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[packux]

I am posting this in order to save a bit of my sanity and get some feedback from people that are into the subject for a longer period than me.

Last week I downloaded the demo of MC17, with the intention to evaluate it and potentially buy it as a one-stop shop for managing both audio and video playback.

The platform I am using is the following:

Windows 7 SP1 64 Bit Ultimate
Nvidia GTX 570 with latest drivers downloaded and installed from nvidia.com
Soundblaster X-Fi (connected via TOSLINK to Emotiva UMC-1).

Video output:

DVI 1: To Samsung computer monitor (1920 * 1200 32bit/59Hz)

HDMI: (As a secondary display) To AVR Emotica UMC-1 which outputs to a Panasonic Viera TC-42LD24 (1920 * 1080 * 24bit * 60Hz)

Before installing MC17, I was using
Foobar2000 for music reproduction (using WASAPI)
MPC-HT for video reproduction using LAV Video/Audio/Source Splitter v0.40, madVR 0.79 for rendering and ReClock for audio reproduction.

Here are the steps I followed:

1 .Installed MC17
2. Switched to Red October HQ
3. Changed audio renderer to ReClock (would love not to, but it seems that Audio rendering in JRiver is not done via WASAPI if audio device used for video playback is different than the one used for music reproduction)

This did not work as expected, as LAV Audio decoder was sending 32bit sound to Nvidia HiDefinition Audio output - and sadly, it does not support it.

4. Changed to Red October HQ with additional filters and manually configured LAV Audio decoder to send up to 24 bit

Success, playback was doing OK.

After that point, I played a bit with up sampling and cropping using madVR, having a variety of results.

And here starts the actual problem. At some point, while I was playing back a video in the TV (connected via HDMI to UMC-1), I switched desktop resolution from the context menu provided in MC17 to use 1920*1080*32*60. Playback froze. TV started flickering.

From that point onwards, whenever I tried to use the TV as a secondary display (i.e. power up the AVR with the TV switched on), TV (and PC monitor) continuously flicker without producing any output to the screen.


At some point, the video card stopped even producing any output to its HDMI. Please also note that I conducted all tests using both the miniHDMI to HDMI as well as a DVI to HDMI output from the Nvidia GTX 570.

I tried the following:

1. Switch to Red October HQ (without filters)
No Success, HDMI (and secondary DVI)  out

2. Switch to Red October standard
No Success, HDMI (and secondary DVI)  out

3. Clean uninstall MC17 and reinstall (without CCleaner and with CCleaner)
No Success, HDMI (and secondary DVI)  out

4. Uninstall Nvidia driver (using safe mode and Drive sweeper for a definite clean install) and reinstall (both current version of driver and beta)
No Success, HDMI (and secondary DVI)  out

5. Complete uninstall of MC17
No Success, HDMI (and secondary DVI)  out


6. Uninstall my own version of madVR
Some Success, secondary DVI is now producing signal but still continuous flickering.

7. Manually change refresh rate of secondary DVI (UMC-1 + TV) to 50Hz from 60Hz
Success, I can now reproduce video in the TV, using EVR as renderer

8. Reinstall madVR, try to playback 1080p Video using MPC
Success, Video is played back as expected

9. Try to playback 720p video
Failure, output to secondary DVI is against lost

10. Connect via DVI to HDMI Nvidia GTX to AVR
Partial success. Still I get flickers while using 1080p60 but 1080p50 seems to be working OK.


To my perspective, this does not seem to be a hardware issue but rather a software issue. I am about to clean install OS but before doing so, does anybody here have any ideas/proposals/positive thoughts that could save me the trouble of clean installation?

Many many thanks

[CountryBumkin]

Why, in step 8, are you installing MadVR - was this just for testing? JRiver program installs everything it needs (LAV splitter/filter, MadVR, etc.) you may be installing software of a different version. Also, in the Tools>Options>Video settings do you have use "harware accelerate video decoding when possible" turned on? MC has it sown ReClock called VideoClock. I think (don't know) that making changes in programs not installed by MC, such as a second istall of LAV and/or ReClock may be causing conflict in your setup. My suggestion is to not install ReClock. Lastly, did you try making changes to audio (bit depth, etc.) in Tools>Options>DSP & Output format ...""?
Good luck

[packux]

To begin with, thanks for reading the long post and answering

Some answers

Why, in step 8, are you installing MadVR - was this just for testing?

