Topic: Stumbling between Tracks (Read 7551 times)

Uwe · « **on:** March 01, 2005, 04:54:47 am »

Althought i didn't change anything in the Playback-Options, MC is stumbling or stuttering one time in the last few seconds of a track. Simultaneously the shown Remaining Time shows wrong characters like "--3:-455" for the last few seconds.

Uwe

Sorry: MC Version 11.998

datdude · « **Reply #1 on:** March 03, 2005, 11:18:17 pm »

Yes this is something I was getting ready to write about. It has been happening to MC 11 for a while now. It doesn't seem to happen on every track but it happens at almost 6 or 7 seconds before the track ends when it does stutter. If I then replay the song it doesn't seem to happen again. I have no plugins running in the background as well as any other programs.

Media Center Registered 11.0.192 -- C:\Program Files\J River\Media Center 11\

Microsoft Windows XP 5.1 Service Pack 2 (Build 2600)
AMD Athlon 752 MHz MMX / Memory: Total - 261 MB, Free - 96 MB

Internet Explorer: 6.0.2900.2180 / ComCtl32.dll: 5.82 (xpsp_sp2_rtm.040803-2158) / Shlwapi.dll: 6.00.2900.2180 (xpsp_sp2_rtm.040803-2158) / Shell32.dll: 6.00.2900.2180 (xpsp_sp2_rtm.040803-2158) / wnaspi32.dll: N/A
Ripping / No CD drives found.
Digital playback: Yes / Use YADB: Yes / Get cover art: Yes / Calc replay gain: Yes / Copy volume: 32767
Eject after ripping: Yes / Play sound after ripping: No

Burning / No burners found.
Test mode: No / Eject after writing: Yes / Direct decoding: Yes / Write CD-Text: Yes
Use playback settings: No / Normalization: None

Uwe · « **Reply #2 on:** March 04, 2005, 04:05:53 am »

Thanks! I just thought i was alone in space...
Yes indeed, it does not happen on every track every time.

I've got the same problem on another PC:

Media Center Registered 11.0.201 -- C:\Programme\J River\Media Center 11\

Microsoft Windows 2000 Workstation 5.0 Service Pack 4 (Build 2195)
Intel Pentium III 213 MHz MMX / Memory: Total - 261 MB, Free - 52 MB

Internet Explorer: 6.0.2800.1106 / ComCtl32.dll: 5.81 / Shlwapi.dll: 6.00.2800.1584 (xpsp2.040720-1705) / Shell32.dll: 5.00.3900.6975 / wnaspi32.dll: N/A
Ripping / Drive D: Mode:Normal Type:Auto Speed:Max
Drive E: Mode:Normal Type:Auto Speed:Max
Digital playback: Yes / Use YADB: Yes / Get cover art: No / Calc replay gain: Yes / Copy volume: 32767
Eject after ripping: Yes / Play sound after ripping: No

Burning / Drive E: LITE-ON LTR-52327S Addr: 2:0:0 Speed:52 MaxSpeed:52 BurnProof:Yes
Test mode: No / Eject after writing: Yes / Direct decoding: Yes / Write CD-Text: No
Use playback settings: No / Normalization: None

Deivit · « **Reply #3 on:** March 04, 2005, 07:32:16 am »

Quote from: LisaRCT on March 04, 2005, 07:18:01 am

I find this happens when my PC (or MC itself) is busy doing other things which use processor power.
I was guessing it had something to do with MC needing processor to cross-fade or remove silence, but changing these settings made no significant difference that I could tell.

I experience the same behaviour. It's only when the PC is busy doing other things that there's stuttering between tracks. If I recall correctly, in MC.10 the music just stopped playing for a while under those extreme conditions, but since I upgraded to MC.11 I get this stutter happening.

... and yes, I do have third party plug-ins working

PlayingNow is always running... but it also was with MC.10.

GHammer · « **Reply #4 on:** March 04, 2005, 10:22:39 am »

I have found this to be a problem too. Something just isn't right with playback in the recent builds. I haven't seen stuttering like this in a long time.

