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Author Topic: Re-read your post and tell me ...  (Read 2315 times)

jolo

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Re-read your post and tell me ...
« on: September 11, 2009, 05:38:04 am »

I've recently bought MC14 despite I promised not to. in hope that some annoying interface features and usability problems introduced in MC13 will be fixed. Unfortunately right after installation  I saw another "improvement".

Quick search suggestions pop-up is very annoying. It occupies a lot of screen and stays on top of other windows when focus is switched to other application. Is it possible to have it displayed on demand or disabled at all?

Tommyd,

I have to tell you. Re-read your post and tell me how motivated you would be, if you were working on a project and you got a memo, with a sarcastic crack on it, while the hundreds of hours of work and the 100 other great parts of the project were working great.

I would suggest that you come from a more positive, helpful point of view. If you think, you can do better, write your own and charge the same amount for your "Swiss Army Knife", multi-media application as JRiver does. I would happily test the demo.

You suggestions are and bug notices are very important to help the development. But, the way that it is written, helps no one, and I know I wouldn't exactly be modivated by it.

Why don't you just say that you would like if a certain feature was improved. Always a good idea to list the hardware you are using and OS. Then say thanks for your help in advance, or something to be appreciative that you can communicate directly to the development team.

This is not like Microsoft, Apple or the zillion others, where you are communicating to a disinterested, off shore contractor, making pennies and gets reviewed on how many tech support queries he gets rid of.

We are more of a team, working for continuous improvement.

Nothing personal, but I hope you understand where I am coming from.

Jon
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JimH

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Re: Re-read your post and tell me ...
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2009, 07:13:40 am »

Thanks, Jolo.  I moved this out of the build thread.  It deserves a wider audience.

I'm particularly grateful for this comment:

Quote
We are more of a team, working for continuous improvement.

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benn600

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Re: Re-read your post and tell me ...
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2009, 10:25:00 am »

Should "tommyd" be in the thread title at least so he might notice this?
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tommyd

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Re: Re-read your post and tell me ...
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2009, 02:24:37 pm »

Tommyd,

I have to tell you. Re-read your post and tell me how motivated you would be, if you were working on a project and you got a memo, with a sarcastic crack on it, while the hundreds of hours of work and the 100 other great parts of the project were working great.

OK. My post was a bit sarcastic. If someone of Media Center development team feels offended, I' sorry. It isn't my point to insult someone. But on the other hand MC is commercial project, not Open Source application, where if I don't like some things I can fix it by myself or find someone who did it already and published patches or fork.

I've found MC12 good enough to pay for it, and for next two releases which I still don use because I don't like some changes mostly in interface.  One of reason why I bought upgrades was to have at least moral right to ask for changes. 

Quote
I would suggest that you come from a more positive, helpful point of view. If you think, you can do better, write your own and charge the same amount for your "Swiss Army Knife", multi-media application as JRiver does. I would happily test the demo.

I really appreciate  work done and no, I cannot do better. I'm not experienced in application development   but I work as IT specialist and I did some intranet web apps programming. In this area users are the most important thing. Bells and whistles aren't important at all. Application should not be ugly, some polish is necessary but most important things are error free logic and usability. Commercial application development has some other rules but usability and working features are still at the top.

Quote
Why don't you just say that you would like if a certain feature was improved. Always a good idea to list the hardware you are using and OS. Then say thanks for your help in advance, or something to be appreciative that you can communicate directly to the development team.


I have written few posts reporting problems, feature request etc. I got some useful replies but some other were ignored, after some search  I've realized that several other users reported the same problem and were ignored. This was reason for this rant.

Quote
This is not like Microsoft, Apple or the zillion others, where you are communicating to a disinterested, off shore contractor, making pennies and gets reviewed on how many tech support queries he gets rid of.

But I've felt like that.

Quote
Jon

Tommyd.


PS. English in not my native language, so sorry for style and grammar errors, and maybe sometime I don't really feel weight of some English expressions.

PS2. My OS is Windows XP with all available patches on HP Compaq nx6325 and AUDIOTRAK  Maya 44 USB. Ask for details You need.
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glynor

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Re: Re-read your post and tell me ...
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2009, 02:44:23 pm »

I have written few posts reporting problems, feature request etc. I got some useful replies but some other were ignored, after some search  I've realized that several other users reported the same problem and were ignored. This was reason for this rant.

I've been on this forum for a long time, and I guess I'd say this...

Just because no one takes immediate action on a particular bug report or request, doesn't necessarily mean that it has been ignored.  I've seen, personally, instances where things I've asked for (where it seemed "ignored" for all intents and purposes), were eventually implemented months and/or years later.  A perfect example is the Tremote capability, which I've clamored for for years!

The JRiver team seems impressive because of all the great work they put out almost every day.  However, in reality it is a quite small (but mighty) team.  They do the best they can to address user concerns and requests, but some things need to be "triaged".  Could they sometimes do a better job of communicating and/or tracking these requests?  Sure.  But we all have things we could improve upon, and honestly, I think that the level of responsiveness that we get out of them is still heads-and-shoulders above what you get from 99.9% of other software development firms.  (I've submitted no fewer than 50 bug reports regarding Windows 7 to Microsoft during the Beta and RC program.  I've had zero responses.)

The other suggestion I'd have is this...

