Topic: Does This New Video Card Seem Appropriate? (Read 4461 times)

nwboater · « **on:** August 17, 2011, 03:48:50 pm »

I would like to start using RO HQ and the onboard graphics of our MOBO Gigabyte GA-880GA-UD3H and Athlon X4 635 CPU wont handle it. Based on others success with the NVIDIA 550 card I am thinking of getting this new Asus ENGTX550 TI DC TOP/DI/1GD5 GeForce GTX 550 Ti (Fermi) 1GB 192-bit GDDR5 graphics card http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121434.

I picked this one over the Gigabyte card that jmone used because I need a d sub connector on the card to sometimes feed a local monitor. As best I can tell this card is as powerful or more so than the Gigabyte one.

In one of the reviews on the card it said it needed as a minimum a CPU that may be more powerful than ours. (now I can't find that review). I couldn't find any minimum system CPU requirements on the Asus, Nvidia or any other review sites.

Our HTPC is a full size case with good airflow so space shouldn't be an issue. We have a 550 watt supply.

Can anyone think of a reason this card shouldn't do what I want in our system?

Thanks,
Rod

DarkPenguin · « **Reply #1 on:** August 19, 2011, 11:19:51 pm »

Are you sure that won't generate more heat than you want in a HTPC?

jmone · « **Reply #2 on:** August 20, 2011, 12:23:14 am »

My 550Ti has been running pretty cool considering it has been in a Shuttle with only the one case fan the double duties cooling the CPU.

Also FYI - check these posts out from Doom9 on how to take a powerful card yet throttlel them for video playback to limit both Wattage and hence heat output.

http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=65585.msg442540#msg442540

Daydream · « **Reply #3 on:** August 20, 2011, 01:34:25 am »

Quote from: jmone on August 20, 2011, 12:23:14 am

Also FYI - check these posts out from Doom9 on how to take a powerful card yet throttlel them for video playback to limit both Wattage and hence heat output.

Hehe, was just reading about that today; pretty nifty tools.
Hey, Jmone, what would it be your impression regarding video clock matching? Never had an Nvidia card, so I read about custom freq. definitions available in the drivers and whatnot.

nwboater · « **Reply #4 on:** August 20, 2011, 08:40:15 am »

Quote from: DarkPenguin on August 19, 2011, 11:19:51 pm

Are you sure that won't generate more heat than you want in a HTPC?

Since some consider Canada the "Frozen North" it may be helpful! We might be able to remove one of our 8 blankets while watching a movie.

Are you concerned about heat affecting other components? Our HTPC is not a small case - it's an ATX mid tower case and I believe fairly well ventilated.

Thanks,
Rod

nwboater · « **Reply #5 on:** August 20, 2011, 08:48:29 am »

jmone & Daydream - Thanks for the info on 'throttling' the GPU.

I would rather get one video card that may be a bit of overkill but will hopefully last for awhile.

Does anyone have a feeling about the need for a super fast CPU to be able to keep up with the GPU? When I built our HTPC about a year ago the quad core AMD Athlon x4 635 2.9 GHZ was fairly powerful.

Thanks,
Rod

DarkPenguin · « **Reply #6 on:** August 20, 2011, 11:27:07 am »

Quote from: nwboater on August 20, 2011, 08:40:15 am

Since some consider Canada the "Frozen North" it may be helpful! We might be able to remove one of our 8 blankets while watching a movie.

Are you concerned about heat affecting other components? Our HTPC is not a small case - it's an ATX mid tower case and I believe fairly well ventilated.

Thanks,
Rod

I'm concerned all the fans will run a little faster and end up a distraction. With my last HTPC build (RIP) I bought a $40 card that drew about 20W under load. It had offloads for decoding blu-ray and did the job quite well and put out very little heat. It was also cheap enough that if I had to replace it later I wouldn't care.

DarkPenguin · « **Reply #7 on:** August 20, 2011, 11:28:48 am »

Quote from: nwboater on August 20, 2011, 08:48:29 am

jmone & Daydream - Thanks for the info on 'throttling' the GPU.

