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[Juniorjbl]

I am wanting to try building my own pre/pro for the theater and using MC as the control center as well.

I am thinking of using a Universal Audio Apollo for the audio interface. It has 10 analog out's and is 192/24.

Has anyone done this here or have any advice for a nube?

[mojave]

I do this using a Steinberg UR824. It works great. However, I only use the HTPC as my source. If you have other sources it won't work as well or possibly at all.

The Apollo has 10 outputs, but 2 of them are for monitoring so you will actually only be able to use the 8 line outputs. Is there a reason you picked the Apollo? The Steinberg has almost the same specs and sounds great. I paid about $550 for it with some holiday specials. It doesn't do 192, but downsampling with JRiver doesn't cause me any audio difference for the few 192k audio files that I have.

Do you need balanced connections? If not, you could also check out the the recently reviewed exaSound e18. For a small footprint, ease of use, and audiophile quality,  I would recommend combining the exaSound with an Asrock Vision HT.

Will you only be using the HTPC as the source? If not, what other sources do you plan to use?

Will you be using other software with audio besides JRiver (games, internet browser, etc.)? If so, you will want to use the loopback feature of JRiver to route all audio through it.

You will want to use internal volume control in JRiver and turn on volume protection. You might also need to use the maximum volume and reference volume level settings within the audio options.

[Juniorjbl]

Hi mojave!

No other source, Network and BD rom drive, I might game on it as well (not that I would have time but the kids would!)  

I know 96 is fine but I just would like to get as preped for future resoluition audio. I am replacing a Rotel RSP 1570/OPPO BDP83SE with this machine, and my amps are balanced inputs as well. I am really tired of needing a new $2500 pre/pro every time someone sneezes, better to replace a video card IMO.

I did think that the monitor outs on the Apollo could be used as whatever I mapped them for, but if this is the case, then the Apollo my not be a good choice. I have 4 surrounds and 2 backs so I need the 10 outs.

I was really interested in using MC's DSP abilities so the other reason for 10 channels. This is a dedicated theater in a room with no windows in a cool basement and it gets used often.

Other software will be minimum mostly MC

Thanks for your input on my little project here.

[natehansen66]

I've had one of these: http://www.echoaudio.com/Products/FireWire/AudioFire12/index.php for a couple months now and I love it. 12 channels, and they say it can do 192k but the options in the menu only go up to 92k. Might want to confirm with Echo. I paid less than $600 with a 3 year warranty.

I use it for my active speakers, and I use my PC basically as an HTPC for music, DVD, streaming, etc. I'll never buy another receiver again!

[Juniorjbl]

Thanks natehansen66!!

That is a cool unit. Very much just a plain old 12X12 console!!! That is really what I was looking for. I have returned the Apollo, so I will investigate how to have one show up at my place for some tests. 

[beginner44]

Hi there,

so we are at least 3 using an Audiofire 12 !

I've just received mine today. I've play around with it, got some sound, so I'm happy 

My project is to use J River with AF 12 and 5 power amps to bi-amplify 3 theater speakers, 4 surrounds and 2 DIY subs.

I tried to configure DSP to have the following setup ; although I changed the channel to 12, I don't understand how to wire logical channels inputs to physical outpout.

Here is the objective :

for LCR, filter above 1kHz to send to outpout 1 2 3
for LCR, filter between 60Hz and above 1kHz to send to outpout 4 5 6
for surround, duplicate signal to rear (I know how to do this one)
for SL SR, send to output 7 8
for Rear L Rear R send to output 9 10
for LCR below 60Hz, send to output 11  12
for LFE, send to output 11  12

the point is that using the parametric equalizer > mix channels, I cannot choose as destination anything else than the logical input channels (Left, Right, Rear Left...). I would need soundcard output channel numbers

Thank you very much for your help !

[hulkss]

I'm using a 16 channel Lynx Aurora with the LT-USB interface to my HTPC.
http://www.lynxstudio.com/nav/getFile.asp?i=65&t=productfile

16 channels of power from http://classdaudio.com/

LCR are 3 way active (9 channels)
Side surrounds (2 Channels)
Rear Surrounds (2 Channels)
Subwoofers (3 Channels)

Having separate control of three subs works really well.

[beginner44]

Hello Hulkss,

thanks for your message.

Could you show us some screenshots of your DSP's configuration ?

That would be most helpfull.

I thank you very much in advance,

[hulkss]

My DSP settings are simple. I just set the output format to 16 channels. I do not use any JRiver room correction except through use of the convolver. I use Audiolense software to generate filters that perform digital crossover, bass management, and adjust delay, magnitude, phase and frequency response for each channel.

http://www.juicehifi.com/index.html

[beginner44]

Hi Hulkss,


thanks for your answer.

I'll look into this, though I find it a bit expensive (I tought I could achieve this with JRiver alone).

[hulkss]

You can do a lot with the Parametric EQ and Room Correction in JRiver including: bass management, crossover, and EQ. Audiolense takes this to a more advanced level with measurement and filter generation.

[beginner44]

Hulkss,

that's a good news.

