also, try using Windows Sound Recorder to record a clip and see if that is stereo.

[IanG]

My guess would be that it's a mono microphone input, in which case you'll need a pcmcia soundcard.  It looks like the D600 doesn't have firewire either, so more expense!  And while I'm spending your money, have a look at RIPVinyl.  MC can record the music, and it's great for managing it and the iPod, but life's a lot easier if the ripping program can split the LP / cassette input into separate tracks.

Ian G.

[JohnT]

but life's a lot easier if the ripping program can split the LP / cassette input into separate tracks.

Ian G.

MC can do this.

As to the mono/stereo problem, is there a "line" or "aux" input on the Dell in addition to the microphone input? The mic input is probably causing both problems: mono instead of stereo and input level too high. For the input level, you may be able to fix the problem by going into the windows mixer and unchecking the "boost" option on the microphone. Remember to go to "recording" properties in windows mixer rather than "playback" properties.

[Alex B]

I also suggest checking all possible options in your sound card mixer and driver.

The Dell website claims that Latitude D600 has a stereo mic in connector. There can be a physical mismatch between the connector in Dell and your 1/8 plug. Dell's internal connector can also be faulty. Do you have any means to confirm that it is working? If you connect only the 1/8 plug to the Dell and touch the center spikes of the open RCA connectors with a metallic item does it transfer audio noise peaks to individual channels?

One (expensive) workaround is indeed to buy an external high quality sound card. Usually the internal audio circuit is not very good. I have considered buying Terratec's new Aureon 7.1 FireWire soundcard for using with my laptop. There are even Phono inputs with RIAA correction.
(Aureon 7.1 FW product page: http://productsen.terratec.net/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=198&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0)

I experienced the clipping warning too. I didn't get rid of it (probably because of my specific setup) and I finally turned to more professionally oriented software, Steinberg's Wavelab. Recording works like a charm with it.

[modelmaker]

2 other alternatives for recording LPs/Tapes: MAGIX AudioCleaningLab(about$50)(www.magix.com)and Voyetra's AudioSurgeon(www.voyetra.com)(about$40)(Both are downloadable).

Both will split the tracks and also include several other proccessors: scratch removal, hiss and hum filters (great for tapes), Equalizers and other stuff including Direct X plugin capabilities.

I've been using Magix' AcLab for a couple of years now along with MC, both with great satisfaction. While MC can record, a dedicated recording app gives you a lot more flexibility.

[IanG]

but life's a lot easier if the ripping program can split the LP / cassette input into separate tracks.

Ian G.

MC can do this.

Good news!!  I'm just about to convert some of my old vinyl.

Ian G.

[Piranhahaha]

Many MANY thanks for everyone's help!  I truly appreciate it -- it's really nice when a newbie is welcomed.

I'm going through all of your suggestions, but the first one I did was to touch the metal object to the RCA's leading into the 1/8 plug into the computer while recording on MC10.

Your suspicion was correct.  When I touch the left, both meters max out, but when I touch the right, nothing happens.  Does this mean that the microphone input inside the Dell is wacky?

I'm hoping there's some sort of setting buried within options menus that I missed.  I dug around everywhere, but never saw anything to toggle between mono and stereo.

Meanwhile, I confirm that MC10 does an excellent job of separating the tracks.  

I really like the software & hope I can get it to work.

Thanks again, everyone!

[JimH]

The 1/8 inch plug on your cable.... does it have two tiny black bands or one?  They can be either monaural or stereo.  Stereo has two.

[Piranhahaha]

Yes, definitely two bands.  Plus stereo plays through it when I hooked it up to a boombox -- it’s a Monster Cable with R&L RCA’s on one end and a 1/8 plug on the other.

Other ideas that people suggested above:

“Under the Windows Control Panel, choose Sound, and under the Audio tab, click on Recording - Volume. You should check that Microphone is selected and that the balance is centred.”

Yes, it is centered.  One thing that’s weird is that it won’t let me move the little arrow between the speakers -- it’s locked.  The arrow will move on the “CD Audio” recording control next to it though.  This leads me to believe that the problem’s with whatever software controls the microphone input, not MC10.


