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[gappie]

at this moment my library contains a lot of custom fields. since the nestable function i was thinking about using keywords for putting things together and using only a standard field. but i was wondering what and how i can get some information back from it. lets take for instance the cd im listening to now.
'outside this area' from doppelmoppel. i could as keywords put in there:
genre\jazz\free jazz;location\europe\germany;musician\conrad bauer\trombone;musician\johannes bauer\trombone;musician\joe sachse\guitars;musician\uwe kropinski\guitars;compo......etc

would it be possible to get a list (pain, or calculated field) where only the musicians are listed?, or genre?
would it be possible to get a list with the instruments? (turning the nest around)

i did some testing first. but the expressions like ListItem, don't do the trick, as far as i understand them. but my head started to explode in the end. so i thought i could use some help.

am i on a wrong track altogether? 

thanks
gab

[JimH]

What is the wind direction tonight?

[gappie]

What is the wind direction tonight?

north east i guess, but not strong.
 
in the weekend it should be sun alover. looking forward to that.

i also got the feeling that this idea from me was not making sence.
ah well

 

hey. that is you on the pics?

[JimH]

Sure.  You almost always make perfect sense.

Warm regards to your native country and wherever else you may sleep tonight.

[gappie]

thanks alot.
and indeed that is what i should do now.

sleep well later to you people at the other side of the big water.

[gappie]

ive been experimenting with it the last hours. where it fails is that ListItem should have a second parameter. in that case it could be possible to extract a list from nested keywords. ah well. guess that would make things to complex. 

[hit_ny]

lets take for instance the cd im listening to now.
'outside this area' from doppelmoppel. i could as keywords put in there:
genre\jazz\free jazz;location\europe\germany;musician\conrad bauer\trombone;musician\johannes bauer\trombone;musician\joe sachse\guitars;musician\uwe kropinski\guitars;compo......etc

would it be possible to get a list (pain, or calculated field) where only the musicians are listed?, or genre?
would it be possible to get a list with the instruments? (turning the nest around)

trying to understand what result's supposed to look like ?

Genre
|_____Jazz
              |____Free Jazz
                              |_____Location
                                                |_____Germany

you can have that in a pane or split amongst more.

still trying to find a rule where if x & y were satisifed then nest otherwise use panes

[Jaguu]

ive been experimenting with it the last hours. where it fails is that ListItem should have a second parameter. in that case it could be possible to extract a list from nested keywords. ah well. guess that would make things to complex. 

I came to the same conclusion and proposed to add a second delimiter, one delimiter for list items, one as a nesting separator. The current one is the delimiter for list items. That's why the function 'listitem' does not work as you thought it would.

For the same reason you cannot do a "Rename files from properties" and create a folder structure reflecting the nested tags.

[gappie]

trying to understand what result's supposed to look like ?

Genre
|_____Jazz
              |____Free Jazz
                              |_____Location
                                                |_____Germany

you can have that in a pane or split amongst more.

still trying to find a rule where if x & y were satisifed then nest otherwise use panes

if that was the case then: yes i could.
but it look like this
Genre
|_____Jazz
              |____Free Jazz

Location
|_____Europe
              |______Germany

Musician
|_____conrad bauer
              |______Trombone
         Johannes bauer
              |______Trombone
         Joe sachse
              |______guitar
         Uwe Kropinski
              |______guitar

etc

[hit_ny]

..and you would like it to look like ??

[robydago]

gappie,
it can be done if you want a calculated field containing this:

*************************
conrad bauer
          |______Trombone
Johannes bauer
          |______Trombone
Joe sachse
          |______guitar
Uwe Kropinski
          |______guitar
*************************


but I don't know if it's possible if you want a field with this:

*************************
conrad bauer
Johannes bauer
Joe sachse
Uwe Kropinski
*************************

Ciao,
roberto

[jgreen]

On first look, I think what you're searching for is "Nestable Panes".  Think of Excel, the way you can expand or collapse a group of columns which are subordinate to the master column.  Perhaps there's something in having panes that could do this too, although I grant that there's a certain usability threshold to be crossed.  Still, I think it would be awfully cool.