I would rather get one video card that may be a bit of overkill but will hopefully last for awhile.

Does anyone have a feeling about the need for a super fast CPU to be able to keep up with the GPU? When I built our HTPC about a year ago the quad core AMD Athlon x4 635 2.9 GHZ was fairly powerful.

Thanks,
Rod

That is only if you intend to max out the GPU. For HTPC purposes you won't come close to doing that. Now if you play a game ....

nwboater · « **Reply #8 on:** August 20, 2011, 11:39:18 am »

Quote from: DarkPenguin on August 20, 2011, 11:27:07 am

I'm concerned all the fans will run a little faster and end up a distraction. With my last HTPC build (RIP) I bought a $40 card that drew about 20W under load. It had offloads for decoding blu-ray and did the job quite well and put out very little heat. It was also cheap enough that if I had to replace it later I wouldn't care.

A very valid concern - thanks. It seems from others experiences here that a fairly powerful card is needed to do all the latest and greatest with ROHQ. Or am I mistaken?

Quote from: DarkPenguin on August 20, 2011, 11:28:48 am

That is only if you intend to max out the GPU. For HTPC purposes you won't come close to doing that. Now if you play a game ....

And thanks for that explanation. The HTPC is dedicated and I don't do gaming on any of our computers, so looks like we are okay with the CPU.

Rod

jmone · « **Reply #9 on:** August 21, 2011, 02:46:51 am »

My Shuttle is a very small case, has very modest cooling and is in a shelf that does not help. My prime concern is fan noise rather than power saving in wanting to reduce power consumption. I also have crammed as much power into the shuttle as I think I could want, including an i7-2600K and the 550Ti. In playing with but the Nvidia Inspector's Multi Display Power Saver tool and looking at the VPU stats I'm surprised to see that I would not want any card with lower performace as I'm almost maxing the VPU out with some media (see: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1520817#post1520817) . During the testing today, I turned off the Audio and played with the various Power States and I can say that even with PO (full power), the temp was always under 60 Cent, and I could not hear any fan noise.....this will be model specific as my low profile Palit 450 made a terrible whine!

nwboater · « **Reply #10 on:** August 21, 2011, 08:02:37 am »

Quote from: jmone on August 21, 2011, 02:46:51 am

My Shuttle is a very small case, has very modest cooling and is in a shelf that does not help. My prime concern is fan noise rather than power saving in wanting to reduce power consumption. I also have crammed as much power into the shuttle as I think I could want, including an i7-2600K and the 550Ti. In playing with but the Nvidia Inspector's Multi Display Power Saver tool and looking at the VPU stats I'm surprised to see that I would not want any card with lower performace as I'm almost maxing the VPU out with some media (see: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1520817#post1520817) . During the testing today, I turned off the Audio and played with the various Power States and I can say that even with PO (full power), the temp was always under 60 Cent, and I could not hear any fan noise.....this will be model specific as my low profile Palit 450 made a terrible whine!

Thanks for the detailed info on your results.

From your link "In other words on my 550Ti P12 is fine when doing nothing, P8 for most playback, but I need P0 for 1080/50 or 60p (and probably also 1080/50 or 60i) and even then the VPU is being hammered." Are you wondering if an even more powerful card might be needed to stay on the safe side?

I'm also confused on the difference between GPU & VPU.

Thanks,
Rod

jmone · « **Reply #11 on:** August 21, 2011, 03:49:56 pm »

Hi Rod,

1) The 550Ti is currently powerful enough for all I have and the overhead that LAVCUVID and madVR adds. I don't see that there will be any "harder" media you will want to play in the while I think that LAVCUVID does what it does and is unlikely to change, madVR is under constant development but who knows what (if anything) will impact the performance. FYI - I'm fine with the 550Ti - as it plays everthing I have. Note: My 1080/50p stuff is from my Camcorder so I have a bit of this (and it will grow), but many (if not most) will have none of this. If something else needs more grunt in the future, I'll just replace the card with whatever the new generation stuff is. No point it overpaying for a card now that you don't need as the price / performance ratio keeps decreasing.