As a temporary workaround, try setting your Output buffering to 2 or 3 seconds and see if that makes a difference.

datdude · « **Reply #5 on:** March 04, 2005, 03:09:10 pm »

my buffer is .5 right now so I will try to up it and see what happens. Somehow I don't think it has to do with mc being slow as it happens in the last 6 or 7 second almost exactly every time. that tells me there is a bug. If it was just that my computer was slow or running additional programs, then wouldn't it happen at other times in the song as well?

Deivit · « **Reply #6 on:** March 04, 2005, 03:26:33 pm »

Quote from: datdude on March 04, 2005, 03:09:10 pm

If it was just that my computer was slow or running additional programs, then wouldn't it happen at other times in the song as well?

Not sure... a possible explanation as to why it only happens between songs could be that the songs are buffered before playing and it's probably when the next song starts to buffer that MC needs more processor power and that's the point where it stutters.

datdude · « **Reply #7 on:** March 17, 2005, 11:22:42 pm »

Quote from: Deivit on March 04, 2005, 03:26:33 pm

Not sure... a possible explanation as to why it only happens between songs could be that the songs are buffered before playing and it's probably when the next song starts to buffer that MC needs more processor power and that's the point where it stutters.

Tested it some more. It happens when there are no songs next as well as songs next. I have tried the buffer at 1 second and it still happens. At 2 seconds it seems to have stopped. Problem is that the volume is not responsive and takes a long time to catch up to my commands which is highly annoying and should not have to happen. Hopefully this can be remedied without an increase in the default buffer. My computer is a bit old but should not be causing the stuttering at that moment. I am only playing mp3's which my ipod has no problem paying. I am usually not running other programs as well.

Uwe · « **Reply #8 on:** March 18, 2005, 03:31:39 am »

Datude,

i've updated MC and since the last few days, i haven't had the stuttering problem any more. Nevertheless the display of the remaining time in the visualization is wrong (see my first post)

Good luck
Uwe

JONCAT · « **Reply #9 on:** March 20, 2005, 02:58:03 pm »

I have noticed this as well. I'm using ASIO with about .25. I noticed this with APE files in the last build of MC10 as well.

MC11 is acting sluggish for me, hanging unresponsive at times while I wait for it to catch up with itself. Very strange.

I had corrupted ape files in the past that would cause echoing effect at the end of track and this was due to editing apes with a 3rd party plugin beofre importing into MC. This problem seems different as it is definitely a stutter and I got a real long pause the other day; I think when I inserted a cd.

Something seems buggy.

JC

datdude · « **Reply #10 on:** March 25, 2005, 09:21:31 pm »

Quote from: Uwe on March 18, 2005, 03:31:39 am

Datude,

i've updated MC and since the last few days, i haven't had the stuttering problem any more. Nevertheless the display of the remaining time in the visualization is wrong (see my first post)

Good luck
Uwe

Well It must be something on my side then because I have continued to notice this problem even with the latest build. It occurs when there are more songs in the que and when there are none. It also occurs when there are other programs running and when there is notheing else running. I have no plugins and or servers running. My buffer is set at 1 second and it still occurs. It seemed like at 2 seconds it stopped but that buffer was way too annoying so I didn't test that fully. Overall MC11 is very responsive on my computer in every aspect. But unfortuantely this error at about 6 seconds before the song ends continues to occur. It does not happen on every songs and seems to be irregular but occuring fairly frequently like a few every hour of playing or so.

If someone could help me trouble shoot this would be great?

JimH · « **Reply #11 on:** March 26, 2005, 06:47:31 pm »

Any third party plug-ins?

risingdamp · « **Reply #12 on:** March 26, 2005, 07:02:25 pm »

Can I ask if this is with VBR files? This is a common problem with VBR. I expect Matt can offer some advice. I think theres a program out there called VBRFIX or something similar that will correct the file so it knows how long it really is.

datdude · « **Reply #13 on:** March 26, 2005, 11:17:14 pm »

Quote from: JimH on March 26, 2005, 06:47:31 pm

Any third party plug-ins?

