Topic: madVR Guide (Read 236524 times)

ldoodle · « **Reply #50 on:** March 02, 2014, 02:30:47 am »

Can someone confirm the order of the Scaling algorithms:

Take the medium performance list as an example:

•Mitchell-Netravali
•Catmull-Rom
•Bicubic
•SoftCubic

So does MN produce better image than CR, which produces better image than Bicubic etc.

In other words, they're listed in order of image quality, or have I got that the wrong way round and they're in order of performance?

Thanks

6233638 · « **Reply #51 on:** March 02, 2014, 03:26:06 am »

All of those algorithms should perform exactly the same.
As for image quality, it depends a lot on your personal preferences.

Mitchell-Netravali is a medium-to-low sharpness algorithm, which has very little ringing.
Catmull-Rom and Bicubic are sharper, but exhibit more ringing and aliasing. (jagged edges)
SoftCubic is very soft, but has low amounts of ringing and often "hides" compression artifacts in a bad quality source.

ldoodle · « **Reply #52 on:** March 02, 2014, 01:11:47 pm »

Thanks!

One thing I have noticed with DVDs, is I get a lot of repeated frames. Queue lengths are full, dropped/delayed frames are 0, but repeated frames can climb to 1000+ in a matter of minutes.

The repeated frames line does not appear on Blu's.

LUCA T · « **Reply #53 on:** March 08, 2014, 08:30:13 pm »

Hello, I'm planning to build an HTPC with JRiver+Madvr (maybe with xbmc), which would be the CPU+GPU needed for the highest quality?

I don't know if an AMD kaveri 7850k would be enough!?

Or I should base the htpc on a intel i7 + dedicated video card?

It would be used mainly as BD player, so movies at 1080p and I would like to apply the madvr's maximum quality available

Thanks a lot

EDIT: I'm sorry I've just figured out I posted in the guide my bad, sorry again

6233638 · « **Reply #54 on:** March 10, 2014, 03:36:15 pm »

I doubt it would be able to use the "highest quality" settings, as that is a moving target.
Recently there were some additions which really increase the GPU demands if you want to use them.

I'm not sure if anyone here has tried using the new AMD Kaveri APUs here.
I'm sure it would work well and give you very good image quality though, just not the maximum settings.

LUCA T · « **Reply #55 on:** March 10, 2014, 04:27:41 pm »

Quote from: 6233638 on March 10, 2014, 03:36:15 pm

I doubt it would be able to use the "highest quality" settings, as that is a moving target.
Recently there were some additions which really increase the GPU demands if you want to use them.

I'm not sure if anyone here has tried using the new AMD Kaveri APUs here.
I'm sure it would work well and give you very good image quality though, just not the maximum settings.

So what would you suggest?

6233638 · « **Reply #56 on:** March 11, 2014, 06:01:38 am »

Quote from: LUCA T on March 10, 2014, 04:27:41 pm

So what would you suggest?

I don't really know what hardware is a good choice or what your budget is. The new Nvidia GTX 750Ti is meant to be a very good low power option, but I don't know what settings it is capable of using.

It would probably be better to start a new topic asking for recommendations.

russo · « **Reply #57 on:** March 12, 2014, 07:46:50 am »

I have a new HTPC with i4670k and Asus GTX 760 Direct CU II 2gb
MY AVR is Anthem MRX 710 with Paradigm Monitor 11 v7
My projector is Panasonic pt ae1000u
I like to watch movies that have a very large size mkv like 30-40 gb and also Bluray ISO.

What are the best quality for madVR?

Thank you...

mattkhan · « **Reply #58 on:** April 16, 2014, 03:47:45 am »

Now that the stable version of JRiver includes madvr 0.87, I wonder if anyone can give some insight as to where is it best to spend any latency budget for different types of content. For example I believe I have seen it said that using nnedi3 on chroma upscaling is minidsp benefit for a lot of (GPU) effort but I am unsure how to balance the other uses of nnedi3 for example.

