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Author Topic: Volum Problem with MC 17.0.99  (Read 5967 times)

GammaG

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Volum Problem with MC 17.0.99
« on: March 07, 2012, 12:23:23 am »

Hello Everyone!

Glad to see that they have a forum for the JRiver MC!!!

Anyhow, here is my problem:

I downloaded the MC 30 day trial version about 45 days ago and the version that I downloaded was 17.0.68 if I recall correctly. I also had another extension of 10 days, which I took.

I then purchased it maybe a week ago and registered it.

Everything seemed to be working fine until yesterday.

When I booted up my pc and clicked on the icon to open up MC, I got a pop-up window that said extracting. After it extracted whatever, another window pops up and started loading files, something similar to when you first install it.

After it finished, it said to reboot. After re-booting, I then clicked on the JR icon and it started with everything appearing to be ok.

Here is the problem- The volume control is not putting out the same decibel level as before! It is much less now in volume. Also, I noticed that when I put my cursor on the volume adjuster and begin to increase the volume, the cursor flickers and is slow to allow me to raise the volume up.

I did try uninstalling MC, then installing it again and it was fine up until I turned the pc off and the following day turned the pc on and the same thing happens as described above. I also noticed that the version was updated from the original 17.00.68 to 17.0.99.

I was told that it automatically updates and that could be causing this issue.

Any solutions to fixing this problem would be appreciated!

Thanks,

John G.



 
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glynor

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #1 on: March 07, 2012, 12:40:45 am »

Hey there!  Welcome to the forum.

When I booted up my pc and clicked on the icon to open up MC, I got a pop-up window that said extracting. After it extracted whatever, another window pops up and started loading files, something similar to when you first install it.

After it finished, it said to reboot. After re-booting, I then clicked on the JR icon and it started with everything appearing to be ok.

This part is the automatic updater in MC.  When it sees a new build is available, instead of bugging you about it like lots of applications, it just downloads the update.  The next time you launch MC, it auto-installs it (just like how Chrome and Firefox work now).  You can turn it off if you want to, but you should probably keep it turned on.  It is best to have the latest MC in most cases.  They release new builds most weeks, and always work in all sorts of awesome changes.  If you don't want to upgrade it that often, you can set the Auto-Updater to Stable mode (that actually might be the default) and then they don't push them as often.  The setting for this is under Tools > Options > Startup > Update Channels.

It shouldn't usually need to reboot the system when this happens, but it does occasionally crop up if certain components it needs to update are in-use when it runs (this seems to happen most often if you have the Shell Extensions enabled, but it isn't limited to that).

As far as your volume problems...

I know that there were some changes fairly recently with how MC handles Volume output, which might explain the change in initial volume.  If it drives you nuts, you can alter it easily in the DSP.  There also might have been something reset in the DSP settings between build 68 and build 99.  So check your DSP settings.  They messed around with a bunch of that and made it better, but your old settings might not have come out the same way on the other side.

As for the slow performance when actually changing the volume, I don't know what could be causing that.  We'll need to get that figured out, but you'll need a comment from someone else.

Answer a few questions about your setup though:

1. What is Options > Audio > Output Mode set to?
2. What audio hardware are you using?
3. What do you have set in the DSP under Output Format?
4. Do you have any other crazy DSP options enabled (Convolution, Effects, EQ, Room Correction, etc)?
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GammaG

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #2 on: March 07, 2012, 01:30:06 am »

Hello Glynor!

Thanks for your reply!

To answer a few of your questions:

1. What is Options > Audio > Output Mode set to?

A: Set to ASIO

2. What audio hardware are you using?

A: Running through an M-Audio sound card using a RCA splitter from audio output
to input on my preamp, then through tube amps to main stereo speakers.


3. What do you have set in the DSP under Output Format?

A: No change under Sample rate output/Bitdepth is set at Source bitdepth/Channels set at 2 channels (stereo)/ Mixing is set to JRSS v 2.0 surround sound/ nothing set for
Subwoofer.