Main difference, as I see it, is:  With nestable panes you would have far fewer view schemes.  In fact, you could think of child views as nested within the master view.  Longer initial load time, yes, but immediate drill-downs.  a "dashboard" look and feel.

[jgreen]

FWIW, when I said "nestable panes" I meant "nestable columns".  You can kind of tell by the way I use the two terms interchangeably, but I just thought I'd clarify.

[gappie]

gappie,
it can be done if you want a calculated field containing this:

*************************
conrad bauer
          |______Trombone
Johannes bauer
          |______Trombone
Joe sachse
          |______guitar
Uwe Kropinski
          |______guitar
*************************


but I don't know if it's possible if you want a field with this:

*************************
conrad bauer
Johannes bauer
Joe sachse
Uwe Kropinski
*************************

Ciao,
roberto

how would you do that rob? ive tried a lot of things. with a calculated field with a very long rule i could take out the names only, i gues, even adding the instrument. That will maybe be the route ill take restricting also the values ill put in the keywords. an other problem is that i can get a list as a result of a calculated field. but the nesting does not work.

im really curious how you would do that.

thanks
gab

[gappie]

..and you would like it to look like ??

it looks fine, but i would like to extract values from it. like a calculated list with al the musicians, or a pane only showing me the locations.
 

[gappie]

On first look, I think what you're searching for is "Nestable Panes".  Think of Excel, the way you can expand or collapse a group of columns which are subordinate to the master column.  Perhaps there's something in having panes that could do this too, although I grant that there's a certain usability threshold to be crossed.  Still, I think it would be awfully cool.

Main difference, as I see it, is:  With nestable panes you would have far fewer view schemes.  In fact, you could think of child views as nested within the master view.  Longer initial load time, yes, but immediate drill-downs.  a "dashboard" look and feel.

yes, i think you are right. as far as understand what you say.


with the nesting you can do great things. but makin a list with items that are one nested is nearly not possible. say for instance you have all people on pictures nicely sorted and nested under colegues and friends and family and IGINSTA (im glad i never see them again), there is no way to just make a pane with all people.
on the other hand. there are some non listed fields that would be very usefull to make them nested. take for instance genre. you could put the value jazz\free jazz in there and use datatype=list to show it as nested.

thanks
gab

[robydago]

how would you do that rob? ive tried a lot of things. with a calculated field with a very long rule i could take out the names only, i gues, even adding the instrument. That will maybe be the route ill take restricting also the values ill put in the keywords. an other problem is that i can get a list as a result of a calculated field. but the nesting does not work.

sorry gab,
when I wrote that I didn't have my MC setup available.
I checked and what I really got in my calculated field is this:

*************************
conrad bauer/Trombone
Johannes bauer/Trombone
Joe sachse/guitar
Uwe Kropinski/guitar
*************************

and since only the keywords field is nestable, you can't do much with it.
if calculated fields were nestable I guess it would work...

judging but what you wrote, you were able to do the same, so I think I can't help you.
sorry again

[hit_ny]

and since only the keywords field is nestable, you can't do much with it.
if calculated fields were nestable I guess it would work...

Is this a call for more nestable fields ?

by the looks of it, only fields defined as list would qualify.

[robydago]

Is this a call for more nestable fields ?

yes!

by the looks of it, only fields defined as list would qualify.

but calculated fields are just... calculated: there's no way to set data type

[gappie]

i really dont know why you should appologies, rob. ill appreciate that you try to help and think along my lines.

but calculated fields are just... calculated: there's no way to set data type

but you can set the data typ more or less. take for instance genre (a standard field). fill in for one file:

southern rock;Blues Rock

now make a calculated field (or a pain with an expression) called genres and put inthere: [genre]&Datatype=[ list ]  (without the empty spaces)
the result

southern rock
Blues Rock

it behaves like a list. but this is not true for nesting. works nice though.

[robydago]

gappie,
thanks for the [genre]&Datatype=[ list ] trick!

i'll play with it to see if it can be a good solution to have more precise genre tagging while keeping all info in the file itself (=no user fields) and still being able to have a good view scheme in MC