Yeap

Also, in the Tools>Options>Video settings do you have use "harware accelerate video decoding when possible" turned on?

Yeap, and I also manually enabled (and disabled) CUVID in LAV Video decoder while changing the various configuration settings.

MC has it sown ReClock called VideoClock.

Honestly, If I could use WASAPI to send to my Audio interface, I wouldn't use ReClock at all and would have sticked to MC facilities. From what I've understood though, WASAPI and bit-perfect reproduction can only occur If I use the same output for Video as I use for Audio - which is not the case. That's the main (and only) reason I use ReClock.

I think (don't know) that making changes in programs not installed by MC, such as a second istall of LAV and/or ReClock may be causing conflict in your setup.

That's what I've gathered myself up to now. I actually tend to think that madVR is indeed writting sth in the Windows Registry (i've found some entries, didn't make much from them though). The problem is, I uninstalled everything (MC, madVR) and still cannot send 1080p60 to the TV, so at this point I cannot really understand where/what I need to look into.

My suggestion is to not install ReClock.

Up to now, I haven't tried uninstalling ReClock, as the problem I am facing seems to be on the Video rendering part. Still, I'll try just that for the sake of completeness.

Lastly, did you try making changes to audio (bit depth, etc.) in Tools>Options>DSP & Output format ...""?

Nope, none whatsoever.

Good luck

Thanks, It seems I'll need a bit this :-)

[Matt]

First, welcome to Interact.

I would start by getting audio playback working.  It's required for video playback, so is a logical place to start.  ASIO is best for an X-Fi.

Once music works, move on to video.  Use Red October Standard.  Make sure Options > Video > Advanced is still set to 'Same as audio output' (or similar) (note that this step will be unnecessary in a coming build of Media Center 17).

[packux]

First, welcome to Interact.

Thanks :-)

I would start by getting audio playback working.  It's required for video playback, so is a logical place to start. 

I did set-up the sound, using ASIO and all. The thing is, I don't wan't to use device I am using for Audio reproduction when I am reproducing video.

My problem is not there but rather, the fact that after changing resolution during Video playback seems to have done sth with the refresh rate I can use when using my secondary output (i.e. TV).

I did use Red October basic after this problem showed up, but still TV was entering an endless loop (i.e. flickering while Windows tried to start up the display).


I still believe that something is stuck in the registry somewhere...Just need to figure out where

[Matt]

I did set-up the sound, using ASIO and all. The thing is, I don't wan't to use device I am using for Audio reproduction when I am reproducing video.

Then you should add a second zone in Media Center, and configure the audio for it to use the audio output you want for video.  Even in that zone, I'd recommend getting audio working first.

[packux]

Partial success.

After getting some ideas for here and there, yesterday I restarted my efforts to make my HTPC working again.

Here are the steps I followed:

1. Installed Ubuntu Linux in a USB flashdisk.

I did this so as to verify that the reason my second DVI did not work was not a hardware issue but a software configuration. Indeed, as soon as Ubuntu started up, I immediately saw my GTX 570 providing output from both DVIs.

2. Boot-up Windows, clean all installed plugins (LAV, madVR, ReClock) and Nvidia driver. Use CCleaner and Driver Sweeper to clean-up (as much as possible the system).

Everything went smooth during this step - I did not expect any surpises here though. All actions were performed using safe mode and multiple reboots were required in order to clean-up the Nvidia drivers for the graphics card and the HD Audio

3. Allowed Windows to perform their magic (i.e. automatically scan and install drivers etc).

Even after this step, the system was properly sending output signals to both DVIs - so at this point we can already consider some level of success.

4. Installed Nvidia drivers (latest 285.xx)

Nothing really changed after this step. Everything seems to work as expected.

System happilly reports 2 screens, my main monitor and the AVR output.

Main conclusions drawn up to this point: It seems Windows (or the card driver) are eager to disable an output port after multiple failures to start-up a display connected to it (probably to safeguard the port?)

AVR output is recognised as UPnP display, showing 60Hz refresh rate and 32bit color.

5. Switch on the TV connected to the AVR and set pass-through mode.

Failure, TV starts flickering again :-(

6. Set auto mode in AVR (which automatically decided to send 50hz instead of 60Hz to TV).

Success, albeit AVR sends now to TV 50Hz.