4. Do you have any other crazy DSP options enabled (Convolution, Effects, EQ, Room Correction, etc)?

A: Yes- I am presently using the Output Format/Volume Leveling/Equalizer/and the Effects.

I am also noticing when I type here or scroll, the MC is being interupted. Not sure why that is.

Thanks again!

John G.
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GammaG

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2012, 02:15:06 am »

Hello again glynor!

I was wondering if you could comment on my last post.

I answered the questions that you had asked me.

I guess you are ok!

Thanks again!!!

John
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JimH

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2012, 06:29:01 am »

Try turning off all DSP.

Try setting the buffer lower in MC's Audio options for ASIO.
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GammaG

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #5 on: April 02, 2012, 07:12:08 am »

Hello JimH,

I am currently using v17.0.68, and have a check mark by the Disable Automatic Update. Whenever I update to the latest version, which the last time I tried updating was v17.0.99, and did not matter if the DSP was on or off. The volume was much lower in db output then with the v17.0.68.

I will uncheck the check mark by Disable Automatic Update, then I will click Check for Updates... and let it update to whatever version is latest.

After updating, I will try the 2- things you have mentioned, and reply back with results.

Thank You for helping me with this issue!

John G.

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Alex B

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2012, 07:17:51 am »

I am also noticing when I type here or scroll, the MC is being interupted. Not sure why that is.

That should not happen on a healthy PC.

Could you install the latest build of MC (117 at the moment), and post your system info from MC's Help menu (Help > System Info...) ? The recent MC builds produce a redesigned, quite a bit more comprehensive, report and it may reveal something.

Code: [Select]
Paste the system info report into your reply. You can enclose the system info text in code tags to make it more compact, like I did here.
Help for using the board codes and other posting features: http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?action=help;page=post
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GammaG

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #7 on: April 02, 2012, 07:27:23 am »

Hello Alex B,

Would you like me to uninstall the v17.0.68 that I am currently using, then download v17.0.117 and install?

Or do I just update the version I have now?

Thanks for helping!

John G.
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Alex B

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #8 on: April 02, 2012, 07:31:44 am »

You don't need to uninstall (...at least not yet. Sometimes when nothing else seems to help that can be tried.)

Just download the build 17.0.117 and run the installer (i.e. install it on top of the currently installed build.)
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GammaG

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #9 on: April 02, 2012, 07:52:12 am »

Alex,

I sent you a PM on my system info.

I also installed the latest v 17.0.117- Still same volume issue! I am not sure what was done different from v17.0.68, but the volume is noticeable in decrease of db.

John G.
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GammaG

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #10 on: April 02, 2012, 07:56:56 am »

P.S.

This volume decrease in db at same level setting on the volume control in J river MC is set on the Internal Volume with a check next to it.

John G.
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Alex B

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #11 on: April 02, 2012, 08:06:18 am »

I sent you a PM on my system info.

Here's your system info:

