Topic: Network Library Access (UPnP) (Read 14316 times)

DonP · « **on:** June 10, 2008, 04:40:04 pm »

I've set the Auto-Import Folder to the one containing my audio files, and have even run the Auto-Import Now tool several times, yet I cannot see (or rather hear) any files on my player, which is a Denon deck hard-wired to the network. The files, which are primarily mp3 except for a few imported by Media Center, which are wma, are on a network hard drive also hard-wired as is the system running Media Center. I can see the server name but no files. There is a lack of intuitiveness in the UI that has me mystified so I am sure I have missed something.

Also, how can the server be renamed so that the component does not show servername (Media Center)?

Thanks.

Don

JimH · « **Reply #1 on:** June 10, 2008, 04:45:55 pm »

Welcome to Interact.

If you run MC on the server, do the files show in its library?

Did you start the UPnP server in that copy of MC? Settings for it?

Renaming may be possible on the Denon. I'm not sure.

John Gateley · « **Reply #2 on:** June 10, 2008, 05:00:57 pm »

The name cannot be changed. I included "Media Center" because multiple UPnP servers can be running and you need some way to distinguish them.

Let us know the answers to Jim's questions/comments.

j

DonP · « **Reply #3 on:** June 10, 2008, 05:41:44 pm »

Yes, the UPnP server is running but again, MC isn't intuitive so it is unclear where to look for files. Selecting Library Server, which is where I would expect them to be, shows only some server log entries. If I select Artist/Album or Disk Location from the top of the menu, it does show the files so they are there.

The UPnP server is set to

Convert Audio if Necessary
Encoder: MP3
Port: 9000
Receiver: Automatic Detection (Neither mine nor any Denon is in the listing even though the Windows XP system shows it in its My Network Places.)

Selecting the UPnP server, it shows line after line of errors which have no meaning to me:

06/10/08 14:55:30 - Cannot autodetect device, User-Agent: KnOS/3.2 bridgeCo-DMP/3.0 DLNADOC/1.50 INTEL_NMPR/2.0

Don't you think would make more sense if file names were shown, or text indicating that there are no files found and a way to add them? That is my two-cents' worth.

As for the server name, it is understandable to minimize naming conflicts by providing some automatic way to keep it from happening accidentally. However, the final name should be up to the user who can be credited as having some common sense! In any event, I have no problem with it being listed as Media Center but I do not want my server name showing nor do I want the parenthesis. It is messy.

Thanks.

Don

JimH · « **Reply #4 on:** June 10, 2008, 06:14:02 pm »

Don,
We can help if you have the patience. It sounds like the device isn't supported, and won't work without changes in our server. On our wiki page (link above) there is info on how to provide us enough information that we can make the changes.

When you post, it isn't clear whether you're talking about what you see in MC or on the Denon.

Thanks,

Jim

DonP · « **Reply #5 on:** June 10, 2008, 06:19:48 pm »

In the Denon, I see only servername (Media Center) but no files. Everything else I described was in MC. This same Denon works perfectly in TwonkyMedia but if I can find the information you need, I'll try to provide it for you.

Thanks again.

Don

JimH · « **Reply #6 on:** June 10, 2008, 06:27:44 pm »

You could try changing settings in MC's UPnP server.

You could try the wiki.

DonP · « **Reply #7 on:** June 10, 2008, 06:34:49 pm »

I looked through the wiki before my original post but could find nothing that helped. Any specific suggestions?

Don

John Gateley · « **Reply #8 on:** June 10, 2008, 07:44:15 pm »

Hi Don,

First - we are not Twonky (nor any of the rest), nor do we work the same way. They provide UPnP access to files, we provide UPnP access to a library. What's the difference? Playlists and especially smartlists.

So - you have to use Media Center first to set up your library, and I'm suspecting this is the step you are missing. Forget about the server section for now, and import all your music into your library, create a few playlists and smartlists, maybe tag some stuff, and make sure it plays. Then go back to the UPnP server and try again.

If it still doesn't work, we'll go from there.

j

DonP · « **Reply #9 on:** June 10, 2008, 09:08:18 pm »

It is finally working after using the Advanced receiver settings by setting to Use Flat URLs; to NOT include SessionID and to NOT include Session Headers. Probably unrelated, I also stopped The Library server. Now it needs only the name changed as it appears in the receiver.

Thanks for your help.

Don

JimH · « **Reply #10 on:** June 10, 2008, 09:43:29 pm »

Thanks for letting us know the solution.

John Gateley · « **Reply #11 on:** June 11, 2008, 10:37:52 am »

What model Denon are you using?

I've added the settings you've found to our auto-detection list, would you mind testing this for me?

Thanks,

j

DonP · « **Reply #12 on:** June 11, 2008, 11:49:28 am »

It is a Denon AVR-3808CI and I would be happy to test it for you! Media Center shows no updates currently available. Is this where I'll find the change once it's been made?