If you want to stand the best chance of getting some "pet" issue implemented/fixed, the most important factor is you.  How likely you are to get the response you desire is a DIRECT consequence of how effectively you:
1. communicate your need
2. explain how it will impact other users as well as yourself (they frown on spending resources on "specialty" needs from niche audiences, for obvious reasons)
3. illustrate a range of possible actions that they could take to address the issue or concern
4. remain vigilant about the issue (posting it once in the build thread is often not enough, if it is a major/systematic concern).  The squeaky wheel really does get the oil, so long as it squeaks in a nice tone.
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JimH

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Re: Re-read your post and tell me ...
« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2009, 02:51:19 pm »

PS. English in not my native language, so sorry for style and grammar errors, and maybe sometime I don't really feel weight of some English expressions.
I was guessing that.  It would be better if the word "annoying" didn't appear in a feature request.  I can say that I find it annoying, at least.  ;)

It's probably enough to say "I don't like..." or "I'm not happy with" or "I think it would be better ..." or simply "I prefer ....".

I don't think your post was offensive.  Jolo was just pointing out that you can make your opinion more welcome and more valuable by a careful choice of words.

This whole forum is a lesson in communication.  I know I've learned a lot by annoying a few.
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glynor

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Re: Re-read your post and tell me ...
« Reply #6 on: September 11, 2009, 05:08:13 pm »

This whole forum is a lesson in communication.  I know I've learned a lot by annoying a few.

Truer words were never typed.   ;)  ;D
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jolo

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Re: Re-read your post and tell me ...
« Reply #7 on: September 12, 2009, 01:14:13 am »

Glynor,

I wish I could write as succinctly as you can. That "pet issue" list is great stuff. I have copied and pasted your four steps on the effective way to word a "pet" issue request on my openoffice.org word processor, so that I can keep it in my documentation, and possibly pass it on to others. (Glynor, I hope you are not expecting royalties, if I pass those steps on to some others  ;D).


Funny thing is that a day or two ago, I posted, for about the third or fourth time, my hope for MC to have a 64 bit version. That is a pet thing of mine. However,
I understand that the resources are limited, and that the MC staff, would like to magically fix everything. But, they will be pragmatic and work on bugs first, then will do enhancements that will be of most importance to customer request (as well as how long it can take).   Maybe others might add on to my request for the enhancement as well, not in a critical way, but saying things like, "Yeah I would really like a 64 bit version as well, especially with Windows 7 and the promise that MS is going to pay much more  attention ot the 64 bit users. So maybe, my pet enhancement might go higher in the enhancement cue, as it would serve to our teammates, the MC developers,  that their customers are telling us that coming out with a 64 bit version is important to them.    

Whenever I ask for a enhancement/change, I always try to post it, in a way that hopefully would be taken as positive by the team, which include the family of customers. Just like you were describing Glynor.

A last point. Glynor, I have been in IT for sometime over two decades. I hate to admit it, but when I was in college, I had to punch cards that would represent my Fortran, Assembler or whatever computer language I was using. But, most valuable over the years were some of the "soft skills" classes that I was able to send myself to as well as participate in, from a firm I was working for.
One in particular, showed how, by being overly emotional, showing frustration at a customer service person, like a bank teller for example, then seeing the person storm out of the bank and NOT get what he needed accomplished.
Then showing a video, with a model, like Glynor mentioned. I have learned, and just used Friday for a very difficult situation I was in, how the words, "Can you please help me", can be magical. Especially that magic of "please help me". For the most part, people on the customer service lines are used to hearing others frustration and a lot of criticism, and if they help someone, usually people don't call to thank them, or acknowledge them (when doing computer/system admin support), when things just work flawlessly.
So when someone says, "Can you help me, or I really would appreciate your help, etc, if it is not the poor off shored contractor, I have had people do the most remarkable things, even from the IRS.  So I think Glynor that there is a universal significance to what you have written.


Media Center is so unique, in this day of Corporate buyouts and off shoring.  The increased distance between the customer and the product that keeps getting worse and worse.
There are many times that I might spend a lot of time just looking for a contact email or phone number. So many make you go through the knowledge base first, for about 10 passes (I am exaggerating on the 101 times of course), then if you ever can get to the alleged support email or form to enter, what I tend to get back is something from either a computer or a off shore contractor, who doesn't have the training, experience, and motivation to answer you question. Sometimes, on the phone,  I wait for the off shore contractor to get on the web site and is quoting me, what I also am looking at from the web site at the same time. Sometimes the calls turn into training sessions, where I am the trainer.
On email, I can tell when I am getting some electronic message that is direct from some "help desk" software and it is obvious that my query wasn't read.

Jon



I've been on this forum for a long time, and I guess I'd say this...

Just because no one takes immediate action on a particular bug report or request, doesn't necessarily mean that it has been ignored.  I've seen, personally, instances where things I've asked for (where it seemed "ignored" for all intents and purposes), were eventually implemented months and/or years later.  A perfect example is the Tremote capability, which I've clamored for for years!

The JRiver team seems impressive because of all the great work they put out almost every day.  However, in reality it is a quite small (but mighty) team.  They do the best they can to address user concerns and requests, but some things need to be "triaged".  Could they sometimes do a better job of communicating and/or tracking these requests?  Sure.  But we all have things we could improve upon, and honestly, I think that the level of responsiveness that we get out of them is still heads-and-shoulders above what you get from 99.9% of other software development firms.  (I've submitted no fewer than 50 bug reports regarding Windows 7 to Microsoft during the Beta and RC program.  I've had zero responses.)

The other suggestion I'd have is this...

If you want to stand the best chance of getting some "pet" issue implemented/fixed, the most important factor is you.  How likely you are to get the response you desire is a DIRECT consequence of how effectively you:
1. communicate your need
2. explain how it will impact other users as well as yourself (they frown on spending resources on "specialty" needs from niche audiences, for obvious reasons)
3. illustrate a range of possible actions that they could take to address the issue or concern
4. remain vigilant about the issue (posting it once in the build thread is often not enough, if it is a major/systematic concern).  The squeaky wheel really does get the oil, so long as it squeaks in a nice tone.
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