Code: [Select]
Media Center
    Install Path: C:\Program Files\J River\Media Center 17\
    Interface Plugins: TiVo Server (not running)
    JRMark: never run
    Library: 546 files, 244 KB in library, 24.0 MB in thumbnails
    Resources: 25.9 MB memory, 411 handles
    Version: 17.0.117.0 Registered
Computer
    ACPI Uniprocessor PC (driver 5.1.2600.0)
Disk drives
    ST3160812A (driver 5.1.2535.0)
Display adapters
    NVIDIA GeForce 6100 (driver 6.14.12.9573)
DVD/CD-ROM drives
    ASUS DRW-24B1ST   a (driver 5.1.2535.0)
    SONY CD-RW  CRX210E1 (driver 5.1.2535.0)
Floppy disk controllers
    Standard floppy disk controller (driver 5.1.2600.0)
Floppy disk drives
    Floppy disk drive (driver 5.1.2600.0)
Human Interface Devices
    HID-compliant consumer control device (driver 5.1.2600.5512)
    HID-compliant consumer control device (driver 5.1.2600.5512)
    HID-compliant consumer control device (driver 5.1.2600.5512)
    HID-compliant device (driver 5.1.2600.5512)
    HID-compliant device (driver 5.1.2600.5512)
    HID-compliant device (driver 5.1.2600.5512)
    HID-compliant device (driver 5.1.2600.5512)
    USB Human Interface Device (driver 5.1.2600.5512)
    USB Human Interface Device (driver 5.1.2600.5512)
    USB Human Interface Device (driver 5.1.2600.5512)
    USB Human Interface Device (driver 5.1.2600.5512)
    USB Human Interface Device (driver 5.1.2600.5512)
IDE ATA/ATAPI controllers
    NVIDIA nForce 430/410 Serial ATA Controller (driver 5.10.2600.666)
    Primary IDE Channel (driver 5.1.2600.1106)
    Secondary IDE Channel (driver 5.1.2600.1106)
    Standard Dual Channel PCI IDE Controller (driver 5.1.2600.1106)
Keyboards
    HID Keyboard Device (driver 5.1.2600.5512)
Memory
    Free Physical Memory: 1.4 GB
    Total Memory: 1.9 GB
Mice and other pointing devices
    HID-compliant mouse (driver 5.1.2600.0)
Monitors
    Plug and Play Monitor (driver 5.1.2001.0)
Network adapters
    NVIDIA nForce Networking Controller (driver 50.2.3.0)
    TP-LINK 150Mbps Wireless Lite N Adapter (driver 7.7.0.75)
NVIDIA Network Bus Enumerator
    NVIDIA Network Bus Enumerator (driver 50.2.3.0)
Operating System
    Microsoft Windows XP 32-bit
Ports (COM & LPT)
    Communications Port (COM1) (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Printer Port (LPT1) (driver 5.1.2600.0)
Processors
    AMD Athlon(tm) 64 Processor 3200+ (driver 1.0.0.0)
Sound, video and game controllers
    Audio Codecs (driver 5.1.2535.0)
    Legacy Audio Drivers (driver 5.1.2535.0)
    Legacy Video Capture Devices (driver 5.1.2535.0)
    M-Audio Delta 410 (driver 5.10.0.5051)
    Media Control Devices (driver 5.1.2535.0)
    Microsoft Kernel System Audio Device (driver 5.1.2535.0)
    Microsoft WINMM WDM Audio Compatibility Driver (driver 5.1.2535.0)
    Realtek AC'97 Audio (driver 5.10.0.6180)
    USB Audio Device (driver 5.1.2535.0)
    Video Codecs (driver 5.1.2535.0)
System devices
    ACPI Fan (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    ACPI Fixed Feature Button (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    ACPI Power Button (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    ACPI Sleep Button (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    ACPI Thermal Zone (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Direct memory access controller (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    ISAPNP Read Data Port (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Logical Disk Manager (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Microcode Update Device (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Microsoft ACPI-Compliant System (driver 5.1.2535.0)
    Microsoft System Management BIOS Driver (driver 5.1.2600.2180)
    Motherboard resources (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Motherboard resources (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Motherboard resources (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Numeric data processor (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    NVIDIA nForce PCI System Management (driver 4.5.2.0)
    PCI bus (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard host CPU bridge (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard host CPU bridge (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard host CPU bridge (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard host CPU bridge (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard ISA bridge (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard PCI-to-PCI bridge (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard PCI-to-PCI bridge (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard PCI-to-PCI bridge (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard RAM Controller (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard RAM Controller (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard RAM Controller (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard RAM Controller (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard RAM Controller (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard RAM Controller (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard RAM Controller (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard RAM Controller (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard RAM Controller (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    PCI standard RAM Controller (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Plug and Play Software Device Enumerator (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Printer Port Logical Interface (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Programmable interrupt controller (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    System board (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    System CMOS/real time clock (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    System speaker (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    System timer (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Terminal Server Device Redirector (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Terminal Server Keyboard Driver (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Terminal Server Mouse Driver (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Volume Manager (driver 5.1.2600.0)
Universal Serial Bus controllers
    Standard Enhanced PCI to USB Host Controller (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    Standard OpenHCD USB Host Controller (driver 5.1.2600.1106)
    USB Composite Device (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    USB Composite Device (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    USB Composite Device (driver 5.1.2600.0)
    USB Root Hub (driver 5.1.2600.1106)
    USB Root Hub (driver 5.1.2600.1106)