“Also, try using Windows Sound Recorder to record a clip and see if that is stereo.

I couldn’t find that program.  I’ve got media player, but the only sound card type thing is from Sigma Tel Audio.  


“It looks like the D600 doesn't have firewire either,”

My other computer does have a firewire input.  The problem is that that’s where I have my iTunes located and I’m afraid MC10 would mess it up -- way too many hours spent organizing iTunes to take the risk.


“As to the mono/stereo problem, is there a "line" or "aux" input on the Dell in addition to the microphone input? The mic input is probably causing both problems: mono instead of stereo and input level too high. For the input level, you may be able to fix the problem by going into the windows mixer and unchecking the "boost" option on the microphone. Remember to go to "recording" properties in windows mixer rather than "playback" properties.””

Yes, boost is off, and the only other possible input is a the flat rectangular USB inputs -- where one connects a printer.  Is there a way to put sound in via that connection?
I think you're right about the mic input causing these problems.  

“The Dell website claims that Latitude D600 has a stereo mic in connector. There can be a physical mismatch between the connector in Dell and your 1/8 plug. Dell's internal connector can also be faulty. Do you have any means to confirm that it is working? If you connect only the 1/8 plug to the Dell and touch the center spikes of the open RCA connectors with a metallic item does it transfer audio noise peaks to individual channels?”

Yes the plug is definitely working in stereo, and your RCA test revealed that nothing happens when I touch the right RCA with a metallic object, while touching left made both meters jump in tandem.  


“One (expensive) workaround is indeed to buy an external high quality sound card. Usually the internal audio circuit is not very good. I have considered buying Terratec's new Aureon 7.1 FireWire soundcard for using with my laptop. There are even Phono inputs with RIAA correction.”

That’s a very cool piece of equipment, but I don’t think it’s worth the cost for me -- all I’m trying to is get maybe 25 LP’s onto my iPod.  Once the files are compressed to AAC, I doubt the sonic advantages will hold up.





Oh well, if anyone has any more ideas, let me know, but I am now 99% certain that the problem lies with whatever programs Windows gave me, or maybe with the Dell input itself.  I think it’s time to call Dell.  

Thanks again for your help!

[Chris Shaw]

“Under the Windows Control Panel, choose Sound, and under the Audio tab, click on Recording - Volume. You should check that Microphone is selected and that the balance is centred.”

Yes, it is centered.  One thing that’s weird is that it won’t let me move the little arrow between the speakers -- it’s locked.  The arrow will move on the “CD Audio” recording control next to it though.  This leads me to believe that the problem’s with whatever software controls the microphone input, not MC10.
:
:
“The Dell website claims that Latitude D600 has a stereo mic in connector. There can be a physical mismatch between the connector in Dell and your 1/8 plug. Dell's internal connector can also be faulty. Do you have any means to confirm that it is working? If you connect only the 1/8 plug to the Dell and touch the center spikes of the open RCA connectors with a metallic item does it transfer audio noise peaks to individual channels?”

Yes the plug is definitely working in stereo, and your RCA test revealed that nothing happens when I touch the right RCA with a metallic object, while touching left made both meters jump in tandem.  

Both these would seem to indicate that the Dell's microphone socket is mono. I suppose it could be a driver problem where the sound card is only seeing the left channel, but it seems unlikely.

“Also, try using Windows Sound Recorder to record a clip and see if that is stereo.

I couldn’t find that program.  I’ve got media player, but the only sound card type thing is from Sigma Tel Audio.  

If you want to try it, do Start->Run and type
sndrec32
On Windows 2000, it's under Programs->Accessories->Entertainment as well.

[Piranhahaha]

After one of the most frustrating days I've ever had with a computer, I now believe that anyone who has recorded analog in via a microphone input with a Windows machine has recorded only the left channel:

Apparently, the default is in mono.

Check this out from the Dell website, perhaps someone here can help, but I tried it and am still getting only the left channel recorded.

Ugh.  I hate to admit defeat, but I'm defeated.

