Topic: Problem with Cue files and Replay Gain (Read 3784 times)

Higginz · « **on:** December 21, 2007, 03:59:12 pm »

Not sure if It's the later versions of MC, or something else, but today after updating to the new 120400 I have been facing problems when aplying the Replaygain (analyze) after converting .cue + single .ape file to .mp3 VBR.
It works on two or three songs, and one or two songs gets a -51db lowerage!(?). The rest of the songs on the album gets an 'Error' and don't pass the analyzing treatment.

Is this just me or do more of you out there have this?

Alex B · « **Reply #1 on:** December 21, 2007, 04:38:25 pm »

Quote from: Higginz on December 21, 2007, 03:59:12 pm

Not sure if It's the later versions of MC, or something else, but today after updating to the new 120400 I have been facing problems when aplying the Replaygain (analyze) after converting .cue + single .ape file to .mp3 VBR.
It works on two or three songs, and one or two songs gets a -51db lowerage!(?). The rest of the songs on the album gets an 'Error' and don't pass the analyzing treatment.

Is this just me or do more of you out there have this?

I can reproduce this. I tried one album using the following options:
Move to location & Update database: enabled
"Recycle Bin" & "Skip": disabled
Encoding: MP3 VBR extreme

Immediately after the conversion I selected the files and ran the analyzer. It behaved exactly as you explained.

In addition I tried the following: I moved the converted files to a different folder (I did this outside MC), dragged them to Playing Now and ran the analyzer. This time it went through normally.

It's a strange bug. I'll do some more testing and report.

JimH · « **Reply #2 on:** December 21, 2007, 04:47:56 pm »

Alex,
Didn't Matt say something about cue files needing to be re-imported in some cases?

Jim

Alex B · « **Reply #3 on:** December 21, 2007, 05:06:29 pm »

After the conversion the files are standard separate MP3 track files on the disk, but maybe the library does not corretly update the changed file info. The problem may have something to do with the previously stored playback ranges.

I am running a couple of additional tests. I'll report soon what I found.

Alex B · « **Reply #4 on:** December 21, 2007, 06:19:40 pm »

The problem is caused by the stored playback range data. MC doesn't clear the playback range info when cue tracks are converted to separate track files. In addition the file size information is not updated. The "Update Library (from tags)" tool cannot fix the problem because the stored cue track based info overrides the standard data that would come from the audio file.

For now, the only workaround is to not use the "update database" option and import the mp3 files as new library files.

I rip and store my archived album rips in the "APE+CUE" disc image format, but in addition I create APL* files. The APL system does not have this problem. That's why I have not noticed it even though I convert lossless disc images to lossy track files all the time.

*APL = Monkey's Audio Link file. APL files can be created from APE+CUE disc images. After creating them each album track has an individual small APL file that holds tags and the playback range information. MC has excellent support for the APL system (though, it doesn't have a tool for APL creation).

I prefer to create them with the separate MakeAPL tool which is included in the Monkey's Audio 3.99F installer package.

Higginz · « **Reply #5 on:** December 21, 2007, 11:48:57 pm »

Thanks for the information and confirmation Alex B.
It's strange that this has appeared in the later versions of MC though. I've never experienced this before.

Quote

In addition I tried the following: I moved the converted files to a different folder (I did this outside MC), dragged them to Playing Now and ran the analyzer. This time it went through normally.

I will try this procedure. Thanks.

/Higginz

Higginz · « **Reply #6 on:** December 22, 2007, 12:05:53 am »

Ok I just tried the 'drag 'n drop the cue file into playing now' - But unfortunately it didn't solve the analyze/Replay Gain problem.
This is strange.

Alex B · « **Reply #7 on:** December 22, 2007, 08:48:30 am »

The cue file's location is not related.

You need to make MC see the resulting MP3 files as new items (without the the stored playback range value).

You can either
- disable the "Update database" setting in the converter options or
- move the MP3 files outside MC
before dragging the files to Playing Now (or using some other import method).

Higginz · « **Reply #8 on:** December 22, 2007, 10:42:55 am »

Thanks Alex B.
I will see if I can do what you say.