My use case is a (the?) common one I think, 1080p display with bd and DVD sources.

jmone · « **Reply #59 on:** April 16, 2014, 04:38:38 am »

I asked a similar Q in the madVR doom9 forum:

Quote from: jmone;1675714

.... Q though on any suggestions on settings to try for a native 1920x1080p display for maximising quality for:
1) 1920x1080 AVC/264 @ 23.976p/50i/50p/60i Material (have been very happy with Jinc3+AR) then a long second
2) SD 576 PAL Material
...

to which Hendrik (nevcairiel) replied

Quote from: nevcairiel;1675716

Native 1080p content doesn't benefit from any of the new settings really, short of the dithering improvements.
Just stick to what you know, and try the error diffusion dithering modes - or stick to ordered dithering.

SD could use NNEDI image doubling for sharper images, if your GPU is up for it.
Try with 32 neurons, or maybe even 64 if your GPU has the power for it.

though....a later quote

Quote from: nevcairiel;1677555

I use NNEDI3 chroma scaling for 1080p content on a 1080p screen, just because the GPU is idle otherwise, but if I need to scale the image itself, I would prefer higher neurons of Luma doubling any day.

Hendrik · « **Reply #60 on:** April 16, 2014, 04:40:24 am »

If you want to setup a bunch of profiles to switch settings based on content, you could also use NNEDI3 chroma upscaling for 1080p content, but once you use Luma Doubling for SD content, I would disable NNEDI3 chroma upscaling again to save the performance for luma doubling instead.

jmone · « **Reply #61 on:** April 16, 2014, 04:41:21 am »

I was just posting in your later quote!

mattkhan · « **Reply #62 on:** April 16, 2014, 05:22:33 am »

would you prioritise luma or chroma doubling?

Hendrik · « **Reply #63 on:** April 16, 2014, 05:46:35 am »

Always Luma. Chroma Doubling isn't of that much use for quality.

mattkhan · « **Reply #64 on:** April 16, 2014, 02:12:51 pm »

OK thanks. Any views on the dithering options? The doom9 thread suggests prioritising debanding over dithering (I think) but I am not sure which content either option is applicable to

guido310 · « **Reply #65 on:** April 19, 2014, 06:20:55 am »

Hi, with last jriver release .128, if i select Red October HQ, anytime i play a movie and move scrollbar PC shuts down, whatever MADVR filter is set

This doesen't happen with standard video render or in MPCHC with MADVR

I just upgraded from older jriver version with old MADVR (no NNEDI) and videocard from 7750 to R9 280X (to use NNEDI)

JimH · « **Reply #66 on:** April 19, 2014, 07:58:51 am »

If the PC shuts down, that's probably a video driver bug. The settings of madVR might make a difference. Are you using ROHQ without modification?

guido310 · « **Reply #67 on:** April 19, 2014, 08:22:57 am »

Yes, just as downloaded...i will try to delete completely video drivers and reinstall, since i had drivers upgraded from a 7750

guido310 · « **Reply #68 on:** April 19, 2014, 08:28:25 am »

With Mpchc there is no problem....is it possibile that driver conflicts only with jriver?

6233638 · « **Reply #69 on:** April 19, 2014, 09:00:34 am »

It sounds like you have hardware acceleration enabled in Media Center but not MPC-HC.
Try disabling it and see if that helps.

If your system is crashing like this, it indicates a serious hardware or driver problem though.

guido310 · « **Reply #70 on:** April 19, 2014, 02:55:39 pm »

Thanks...

Actually i now have a temporary generic 550w PSU, since seller ordered me a quality grade modular 800W...on Sapphire sitemi now see they advice fr a 750w PSU for a 280X...could be this causing the issue?

6233638 · « **Reply #71 on:** April 19, 2014, 03:01:09 pm »

That seems likely.

Sboccio · « **Reply #72 on:** April 24, 2014, 04:40:18 am »

Hello, when have you any time to update the guide ? This is the best i found over the web. Thank you

6233638 · « **Reply #73 on:** April 24, 2014, 04:59:08 am »

Quote from: Sboccio on April 24, 2014, 04:40:18 am

Hello, when have you any time to update the guide ? This is the best i found over the web. Thank you

I've had a few people request it now.

I'll try and see if I can get something done this weekend.
There's a lot to cover in the new update though, and a few things I'd like to revise.

I've requested access to the JRiver wiki, so I'll hopefully be able to update it there.