This receiver cannot show JPGs in the Internet Radio mode even though Media Center tries to make them available. How do I block it from listing them remotely? When it finds one, it causes the receiver to hang up.

Don

John Gateley · « **Reply #13 on:** June 11, 2008, 02:04:24 pm »

I'll send an e-mail (to the address you used to subscribe to the forum) when it's ready.

Media Center's check for updates will only return the most stable updates. The latest and greatest is available at the top of this forum.

j

DonP · « **Reply #14 on:** June 13, 2008, 12:20:57 pm »

Hi John,

Thanks! I tested it and it seems to work just fine now when in autodetect mode. Although I am a techie, I far from being an expert on streaming media or media servers but it would be my guess that the settings I discovered would be closer to a default for most unlisted receivers.

Don

John Gateley · « **Reply #15 on:** June 13, 2008, 02:38:33 pm »

You'd think so, but unfortunately the UPnP devices are a rather independent bunch...

Thanks for testing

j

DWAnderson · « **Reply #16 on:** June 13, 2008, 04:03:18 pm »

Quote from: DonP on June 11, 2008, 11:49:28 am

This receiver cannot show JPGs in the Internet Radio mode even though Media Center tries to make them available. How do I block it from listing them remotely? When it finds one, it causes the receiver to hang up.

Edit each View Scheme (or group of View Schemes) you don't want to appear and uncheck "Show in Theater View"

Maybe this could be changed to "Show in Theater View/UPnP"?

DonP · « **Reply #17 on:** June 13, 2008, 05:18:34 pm »

Unfortunately I cannot find the setting to make the changes. Can you be more specific?

Also, I installed a test version of MC this morning and since then the menu listings on the Denon's monitor are quite different than they were before the update. It would be great if the user could specify exactly what was showing and what was not since now it lists folders for Photos, Videos etc. that should not show, and one more step seems to be necessary to get to the music at all. If there IS a way, I have not discovered it.

Before I would select servername (Media Center) (Media Center's choice, not mine!) and the genres would be listed along with other items that I do not want. Now I need to select servername (Media Center)->Music before I can see the listings! When I select Albums/Artists now, it shows all the songs directly rather than listing them under album name or artist!

If the settings are there, any help would be appreciated to tell me where to find them or please consider this a change/feature request. If nothing else I would like to control what I see in the display for the server name rather than servername (Media Center).

Thanks.

Don

JimH · « **Reply #18 on:** June 13, 2008, 05:50:58 pm »

Quote from: DonP on June 13, 2008, 05:18:34 pm

Unfortunately I cannot find the setting to make the changes. Can you be more specific?

Under Audio, for example, right click on "Artist/Album" and choose "Edit view scheme".

DonP · « **Reply #19 on:** June 13, 2008, 06:13:01 pm »

Thanks, I see it now.

However, I do not see how to remove the Images and Video folders and I do not see how to make it go directly to the albums when I select servername (Media Center). The intermediate step of servername(Media Center)->Music was not there before the update this morning so either it changed some setting or the program itself was changed. Since I have only music, I do not want the other steps. There are also several other menu items that I do not want to see on the display but the selections for them in Edit view scheme do not appear to be editable.

I also want to change servername (Media Center) to something of my own choosing (yes, I am being persistent as this is important to me!).

Don

JimH · « **Reply #20 on:** June 13, 2008, 06:16:15 pm »

Quote from: DonP on June 13, 2008, 06:13:01 pm

I also want to change servername (Media Center) to something of my own choosing (yes, I am being persistent as this is important to me!).

How about "no, you can't do that"? Would that work?

DonP · « **Reply #21 on:** June 13, 2008, 06:30:12 pm »

Sorry, no, that does not work. I would like to make a feature request to be able to do it as it is very important. Other than this major limitation, it is a fine program even if it does have a steep learning curve.

JimH · « **Reply #22 on:** June 13, 2008, 06:45:04 pm »

Anything is possible, but we're not likely to make a change in that area anytime soon.

John Gateley · « **Reply #23 on:** June 13, 2008, 11:07:35 pm »

Quote from: DonP on June 13, 2008, 06:13:01 pm

However, I do not see how to remove the Images and Video folders

Is the Denon audio only? I didn't include the setting for this. I'll fix it on monday.

For now: Choose Denon from the list of players. Then change to "Advanced". This will enable all the check boxes, but leaving them at the settings for the Denon. Just click the box for audio only.

j

DonP · « **Reply #24 on:** June 14, 2008, 02:23:16 am »

As far as network media playing is concerned, it is apparently audio only because it hangs when I try to select an image and it does not show any cover art.

Thanks.

Don

DonP · « **Reply #25 on:** June 14, 2008, 02:49:08 am »

Thanks! It also can accept special characters so blocking them needs to be disabled for the Denon. I had wondered why they were suddenly not showing up!