I used to use a flac plugin and I had the same stumbling problem with flac files. I trancoded to mp3 vbr for different reasons and then the problems still occur. So it's not the file type that is causing the problem. The stumbling has occured when there were third party plug-ins installed as well as with none installed at all?

JimH · « **Reply #14 on:** March 27, 2005, 07:34:34 am »

What else do you have in common?

Wireless connections?

File type?

Visualizations in use?

Network servers?

datdude · « **Reply #15 on:** March 27, 2005, 01:13:05 pm »

Quote from: JimH on March 27, 2005, 07:34:34 am

What else do you have in common?

Wireless connections?

File type?

Visualizations in use?

Network servers?

I am connected to a wireless access point for internet connection but MC use is all on my computer.

I am using for the most part mp3 --alt preset standard.

I have split views in use with medialibrary and playing now. There may be visualizations running in the background but I have none showing on playing now so I am assuming that if the visualization split of playing now is not showing, then all resources to that is removed?

I have no network servers.

Jim, I have customised MC alot in terms of playback and what not. What would be the best way to
to revert back to a clean MC with all default settings etc. and still possibly be able to go back to the way it is now. I am just thinking that would be a good test. Should I uniinstall MC and then reinstall and then Im not sure if I should just impot all files and forget about the library backup, so it is clean. If I did this would I be able to go back to the way everytihing is now?

JimH · « **Reply #16 on:** March 28, 2005, 09:18:24 am »

Try the option for MC playback called "Aggressive reset".

Matt · « **Reply #17 on:** March 28, 2005, 02:36:25 pm »

MC switches to the next track internally about 6-7 seconds before the end of the last song.

Is it possible you have a slow drive (PIO mode) or network connection?

Does it happen in all output styles? (waveout, direct sound, ASIO, etc.)

Do you have all DSPs turned off?

datdude · « **Reply #18 on:** March 28, 2005, 07:41:41 pm »

Quote from: JimH on March 28, 2005, 09:18:24 am

Try the option for MC playback called "Aggressive reset".

Not seeing this option. I am assuming it is under playback options?

Quote from: Matt on March 28, 2005, 02:36:25 pm

MC switches to the next track internally about 6-7 seconds before the end of the last song.

Is it possible you have a slow drive (PIO mode) or network connection?

Does it happen in all output styles? (waveout, direct sound, ASIO, etc.)

Do you have all DSPs turned off?

Well it seems to happen when there are songs in the que and when there are not so if there is not another song in the que it shouldn't have to switch?

I know it happens on direct sound and aiso for sure. I am currently using Album gain and I did use replay gain in the past and the problem occured on both dsp's. I am not using any other dsp's.

What would be the best way to reset MediaCenter to test and see if the problem occurs but still be able to revert back to my current settings?

Uwe · « **Reply #19 on:** March 29, 2005, 01:33:57 am »

Quote from: risingdamp on March 26, 2005, 07:02:25 pm

Can I ask if this is with VBR files? This is a common problem with VBR. I expect Matt can offer some advice. I think theres a program out there called VBRFIX or something similar that will correct the file so it knows how long it really is.

Datdude,
i think this post is also a good hint. I remember i had some problems with VBR-Files, so i fix every new VBR File.
I still ask myself, why MC does not have the VBR-Fix feature. Best place will be the Analyse Tool...

Uwe

datdude · « **Reply #20 on:** March 30, 2005, 08:27:33 pm »

What is the best way to test this problem? All I want to do is figure it out and go from there. Im thinking I should try a clean install of MC11 and test. What do I need to do to get a clean install so that I know there isn't anything that I have done as far as settings that would possibly cause this problem. Once something like this is done what would be the best wat to return to the current settings of MC if I so desried?

JimH · « **Reply #21 on:** March 30, 2005, 08:35:27 pm »

Can you try to tell us more? How many files in your library, for example?

Anything at all unusual about your system?

datdude · « **Reply #22 on:** March 30, 2005, 08:53:48 pm »

Quote from: JimH on March 30, 2005, 08:35:27 pm

Can you try to tell us more? How many files in your library, for example?

Anything at all unusual about your system?