You can press the quote button on my reply to see how I enclosed it in the code tags.
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GammaG

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #12 on: April 02, 2012, 08:38:24 am »

You can press the quote button on my reply to see how I enclosed it in the code tags.

OK- I understand.

Does my OS seem to be ok?
 
Still have the volume issue as before. Has any of the other techs that work for JR experienced this volume issue?

It is very noticeable from v17.0.68 to any updates after this version. I am not sure why, but would like to know.

Thanks,

John G.
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GammaG

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #13 on: April 02, 2012, 08:47:30 am »

Try turning off all DSP. Volume still the same, no difference

Try setting the buffer lower in MC's Audio options for ASIO. I set the buffer to 4 seconds-no difference-then to 2 seconds-still no difference

Tried everything you have mentioned here and still no difference in volume output.

John G.
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Alex B

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #14 on: April 02, 2012, 11:03:39 am »

Has any of the other techs that work for JR experienced this volume issue?

I had to do some real work for a while. After all this is just my hobby.  :)

Are you using the "Internal Volume" mode? (top menu > Player > Volume...)

Some of the recent changes can affect how loud an intermediate volume slider position is perceived when the Internal Volume mode is enabled. However, the maximum available volume level should not be affected. In other words, is your system now not loud enough when you adjust the volume slider to a louder position or are you just unhappy with the tweaked scale?

Matt from JRiver might be able to say which of the recent changes is/are likely to cause the difference, but here is a list of the announced "volume" related changes in the recent MC builds:

Quote
17.0.95 (2/24/2012)
6. Fixed: Toggling the new DSP option 'Process independently of internal volume' could cause a burst of sound if the internal volume was low.

17.0.94 (2/23/2012)
5. Fixed: Volume Protection could engage and turn the volume down on subsequent videos when playing videos back to back.
7. NEW: Each DSP effect can be set to be processed independently of internal volume (Options button at top right of DSP).
10. Changed: DSP Studio keeps 'Output Format' first and 'Volume Leveling' second. A message explaining this is shown if a user attempts to put other effects before these effects.

17.0.89 (2/15/2012)
5. Faster: Internal Volume uses SSE when it's available for around 20% - 30% faster volume processing.

17.0.88 (2/14/2012)
6. Fixed: Internal Volume was not working when no effects were enabled in DSP Studio.

17.0.87 (2/10/2012)
1. Changed: Tuned the Internal Volume slider scaling (more details here: http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=69939.0).
11. Changed: Volume mode, internal volume level, and Volume Protection are saved as they are changed instead of on shutdown so settings aren't lost if there's a crash.

17.0.85 (2/8/2012)
5. Fixed: Internal Volume was not being honored when doing level calibration with Room Correction.

17.0.84 (2/7/2012)
3. Fixed: The level of data in visualizations would be incorrectly reduced by Internal Volume.

17.0.83 (2/6/2012)
4. Changed: Internal volume is applied before DSP instead of last, so that limiting and clip protection are never applied unless actually required by the hardware.
5. Changed: Tuned the logarithmic scale used by internal volume (so 50% is -13.8dB instead of -10.2dB).