2) While it seems the term GPU and VPU is generically used interchangeably, in this case it is referring to the difference between the DirectX graphics performance (GPU - eg used by TheaterView for rendering the moving icons etc), and the Video Decoding Engine (VPU - used for decoding the video streams).

nwboater · « **Reply #12 on:** August 21, 2011, 03:59:48 pm »

Thanks jmone for the explanations.

Since I don't even have any of the 1080/50p stuff it looks like the 550 Ti will be quite ample for the foreseeable future.

I'm going to go ahead and order it today. Thanks everyone for all your input and discussion here. When I get it going I'll make a post on the results. I'm really looking forward to using RO HQ. Will be interesting to see what it does with SD content on our 55" Panasonic plasma.

Rod

jmone · « **Reply #13 on:** August 21, 2011, 04:11:27 pm »

Let us know how you go. I've a 60" Pio and HD stuff looks terrific (and the 1080/50p is stunning for a Cam), but SD stuff looks like, well SD stuff in comparison. From what I have seen the more you scale stuff up the worse it looks as at a certain point your perceived resolution is greater than your actual resolution - good read here http://www.carltonbale.com/2006/11/1080p-does-matter/

Sandy B Ridge · « **Reply #14 on:** August 22, 2011, 05:33:00 am »

Quote from: jmone on August 21, 2011, 02:46:51 am

looking at the VPU stats I'm surprised to see that I would not want any card with lower performace as I'm almost maxing the VPU out with some media (see: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1520817#post1520817)

OMG! Yes, I read your post there. I'm really surprised your 550Ti is sweating with media content! I was about to pull the trigger on an O/C GT 430 after opinion on Avsforum has shifted to saying that it is perfectly adequate for a HTPC (renethx I think who posted, quite a surprise as he was vociferous in saying that it was way too weak a few weeks ago. He is now saying that with the more recent MadVR versions the card should be fine.). Your experience seems to differ! I have a number of 1080i bluray as well as lots of 576i material that needs upscaling and I eventually want to calibrate my TV with 3dlut. (I have a calibration dongle already for my Desktop PC). I guess I'd need some grunt to put that Extra step in the pipeline too.

I may get one and see how it goes. The interlaced comb artefact is getting me annoyed and I'm hoping a H/W deinterlace method will be an improvement. A more powerful card would need a new case for me. I could always put the card on the 'bay' if it was indeed underpowered.

SBR

jmone · « **Reply #15 on:** August 22, 2011, 05:47:03 am »

I've only had two nvidia based cards, the Palit 450 Low Profile and the Gigabyte 550Ti. Both handled all my media but as you have seen the VPU gets hammered on some media. I'm not sure you would want any weaker than this. The advantage of both cards is that they are (relatively) modest power draws (only need one power cable) and neither seemed to generate allot of heat. The only reason I flicked the 450 was the Palit Low Profile made was unacceptably loud under load due to the small and fast fan. I can not hear the Gigabyte at all!

My recommendation is get either a 450 (harder to find now) or the 550Ti and if at some point you need to upgrade in the future to support "Super Dupper XYZ" you will have got good value for money in the interim.

PS - I still like my ATI cards over these nvidia sample....I just can not run LAV CUVID and for me that is a winner!

nwboater · « **Reply #16 on:** August 28, 2011, 01:39:40 pm »

Okay I got the new Asus 550 card. I installed it yesterday evening but for WAF I had to be sure our HTPC was properly running Sage recorded TV for our evening movie. So our initial observation was with Sage (Sorry for putting that in this forum!). As soon as we turned the system on we noticed a huge improvement in the menu text. Really sharp! We then watched an HD movie recorded from Cable. It was way better than with our onboard GPU. I am really surprised that we saw such a difference. Our relatively new Panasonic 50" plasma is now performing as I thought HD should.