4321 Files.

One thing I have had a problem with is trying to use task manager when the problem occurs. I usually can see a cpu spike but it never happens when I expect it and so I can't actually see what process and the exact memory data that occured.

I can mention that scrolling in the main selection view of the media library seems really choppy. It is pretty smooth in the panes and even smoother in the tree view. Don't think that is a related issue but it is choopy where I will put in a full scroll and it only moves maybe about 4 times where in other scrolling areas a full scroll will move like at least 10 times.

As far as trying to test MC11 you don't recommend doing this?

Media Center Registered 11.0.225 -- C:\Program Files\J River\Media Center 11\

Microsoft Windows XP Workstation 5.1 Service Pack 2 (Build 2600)
AMD Athlon 746 MHz MMX / Memory: Total - 261 MB, Free - 78 MB

Internet Explorer: 6.0.2900.2180 / ComCtl32.dll: 5.82 (xpsp_sp2_rtm.040803-2158) / Shlwapi.dll: 6.00.2900.2573 (xpsp_sp2_gdr.041130-1729) / Shell32.dll: 6.00.2900.2578 (xpsp_sp2_gdr.041130-1729) / wnaspi32.dll: N/A
Ripping / Drive D: MITSUMI DW-7801TE Mode:ModeSecure Type:Auto Speed:Max
Digital playback: Yes / Use YADB: Yes / Get cover art: Yes / Calc replay gain: Yes / Copy volume: 32767
Eject after ripping: Yes / Play sound after ripping: No

Burning / Drive D: YAMAHA CRW8424E Addr: 1:0:0 Speed:8 MaxSpeed:8 BurnProof:No
Test mode: No / Eject after writing: Yes / Direct decoding: No / Write CD-Text: Yes
Use playback settings: No / Normalization: None

JimH · « **Reply #23 on:** March 30, 2005, 09:31:00 pm »

Did you install any other software around the time the problem began?

datdude · « **Reply #24 on:** March 30, 2005, 10:13:35 pm »

It has been doing this for a while and I really can't put a time frame on it. The first post I have is March 3rd and I know it was doing it several months before but since MC was in alpha I didn't really worry about it initially. I did install XP SP2 and it may have been right around then when I noticed ithe pausing for the first time but that is not for sure???

JimH · « **Reply #25 on:** April 02, 2005, 10:23:38 am »

datdude,
Did you explore Matt's suggestion above about PIO mode? Or other problems with a slow drive.

Defrag the disk? See Saphno's post here:
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=26808.msg185954#msg185954

datdude · « **Reply #26 on:** April 02, 2005, 12:52:33 pm »

Quote from: JimH on April 02, 2005, 10:23:38 am

datdude,
Did you explore Matt's suggestion above about PIO mode? Or other problems with a slow drive.

Defrag the disk? See Saphno's post here:
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=26808.msg185954#msg185954

Checked PIO and nothing is running on that mode.
I ususally defrag once a week.

One of the drives is running in multiword dma mode 2, whatever that means.

All of my music is on a maxtor 250 gb hardrive that is not very fast and kinda noisy but not too bad.

I don't think that would be the reason but let me know if that typically causes problems with MC!

datdude · « **Reply #27 on:** April 16, 2005, 12:50:15 am »

Did a full uninstall deleted registry values then a fresh install. All possible user settings reset(I t hope).

Have tested for a week without changing anyhting and the problem still occurs. I know it's not any third party plugins or user settings. My computer seems to be fast enough. My last resort is to re-install windows xp and see what happens. Hmmmm...........

GHammer · « **Reply #28 on:** April 16, 2005, 03:10:07 am »

Quote from: datdude on April 16, 2005, 12:50:15 am

My last resort is to re-install windows xp and see what happens. Hmmmm...........

Before you do that try using this handy tool. I had an issue with stumbling sometimes during game playing. Using this took care of the problem.

PCI Latency Config Tool
http://www.audiotrak.net/support_faq.htm

"A quick note on the ltcycfg tool, this is a very helpful tool we found for adjusting latencies on the add-on cards in a system, sound cards, network cards, video cards etc...