The performance issues are probably separate. Your XP machine is not exactly very recent and it has a PATA hard drive. The symptoms you described could indicate a PATA hard drive that has dropped to the so called PIO mode. A Google search like this might help: http://www.google.com/search?&q=hard+drive+PIO+mode
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Matt

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #15 on: April 02, 2012, 11:06:14 am »

Thanks Alex.

This thread discusses the changes to the Internal Volume scale:
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=69939.msg471528#msg471528
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GammaG

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #16 on: April 02, 2012, 12:51:31 pm »

I had to do some real work for a while. After all this is just my hobby.  :)

Are you using the "Internal Volume" mode? (top menu > Player > Volume...)Yes- I am using this mode..

Some of the recent changes can affect how loud an intermediate volume slider position is perceived when the Internal Volume mode is enabled. However, the maximum available volume level should not be affected. In other words, is your system now not loud enough when you adjust the volume slider to a louder position or are you just unhappy with the tweaked scale? To give you an example of what has been noticed is when I am using the v17.0.68, and lets say the volume slider is set to 50%, just guestimating, I would say that the volume would be down around 3 or more db downwards when using another updated version.

Matt from JRiver might be able to say which of the recent changes is/are likely to cause the difference, but here is a list of the announced "volume" related changes in the recent MC builds: All I am saying is that there is a noticeable difference, and perhaps they have arranged this newer volume to produce the volume this way. I am not sure if it is better, but for my personal taste, I like the old volume better then the latest changes that have been made. Perhaps someone could comment on this as to why the changes.[/


The performance issues are probably separate. Your XP machine is not exactly very recent and it has a PATA hard drive. The symptoms you described could indicate a PATA hard drive that has dropped to the so called PIO mode. A Google search like this might help: http://www.google.com/search?&q=hard+drive+PIO+mode
Perhaps you can suggest what I can do as to improve my pc...

John G.

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Alex B

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #17 on: April 02, 2012, 02:02:49 pm »

Actually, according to the link Matt posted, if you previously used the old 50% position, the new 72% position should produce the same volume level. The 100% position is the same as before. The intention is to provide a more usable scale. The new scale provides 0.5 dB steps at the positions from 20% to 100%. The old scale scale provided unnecessarily fine steps at loud volume levels and thus its capability to finely adjust the quiet volume levels was quite limited.

A 3 dB difference would be very small and difficult to hear, except in a direct A/B comparison. However, you are correct, the difference is clearly audible. As you can see in the linked thread, the difference at the 50% slider position is 11 dB.

Personally I have never paid much attention to the slider position. It is just a graphical user interface element that adjusts certain parameters in the program code. The only thing that matters to me is that I can adjust the volume level to my liking.


Regarding the performance issues, did you check the hard drive's mode? I am just guessing that it could have dropped to the PIO mode, but if it has, that certainly can cause various issues. The Google search finds lots of sites and discussions that explain the problem. Here is one of the search results: http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/check-your-transfer-mode-to-boost-computer-speed/. I recommend to just check the current mode and report it here. Don't try to fix anything yet.
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GammaG

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Re: Volum Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #18 on: April 02, 2012, 06:46:27 pm »

Thanks Alex!

I really appreciate your concern for this matter!

I guess I will leave the latest update and get use to the new volume controller.

When I get a chance, I will read the link you posted about PIO mode and see if I can post back here when I find out if I have that issue.

Sincerely,

John G.
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GammaG

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Re: Problem with MC 17.0.99
« Reply #19 on: April 03, 2012, 08:11:15 am »

Regarding the performance issues, did you check the hard drive's mode? I am just guessing that it could have dropped to the PIO mode, but if it has, that certainly can cause various issues. The Google search finds lots of sites and discussions that explain the problem. Here is one of the search results: http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/check-your-transfer-mode-to-boost-computer-speed/. I recommend to just check the current mode and report it here. Don't try to fix anything yet. Alex, I read the link here for checking the DMA/PIO modes and the Primary IDE channel-Device 0-Transfer Mode: is set on DMA if available and the Current Transfer Mode: set to Ultra DMA Mode 5

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