Recording LP's & cassettes should not be this hard.

(cut&paste from Dell begins:)

http://support.dell.com/support/topics/global.aspx/support/kb/en/document?c=us&DN=1070855&l=en&opt=true&s=gen&~mode=popup

How do I improve the microphone recording quality on my Dell™ Inspiron™ or Latitude™ portable computer in the Microsoft® Windows® XP operating system?

Problem

When recording from an internal or external microphone in Microsoft Sound Recorder, the sound quality is poor.

Discussion

Sound Recorder defaults to the lowest quality setting, 8-bit format, for recording and playback of .wav files. If you set a higher quality, the setting reverts back to the lower quality setting after restarting the computer.

Solution

Configure the Recording Settings in Sound Recorder

Click the Start button, point to All Programs, point to Accessories, point to Entertainment, and then click Sound Recorder.
The Sound Recorder window appears.
From the File menu, click Properties.
The Properties for Sound window appears.
In the Format Conversion section, set the Choose from dropdown box to All formats and then click the Convert Now button.
In the Attributes drop-down box, select a higher quality setting.

 NOTE:  The higher the quality setting, the greater the bandwidth in kb/sec, and the larger the file size. The highest quality setting is 48.000 kHz, 16 Bit, Stereo. You may need to experiment with the tradeoff between quality and file size, however, it is recommended that you at least select a setting that is 16-bit.


Click Save As.
The Save As window appears.
Type a name (such as Recording) and then click OK.

 NOTE:  Make note of the name that you save the settings as. This information will be used in the Edit the Registry section below.


Click OK two times and then close Sound Recorder.
Edit the Registry

 NOTICE:  The following procedure contains information about editing the Windows registry. Dell does not guarantee success or support these actions. Any use of the information provided herein, is performed at your own risk. You should make a backup copy of the registry files prior to executing any of the following steps. Incorrect use of the registry editor and editing the registry files can cause serious problems that may require a complete reinstall of your operating system. Dell assumes no responsibility, expressed or implied, regarding the consequences of any action taken as a result of the information provided herein.
 

For instructions on backing up the registry in Windows XP, refer to Microsoft Knowledge Base Article Q322756

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;q322756
 


Click the Start button and then click Run.
The Run window appears.
In the Open: field, type regedit and then click OK.
The Registry Editor window appears.
Click the plus (+) sign next to each of the following keys.

HKEY_CURRENT_USER
Software
Microsoft
Multimedia
Audio


Click Audio in the left pane and then click Default Format in the right pane.
Click Edit and then click Modify.
Type the name that you saved the higher quality audio setting as in Sound Recorder (step 6 in the section Configure the Recording Settings in Sound Recorder) and then click OK.
Click File and then click Exit.


(cut&paste from Dell ends)

[Alex B]

If you don't get it working, you could reconsider buying an external sound card. There are also cheaper high quality alternatives besides the Terratec Aureon 7.1 FW.

One of the best is the M-Audio Transit USB. http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=products.main&ID=ce4f3b6d13494004f69f07cb11070055.
The street price is about $80 in US and about Euro 105 in EU. (Why is it always this way? - asks me, one frustrated EU resident  )

As an added bonus you get much improved analog playback quality and a possibility to connect any USB ready computer digitally to a home theater receiver.

[JimH]

I don't believe that all sound recording on PC's is limited to a single channel.  If you have access to another PC, it would be worth testing.

I've only had the problem you described when I used the wrong cable.  I suspect you've explored the possibility that the cable is bad.  The connector is another possibility.

[JohnT]

I think your best bet is a low priced external USB audio device. Go to www.newegg.com and type in "external audio USB" for a search string. You'll find an M-Audio device for $52.00, and other devices as cheap as $25.00 that should do the trick.
I've never heard of anyone having good luck with a Mic input, especially on laptops.

[Piranhahaha]

Alex B: The M-Audio’s only analog input seems to be a 1/8 plug.  I’m really nervous around 1/8 plugs these days.  I found another gadget with RCA inputs and an external sound card leading to a USB output for the same price, see below -- I’d like to know if this sounds good to you.