Operation of the program is simple, simply open up the ltcycfg.exe file and set your latencies accordingly, we've found on systems with audigy cards and nvidia video cards setting the latencies to 64 for both gives the best and smoothest results"

datdude · « **Reply #29 on:** April 16, 2005, 05:24:52 pm »

I am assuming lower latency is better? So far the pausing still occurs with 0 latency.

I have never spent so much time trying to fix a problem in a program like this. If it wasn't MC then I would have looked elsewhere long ago. My patience is starting dwindle. The problem doesn't happen all the time but when it does, I feel like someone is taking their fingernails to a blackbaord just because I know it's going to keep happening.

Maybe I should just go back to CD's.

GHammer · « **Reply #30 on:** April 16, 2005, 06:34:57 pm »

Quote from: datdude on April 16, 2005, 05:24:52 pm

I am assuming lower latency is better? So far the pausing still occurs with 0 latency.

I have never spent so much time trying to fix a problem in a program like this. If it wasn't MC then I would have looked elsewhere long ago. My patience is starting dwindle. The problem doesn't happen all the time but when it does, I feel like someone is taking their fingernails to a blackbaord just because I know it's going to keep happening.

Maybe I should just go back to CD's.

In for a penny...

Download a trial of TaskInfo
It has the ability to keep a history of CPU and memory usage of all tasks/threads.

Maybe that will pinpoint whatever is happening.

Also, take a look at shared IRQs.

Everyone has their favorites, but I like Everest Home version for excellent info on my system.

datdude · « **Reply #31 on:** April 17, 2005, 01:28:57 pm »

Thanks GHamer. Now I just need to figure out what to possibly look for and then maybe I can exterminate this damm bug!

GHammer · « **Reply #32 on:** April 17, 2005, 02:46:54 pm »

Quote from: datdude on April 17, 2005, 01:28:57 pm

Thanks GHamer. Now I just need to figure out what to possibly look for and then maybe I can exterminate this damm bug!

PCI Latency Tool-
Set latency for your video card at 64.
Leave all others alone, normally they don't need tweaked.
Make certain the tool is running at startup and that it is reapplying the tweak.
If you do not specifically set it to do this, the change is temporary.

TaskInfo-
As soon as you hear the stutter, open TaskInfo and see which apps have the highest CPU usage. The history will give you a bit to see which is or has been high.
You can configure the history and for this purpose I'd set it as high as it will go.

Everest Home-
I'd look at the IRQs. Perhaps one is shared with the sound card and causing a problem. Usually they do not, but since other avenues have not helped, it is something I'd look at.
Everest Home also gives suggestions if it sees something it thinks is odd.
Click each component and see what if anything it recommends.

Finally, I know you have done it, but look at the System event logs carefully after a stumble too. Easier to do if you empty the Application and System logs before you start MC.

Somehow, somewhere, somebody isn't playing nicely. If none of this gives you any indication, then it may be time to play everyone's favorite, Format and reinstall XP. If you have to go that route, I'd install XP, install the latest MC, allow Windows Update to patch. Run for awhile. All ok? Add a program. All ok? Add another. You get the idea.

I love a mystery!

datdude · « **Reply #33 on:** May 26, 2005, 02:08:31 am »

Well I have tried putting my sound card in different pci slots, and I also reduced the pci latency on my motherboard and I still have issues. Oh well I guess a new computer is in order. But unfortunately that order is goig to cost a pretty penny that I don't have right now!

GHammer · « **Reply #34 on:** May 26, 2005, 02:18:34 am »

A stick or two of memory is much cheaper. I'd try bumping the RAM to 384 or 512 and see what happens. Just noticed that you have 70 Mb free. Depending on what else you do, that could go away quickly.

My poor underpowered laptop has the same symptoms. I am just too cheap to buy memory for it when it is so old.

So, I don't listen to music on it if I don't have to...

datdude · « **Reply #35 on:** May 26, 2005, 11:02:36 pm »

Well Im sure 128 SDRAM can't be more than like 20 bones. It's worth a shot.

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Author Topic: Stumbling between Tracks (Read 7551 times)

JONCAT