Don

Rob L · « **Reply #26 on:** June 14, 2008, 03:06:11 am »

Quote from: DonP on June 13, 2008, 06:30:12 pm

Sorry, no, that does not work. I would like to make a feature request to be able to do it as it is very important. Other than this major limitation, it is a fine program even if it does have a steep learning curve.

Why is it "very important"? I, along with plenty of others, have been using this for ages now, and I really can't think of anything less important personally. I really don't get it.
The name is simply the name you chose to call your PC plus the name of the server software in brackets. Seems very logical to me, and I really couldn't care less. It has to have a name. The name it's got makes it clear what it is. Why does it need to be something else? Seriously, I just don't understand why you find it such a big deal, and I can only assume I'm missing something or you're somehow misunderstanding it.

DonP · « **Reply #27 on:** June 14, 2008, 03:13:12 am »

Because those using it are entirely non-technical and the long name with the server name preceding it and the parenthesis cause no end of confusion. It looks entirely unlike the other entries that the Denon uses for accessing Internet radio and they expect consistent menu items with a particular naming convention. Internet radio, for example, is Internet Radio rather that some long convoluted and meaningless (to a non-techie) name. They couldn't care less about the name of the PC.

Don

John Gateley · « **Reply #28 on:** June 16, 2008, 09:23:38 am »

In build 515, it now accepts International Characters, and does Audio Only.

j

DonP · « **Reply #29 on:** June 16, 2008, 05:54:12 pm »

Thanks! Where can this version be found?

Don

JimH · « **Reply #30 on:** June 16, 2008, 06:55:01 pm »

It (or a later build) will be posted on the MC12 board soon.

Thanks for your help getting the Denon device added.

DonP · « **Reply #31 on:** June 18, 2008, 01:55:59 pm »

The Denon now seems to work properly! Thanks for such a fast fix.

Don

mhwlng · « **Reply #32 on:** June 19, 2008, 02:00:19 am »

on my 3808, if I check 'skip child count', then navigation seems to be faster...
(except for playlists\smartlists, that still takes 7 seconds to appear)

Marcel

John Gateley · « **Reply #33 on:** June 19, 2008, 09:09:06 am »

I need to know some data: how big is the list being loaded, how big are the lists that are it's children, and how long does it take to load with and without the option?

Thanks,

j

DonP · « **Reply #34 on:** June 19, 2008, 12:16:16 pm »

If you were writing the question to me or to the last response is unclear but by "big", do you mean number of folders or the size of the data in them? If folders, then the root folder has about 137 artists (including "Assorted") and the most that any subfolder has is 64. Most of the rest have only one or two album subfolders.

If you mean the size of the data itself, most were ripped using the highest quality of MP3 (and a few are WMA). The folder totals 45.5 GB with 8,116 files and 579 sub folders.

They seem to load quickly although they show lots of "dead icons" in Media Center of items from compilations and collections that I had to move manually as I was unable to move them in Media Center. Media Center seems to rip compilations oddly so I nearly always have to rearrange them manually.

At this point it is probably a good idea to remove all library databases and reindex the folders as they are but I am not sure how to do that. I do see lots of odd files appearing in the root media folder. Are these the databases and is there some way to put them elsewhere? I don't really want them in with the media.

Don

John Gateley · « **Reply #35 on:** June 19, 2008, 12:51:20 pm »

Hi Don,

That was for Marcel, but if you have data post it here.

By size I mean the number of children/elements. Not the quality of the tracks.

"Skip Child Count" is actually a breaking of the UPnP protocol, so I'd rather not turn it on by default, but some players do need it.

j

mhwlng · « **Reply #36 on:** June 20, 2008, 02:38:25 am »

Quote from: John Gateley on June 19, 2008, 09:09:06 am

I need to know some data: how big is the list being loaded, how big are the lists that are it's children, and how long does it take to load with and without the option?

the denon shows 10 or so lines on my tv and you have a 'page up'/'page down' on the remote.
I only navigate to artist\album and smartlists...

If I show the artist list (400 items or so), then 'page up'/'page down' function in this list takes 2 seconds or so, when skip child count is unchecked.
it is instant,if it is checked...

the only really slow thing is drilling down to playlists\smartlists (only 35 or so items). this takes about 7 seconds (regardless of the child count setting)
I don't understand why the artist list with > 400 items displays much faster

Marcel

John Gateley · « **Reply #37 on:** June 20, 2008, 09:32:46 am »

Hi Marcel - it's not the immediate child list, it's the children of that child, so when you are walking down the playlist part of the tree, it has to create all the grandchildren lists. That's what takes so long. For now, just check the "skip child count" option.

j

mhwlng · « **Reply #38 on:** June 20, 2008, 09:36:10 am »

sure, no problem...

do you know why this doesn't seem to have any effect for the smartlists ?

Marcel

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Author Topic: Network Library Access (UPnP) (Read 14316 times)