Jim H: I know it sounds unbelievable, but I now even more firmly suspect that anyone using a recent Dell microphone input has been recording the left channel only.  I did try it on two computers, my home Dell Inspiron 8500, and my, uh, uh, Dell that I’m, uh, allowed to take home on the weekends/evenings, a Latitude D600.  Both record only the left channel via the microphone input.  

A long chat on Sunday afternoon with Winnie from a Dell offshore office flummoxed the poor girl, to the point where she took my phone number and agreed to call me back after dinner -- she agreed about the problem, but couldn’t find anything to help.  She called back at 1:20AM on Monday night/Tuesday morning (10am or so in New Delhi time), but remained perplexed -- her armory of ideas puttered out.  Her best shot: she believes it’s set up this way so that that while someone’s voice comes in on the microphone input, via the left channel, the mono voice signal can then go out to a public announcement system via the right.  Regardless, she recognizes that stereo should be able to come in via the microphone input, she seems genuinely interested in the problem, and will call back tomorrow night.  

In the meantime, I submitted a question the Washington Post’s tech reporter, Rob Pegoraro, who does bimonthly online chats, took the question, didn’t know, then flipped it to the other chatters, one of whom responded with a similar report of only mono coming in via the Dell microphone input (scroll down 3/4):

http://discuss.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/zforum/04/r_technews_pegoraro071204.htm

And yes my cables are OK -- without changing anything, when I put the exact same 1/8 plug into a 1/8 plug input on a boombox, I get stereo.  When inputted into the Dell microphone input, only left channel.

I recoil in horror at the possibility that any James River customers who’ve complained about sound quality are being affected by this outrage, not MC10.

(PS: does James River refer to the great waterway flowing through Virginia?)



John T: Your $52 recommendation of the M-audio Sonica at $52 suffers the same problem: 1/8 plug input.  The newegg.com site also coughed up the “M-AUDIO External USB Sound System, Model "Audiophile USB" -RETAIL $166” which does have RCA’s in.  

This got me to thinking:

Dell’s microphone input stinks.
I gotta find a way to connect my stereo to my computer.
Hate hate hate 1/8’s, need RCA’s.
Wonder what happens if I google your terrific phrase of "external audio USB"?

I found this:

The Blaze Audio Maya EX for $99.95

http://www.blazeaudio.com/products/mayaex.html

It definitely has

“Analog Inputs
1) Type: 2 Channel Analog line inputs (RCA Jack)”

And proclaims: ”The Maya EX Professional USB Audio device is an external sound card- no need to take your computer apart to install it! Just plug it into any available USB 1.x port and you can play back and record high quality sound to a desktop or laptop PC without picking up all the noise that the inside of your computer produces!
That's only the start, though! The Maya EX has 6 analog outputs and comes with a software DVD player that allows you to experience Dolby Digital 5.1 and DTS 5.1 sound while playing your favorite Dolby-enabled DVDs! It has a mike input with built-in stereo preamp, a headphone jack, 6 analog outputs and two analog inputs, and SP/DIF connectors for recording to or from your minidisc recorder.
The Maya EX is perfect for laptop owners with no Line Input, or for desktop owners who want an easy, inexpensive way to improve their audio. The inside of your computer is filled with electronic noise that degrades audio quality- that's why putting the audio hardware outside the box in a USB audio device works so well.”


I remain in great appreciation of everyone’s  help above -- you all truly seem to know what you’re doing, and I’ve come to like the MC10 program.  

My final question:
Is this Maya EX legit?

[Alex B]

I did some googling for the M-Audio Transit and I found positive impressions about it. You could google for e.g. "M-Audio Transit" review.

That Maya EX seems to be very interesting too. I must search for more information about it.

I wouldn't be too concerned about the 1/8 plug. Millions of mobile devices are using it. It may not be everlasting, but it should work OK for some years. And then you can buy new even better gadgets.

[denton49]

I was directed to this topic by Alex B (thanks Alex) as I had posted a topic yesterday "Recording Problem". I have been trying to record from a tape deck to the line-in socket on my Dell 4550 PC with Windows XP. My problem is identical in that I am only getting recording through the left handspeaker.
My plugs have 2 green bands and I'm sure are stereo.