Now I've got to figure out out to do it, espacially the point I mentioned before (how to route 8 logical channels to 12 physical outpout).

Have a nice day,

[natehansen66]

the point is that using the parametric equalizer > mix channels, I cannot choose as destination anything else than the logical input channels (Left, Right, Rear Left...). I would need soundcard output channel numbers

Thank you very much for your help !

This is how I do it for my active speakers. If I understand you correctly you're not sure what channels in MC corresponds to the outputs on the AF? FWIW: L=1, R=2, C=3, S=4, SL=7, SR=8, RL=5, RR=6. I only use 8 channels so I have no idea how the user assigned channels work.

I figured this out the hard way, with a sacrificial speaker hooked up and tested each output on the AF. AFAIK mixing channels and convolution are the only ways to assign the outputs in MC beyond simple 7.1 output. Considering that there are only 2 user assignable outputs available in the PEQ you can only use 10 discrete channels this way (mixing channels), so if you absolutely need 12 I think convolution is the only way to go. I'll have to put in a request for MC18........

You can't change how the inputs are assigned on the AF through firewire, they are what they are and you have to set up MC to accommodate the AF.

If this is not at all what you were asking please disregard 

[beginner44]

Dear Natehansen66,

this is ABSOLUTELY what I was asking 


So I will look into convolution, and second your feature request for MC18.

Thanks very much again !

[beginner44]

Hello everybody,

1 year since we discussed this. I've just finished to build my second subwoofer (DIY based on JBL GTI15, powered by a Crown CTS2000).

I tried to copy the sub channel to the channel#12 of my Echo Audiofire, unsuccessufully  

Here is my setup :

MC 18.0.206
DSP studio :
- Output format :

• - channels : 12 channels
  - Mixing : JRSS mixing
  - Subwoofer : JRSS Subwoofer 80 hz lowpass

- Parametric equalizer : copy Sub to channel 12

see attached screenshots.

Note that if I copy the sub channel to Surround Left or Surround Right, it will work.
It won't work if I copy to channels greater than 8.
It will stop working with SR if I disable JRSS mixing in DSP>Channels

I guess there is a bug with the copy / move / add mixing capabilities for channels 9 to 12.

Many thanks in advance for your help.

BG44

[JimH]

It might be worth trying 18.0.212.

[beginner44]

Hello Jim,

thanks for the tip.

I've just upgraded to .212, no  change  

[natehansen66]

I've yet to use 11 and 12 on my Audofire so you had me curious. I have used 9 and 10 in the past with no problems. I hooked 11 and 12 up to my woofer amp and recreated your output and PEQ settings. Works just fine here on 18.0.212. It works using no upmixing and with 2.1 sources unchecked as well.

Could it be so simple as you just have your #12 output to the wrong amp? If you have a stack of amps like I do, this could be an easy mistake........one that I've made many times.

Have you tried sending any channels other than the Sub channel to 11 or 12?

As a side note, you've answered a question I've had for some time. I could never access any channels other than the usual + User 1 and User 2..........but I've always been in 2 channels (in a 7.1 container). Selecting 12 channels in the output fixed that 

[beginner44]

Hello natehansen66,


thank you for your answer.

I did check the outputs indeed, no problem on this side. And I can see in the Firewire control panel that no signal is sent to channel 12.

I will try what you suggest and let you know, hopefully today or tomorrow.

Cheers,

BG44

[beginner44]

Hi again,

I did try to copy the sub channel to every channel > 4 (SR, SL, RR, RL, 9, 10, 11, 12).

It works up to number 8. Nothing for 9 to 12. Very strange.

I tried also to copy the right channel to these, nothing.

natehansen66, if it works for you, I believe there is something wrong with my setup and / or computer.

I plan to make a clean reinstall of my PCHC by the end of september. I will then try again and hopefully it will work ! (otherwise, I will be very upset because it would ruin my speaker setup...).

We keep in touch 

Take care,

BG44

[natehansen66]

Good luck! My PC setup is really nothing special, just a Wal-Mart Acer.

Have you tried restarting your PC? A lot of times this will resolve any issues I have.

[beginner44]

Unfortunatelly rebooting did not fix the problem.

Thanks anyway for the tip !

Cheers,

BG44

[mwillems]

Unfortunatelly rebooting did not fix the problem.

Thanks anyway for the tip !

Cheers,

BG44

I don't know what the Audiofire driver interface looks like, so forgive me if I'm barking up the wrong tree, but three questions for additional troubleshooting:

1) what output mode settings are you using (ASIO, WASAPI)?
2) If you open up the Audiofire output in the windows mixer, how many output channels is it set to there?
and
3) have you tried fiddling with channel offsets to see if that helps?

I ask because I recently had a soundcard that supported 8 channels of output, but when the windows mixer was set to "stereo" JRiver couldn't see or successfully output to any channels above 2 unless I was using ASIO output.  Additionally, I currently have an interface where I needed to set the channel offset just right to expose the correct channels. 

Just some additional thoughts, sorry you're having a bad time of it.