In the meantime I've found a way around this.
But It includes the use of both Monkey's audio and Exact Audio Copy.

Monkeys Audio to decompress the .ape file
EAC to "split the wav by cue sheet"
Then I import the splitted wavs into MC where I convert them to .mp3
Analyzing/Replay Gain works really fine from there.

I'm still saddned that MC can't do this anymore. I used to do this almost on a dayly basis.
I hope that it will come back again, or be fixed in later versions.

Thanks
Higginz

Alex B · « **Reply #9 on:** December 22, 2007, 03:11:29 pm »

Quote from: Higginz on December 22, 2007, 10:42:55 am

Thanks Alex B.
I will see if I can do what you say.

In the meantime I've found a way around this.
But It includes the use of both Monkey's audio and Exact Audio Copy.

Monkeys Audio to decompress the .ape file
EAC to "split the wav by cue sheet"
Then I import the splitted wavs into MC where I convert them to .mp3
Analyzing/Replay Gain works really fine from there.

That's much more complex than what I suggested. For example, you can simply do the following:

1. Drag the cue file to Playing Now
2. Convert (remember to untick the "Update database" option)
3. Drag the MP3 files to Playing Now
4. Do what you want with the files. Analyze, right-click import, tag, rename, move etc.

Quote

I'm still saddned that MC can't do this anymore. I used to do this almost on a dayly basis.
I hope that it will come back again, or be fixed in later versions.

I am sure they will fix this. Remember to bump this thread after Christmas.

Higginz · « **Reply #10 on:** December 26, 2007, 10:47:32 am »

I hope that the people of MC will look into this bug - next year

Happy New Year to all MC fanatics

Higginz · « **Reply #11 on:** December 31, 2007, 05:22:30 am »

*bump*

Alex B · « **Reply #12 on:** January 07, 2008, 11:51:13 am »

Quote from: Alex B on December 21, 2007, 06:19:40 pm

The problem is caused by the stored playback range data. MC doesn't clear the playback range info when cue tracks are converted to separate track files. In addition the file size information is not updated. The "Update Library (from tags)" tool cannot fix the problem because the stored cue track based info overrides the standard data that would come from the audio file. ...

Bump

hit_ny · « **Reply #13 on:** January 15, 2008, 07:17:12 am »

Does this work now ?

Higginz · « **Reply #14 on:** January 15, 2008, 09:52:02 am »

I haven't seen a fix for this issue in the latest MC versions.

I hope that they'll fix it soon.

Alex B · « **Reply #15 on:** January 22, 2008, 02:05:09 pm »

hit_ny · « **Reply #16 on:** January 29, 2008, 07:44:44 am »

when's this getting fixed then...

Higginz · « **Reply #17 on:** January 29, 2008, 10:32:49 am »

I do hope that they know about this problem.
It used to work so fine... $:-\$

Higginz · « **Reply #18 on:** February 03, 2008, 08:01:35 am »

*bump*

hit_ny · « **Reply #19 on:** February 08, 2008, 09:34:42 am »

still waiting ?

hit_ny · « **Reply #20 on:** February 14, 2008, 08:57:31 am »

still pending

Higginz · « **Reply #21 on:** February 16, 2008, 11:23:23 am »

I used Music Jukebox 12 today to see if it could apply replaygain to a MJ 12 converted and splitted .cue + single file.

No.
Same issue.

I don't think that they will do anything about this I'm afraid.
Luckily there are other ways (programs) to do this.

Alex B · « **Reply #22 on:** February 16, 2008, 04:53:29 pm »

I hope this problem is on Matt's list. It doesn't affect only the analyzer. Also correct playback is impossible.

However, I don't personally consider the problem very serious. As I explained, you can easily avoid it by not using the "update database" conversion option. The files will be converted just fine, just not immediately included in the library. After the conversion you can import them manually or use Auto-Importer. The playback range field will not be populated.

INTERACT FORUM

Author Topic: Problem with Cue files and Replay Gain (Read 3784 times)