7. Install JRiver, set-up Zones (per the suggestion of Mat), test playback

Success, everything works as expected now (including WASAPI without ReClock).

8. Set Red October to HQ, check playback.

Success, madVR is happilly rendering videos in my TV.

I did check madVR configuration also and to my surpripse it seems like it had retained all previous configuration values  in regards to devices connected (i.e. device labels - the ones I had written and not the ones provided by EDID, device types -I had for example to tell madVR that my AVR is indeed an AVR with a TV connected, etc.)

So, as it seems, madVR indeed writes somewhere somehow some parts of its configuration. Questions is: Where? (I think I should ask the guys @doom9 though this questions).

9. Shutdown TV and AVR

The expected result would be that Windows see the fact that there is no ouput any more from the second DVI and should disable multi-screen set-up. This failed though, having the following results:

1. Windows kept the display enabled.
2. As soon as AVR and TV were switched off, PC monitor flickers once or twice and Windows set resolution to that monitor to 1920  * 1080 (instead of 1920 * 1200 which is the correct resolution).


At this point, I feel there are not many things more to do. It is indeed evident that I am facing a somewhat weird issue with the OS and I will probably have to make a clean install.

I'll keep this thread updated in case I find any way to salvage to OS or get to the center of it all - it might prove usefull for other people in the future.

[CountryBumkin]

Glad its working but I'm concerned that step 2 might bring you trouble. There are other posts here about people having LAV installed outside of MC and there being conflicts due to version differences. MC installs LAV and MadVR on its own. When you update-to the latest/current MC version, it includes the most recent versions/updates to LAV and MadVR, so you will proabably have a mismatch at some point unless you keep up with the versions you installed outside of MC. One of the things I like about MC is that I don't have to watch for upgrades or fixes regarding LAV/MadVR, etc., as MC does this for me.
Good luck and glad its working now.

[packux]

Having reached a stable state with my Video setup, I thought to follow up this post, in case other people have similar problems.

My final setup is the following:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source (HTPC using JRiver v62 now) connected via

- DVI to a PC monitor (primary display) with 1920*1200*32*60
- HDMI to AVR (Emotiva UMC-1) - AVR HDMI to TV. (secondary display)

JRiver set-up:
- Red October HQ
- bit-streaming enabled for all available sound formats
- VideoClock enabled
- Hardware accelerated video decoding enabled
- Automatic display setting change enabled with all options left to Desktop default

madVR resolution set-up (for my TV): 1080p23, 1080p24, 1080p50, 1080p59, 1080p60

AVR 1 setup as passthrough.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The initial problem I had with my graphics card was solved by uninstalling drivers (using CCleaner and DriverSweeper) and doing a clean new installation.

Shortly after that, I noticed that when the player was automatically changing resolution to 1080p24 in my TV, a  lot of frames were being dropped (20 or more frames per minute as reported by madVR).

Solution: Disable Aero in Windows.

The issue has now been fixed. The new, minor issue I am facing is that every 2-3-4 minutes I will see a small distortion on the top part of the content being played back in the TV. By saying small, I mean that someone has to look for it to see it.

I suspect that either
- madVR is doing sth fishy
- the TV Trumotion (which is set to max) is at fault or
- the AVR is not working as expected with the passthrough.

I will keep this thread updated on further developments.

[JimH]

Thanks for posting the solution.

[glynor]

The initial problem I had with my graphics card was solved by uninstalling drivers (using CCleaner and DriverSweeper) and doing a clean new installation.

This is why Nvidia cards drive me nuts sometimes.

I can't remember the last time I had to do this with any of my AMD cards.  Worst case to fix a weird issue, I have to uninstall (normally, through the Windows control panel), reboot, reinstall.  Usually, I just install new versions "over top" of my old ones.  I don't think I've had a problem with my 6870 since I bought it right when they came out way back when.

I have to fight the driver battle with my Nvidia cards seemingly all the time.  Why can't they build a proper installer and uninstaller?  It doesn't seem like rocket surgery...  

[Hendrik]

Ever since NVIDIA added the "clean install" button in their installer, i never had to do anything else then use that.
Some people are just destined to find every glitch there is.

[Sandy B Ridge]

One minute it's disable Aero, the next it's enable Aero, now it's disable Aero again!

I can't keep up!

SBR