This morning I did some testing in MC. Previously we were only able to run RO Std. Now it effortlessly runs HQ. But with our media I'm not sure I see a difference. The HD movie we watched last night in Sage looked gorgeous in both Std and HQ. I then tried a ripped DVD. As reported earlier SD is, well, SD. Not very exciting after HD! I do believe though that the text looked better in the warning at the beginning of the DVD. We don't have any BluRays yet - have been waiting for the new video card to get some. May go out this afternoon for one or two. That should be the real test. Does anyone know if I can just play a BD without ripping it? Our HTPC does have a Blue Ray drive.

The fan in this Asus card seems quiet enough. But I guess it may work harder with a BD going. Also we have some noisy fans in other equipment so I can't give a really accurate report on fan noise.

I do have an issue with the card in that the desktop did not fit on the TV screen. It does when we use it on our small LCD local monitor. On the NVidea Control Panel I have been able to adjust the 'Size' but for some reason there is no position adjustment available. Our previous onboard graphics fit both screens fine.

I guess for any further posts on optimizing RO HQ I should start a new post in the MC16 forum.

Thanks again to all here for your good support in choosing this card.

Rod

JimH · « **Reply #17 on:** August 28, 2011, 01:45:36 pm »

Quote from: nwboater on August 28, 2011, 01:39:40 pm

We don't have any BluRays yet - have been waiting for the new video card to get some. May go out this afternoon for one or two. That should be the real test. Does anyone know if I can just play a BD without ripping it? Our HTPC does have a Blue Ray drive.

You can play a Blu-ray disc or a rip. You will need AnyDVD HD.

It's fine to talk about SageTV here. They're not a competitor. Maybe Google is now.

nwboater · « **Reply #18 on:** August 28, 2011, 02:06:31 pm »

Quote from: JimH on August 28, 2011, 01:45:36 pm

You can play a Blu-ray disc or a rip. You will need AnyDVD HD.

It's fine to talk about SageTV here. They're not a competitor. Maybe Google is now.

Thanks for the prompt response Jim.

Good to know I can play a Blue Ray disc as once I get it home I'll be anxious to see it - instant gratification you know! And we do have AnyDVD HD although haven't used the HD part yet.

Rod

JimH · « **Reply #19 on:** September 14, 2011, 04:43:56 pm »

Discussion on Nvidia:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1358898

nwboater · « **Reply #20 on:** September 15, 2011, 07:47:30 am »

Jim - Thanks for the link. Interesting thread.

I neglected to mention here that I did get a BluRay. Ripped it using MC/AnyDVD. Had a little tagging difficulty but that was worked out on another thread. Using RO HQ it played beautifully with no difficulties. I haven't checked CPU usage, but did not notice the fan on the GPU pick up speed.

I had held off getting into BluRays for a long time because I didn't want all the Codec and other hassle. But with ROHQ it 'just works'. Thanks again for everyone's efferts in that area.

Rod

jmone · « **Reply #21 on:** September 15, 2011, 04:31:00 pm »

Good to hear, and even better that "It just works". I'd leave it all well alone and enjoy the content ( don't tell Sandy B Ridge however

)

Sandy B Ridge · « **Reply #22 on:** September 15, 2011, 04:43:16 pm »

Quote from: jmone on September 15, 2011, 04:31:00 pm

Good to hear, and even better that "It just works". I'd leave it all well alone and enjoy the content ( don't tell Sandy B Ridge however )

Ha! Everything just works for me too (bluray is fine, I guess not very taxing on the gpu as not so much scaling to do and 'only' 24fps to decode) just else not very well at the moment! Working on it!

SBR

jmone · « **Reply #23 on:** September 15, 2011, 07:22:52 pm »

Who told SBR!

The sample you are having issue with all came from Blu media.

Sandy B Ridge · « **Reply #24 on:** September 16, 2011, 01:53:54 am »

Quote from: jmone on September 15, 2011, 07:22:52 pm

Who told SBR! The sample you are having issue with all came from Blu media.

Doh! Homer moment!

It was late!

SBR

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Author Topic: Does This New Video Card Seem Appropriate? (Read 4461 times)