The Dell website is no real help and as I'm in the UK and I contacted Dell support by e-mail. Complete waste of time as they brushed me off by saying they did not support sound recording!

I've been through all the options within the control panel with no luck at all. I cannot believe that the line-in socket is mono. The speakers play CD and system sounds in stereo.

[IanG]

The Dell website is no real help and as I'm in the UK and I contacted Dell support by e-mail. Complete waste of time as they brushed me off by saying they did not support sound recording!

Have you tried phoning the UK help desk?  I'm not a big fan of Dell PCs, but I've always had excellent support from the help desk.

Ian G.

[Piranhahaha]

I'm in the USA, but I suspect that calling anybody's local help desk would wind up transferring you to well-intentioned but ultimately clueless tech reps in New Delhi, India, as is the case with us.

Still, I doubt it would do you any good: a trio of lengthy calls to "Vinnie" resulted in her being stumped, while last night one "Brian" brushed me off by simply stating that the microphone input only accepts a mono input.  

I remain convinced that a standard Dell laptop, be it an Inspiron or Latitude, doesn't record stereo via the microphone input, and that anyone who has recorded LP's and cassettes that way has recorded only the left channel without knowing it... yet.

I've ordered a Maya EX external USB and am presently waiting for it to arrive.

Grrr.... this has been a pain in the ass, oops, arse for you Brits.

Anyhow, it's not MC10's fault.  

[denton49]

Just to add to the mystery. I converted some VCR tape to DVD using a Belkin product. Unfortunately this only converted video so I connected the audio out from my VCR to the line in on the pc ... and it recorded both channels in stereo.

I deduce from this that the line in is capable of recording stereo if only using a VCR and Ulead Video Studio software.

[Screwbottle]

Hello All
To put paid your question of the microphone jack being stereo or monaural. Dell, as well as many other big and small brands use only mono jacks for the microphone input. Two reasons, a wide range of not too expensive microphones and personal recording. Most of the laptop manufacturers will tell you that the microphone input jack is only used by about 1% of users. On the Dell D600 and D800, I have worked on the boards and they are definitely mono inputs. You will also find this on many good quality sound cards as well. A few offer a jumper wherby you can convert from mono to stereo type microphones.
And correctly said, the line in jack is stereo. But a lot of value line laptops do not always give you a line in jack. It somehow saves costs when your are manufacturing 10's of thousandsof units ??. How do I know this, although I work in I.T. and do repairs, I also in my spare time work with a lot of my friends who are profesional musicians who for convenience sake use laptops on stage. I have had many sleepless nights in similiar problems getting stereo out of the laptop and into a desk, or vice versa, stereo from the desk into the laptop.
Bottom line give the mic jack a skip. If you are fortunate to have a laptop with line in and out no problem, but basicallly I see no purpose of the mic jack especially when a lot of the laptops have built in mic's.
Hope this helps somewhat. Basicallly the majority of mic jacks on laptops are mono.

Cheers  

[Piranhahaha]

Many thanks -- wish I'd known this before I started dialing Dell.  Many hours spent, but got this email:

***

Thank you again for contacting Dell Technical Support and thank you for
your cooperation and patience in this issue.

Please be informed that the chipset used for the sound controller of
your system is a Sigmatel STAC9750.  And this chipset provides only MONO
inputs.  For more information, kindly refer to Sigmatels website:

http://www.sigmatel.com/products/stac9750pb.htm

We hope this information will help you with your problem.

Respectfully,

Owen Nuguid
~DT D27403
Dell Technical Support


****

Anyhow, I bought the Maya external USB, which connects in via a USB port.  I've confirmed that I'm getting stereo recording (my right/left test signal is now on my iPod --- YAY!), but haven't unleashed MC10 on a full album yet.

I still wonder how many Dell users are out there who've recorded LP's via the mic input and haven't yet noticed that it's in mono...

Meanwhile, thanks for everybody's help -- you all are terrific!