Sboccio · « **Reply #74 on:** April 24, 2014, 05:17:29 am »

Ok , tell us something when you have done;) Thank you very much

tommyjp · « **Reply #75 on:** June 28, 2014, 04:19:43 pm »

I have some vob files not full bitrate. as a result the playback looks artifacty. can madvr deal with this sort of thing?

the system I have at the moment ( amd e350) can smooth it out to some extent using mpc hc + core avc but it is so so. this system is not powerful enough for madvr anyway.

I'm about to get my brothers clevo w110r (Intel® Core™ i7 3rd generation socket G2 mobile processor support
NVIDIA® GeForce® GT 650M GPU / Intel® GMA HD GPU
NVIDIA® Optimus technology support)

would this with madvr improve things? cheers

6233638 · « **Reply #76 on:** June 29, 2014, 01:53:46 am »

Yes, madVR's debanding, and using a softer scaling algorithm should help improve how things look.

Karl78 · « **Reply #77 on:** October 03, 2014, 06:12:11 pm »

Where did the guide go? Missing?

tyler69 · « **Reply #78 on:** October 03, 2014, 06:15:21 pm »

http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=80253.0

It's in 6233638's signature.

Karl78 · « **Reply #79 on:** October 03, 2014, 06:57:28 pm »

Yeah, this one

But in the first 3 posts the img (and the text too) are missing.

Edit: Very strange. When i'm logged in, i dont'see the content of first 3 posts, otherwise yes

Edit 2: Solved. It's a username issue

ldoodle · « **Reply #80 on:** February 17, 2015, 05:21:24 am »

Could someone help with madVR's display mode switcher.

My display is max 1080i only (not p), so I've got this setup as:

720p50, 720p59, 720p60, 1080i29

and ticked the option to treat 25p as 24p as I'm in a PAL region.

Desktop resolution is 1366x768i59. This successfully switches to these resolutions based on the source. Do I need to cater for any more?

6233638 · « **Reply #81 on:** February 17, 2015, 11:12:25 am »

I would recommend only using a single resolution in madVR - the native resolution of your display. (which I thought was 1024x768 in your case?)
Then I would suggest enabling only the refresh rates that it supports, and only progressive refresh rates - which would be 24, 50, or 60.
Skip anything else and let VideoClock handle any other differences in framerate. (e.g. playing 23.976 FPS content at 24Hz, or 59.94 FPS at 60Hz)

So with a 1080p native display you might use: 1080p24, 1080p50, 1080p60
Or: 1080p24, 1080p60 if you have an NTSC panel that does not support 50Hz refresh rates.

ldoodle · « **Reply #82 on:** February 17, 2015, 01:37:25 pm »

Yeah you're right that mine is 1024x768, but for some reason my AVR doesn't like it. If I let madVR change to it or change to it in NVIDIA control panel, my screen goes black. I have to turn the amp off and back on. It's a Pioneer VSX-529 with GT 730 GPU.

Just testing a few things out.

So I would use 1024x768i60, or 1024x768p60? Or just 1024x768?

And then what do I do with some of the other madVR options: smooth motion, de-interlacing etc.

6233638 · « **Reply #83 on:** February 17, 2015, 03:39:39 pm »

You should always send a progressive signal from the PC.
Hmm, I'm not sure about the AVR. The thing is that 1024x768 is a "PC" resolution rather than a "HDTV" resolution (480i/p/720p/1080i/p) so the AVR may not like it.
I don't suppose it's possible to do something like use DVI from the PC straight into the TV for video, and HDMI into the AVR for audio? I don't really have much experience with AVRs.

The smooth motion/deinterlacing settings should be left as they are in the guide.

Karl78 · « **Reply #84 on:** May 01, 2015, 05:26:01 pm »

Maybe it can be useful as a supplement, especially regarding new settings: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=171787

Trumpetguy · « **Reply #85 on:** May 26, 2015, 03:23:20 am »

Thankful for this thread, worked my way through it this weekend, and it solved an annoying problem. During the past couple of months, I started noticing picture had become washed out. And I literally mean had become, because I am pretty sure this was all correct when the calibrated projector was installed a couple of years back, because I was so happy with the black levels.

After reading the thread I double checked range settings, and found both madvr and the nvidia driver to limited level range 16-255. Now madvr is set to 0-255 (as per recommendations in this thread) and nvidia 16-255, and black levels came back to what I remember as good and normal.

Problem is solved, but the question remains - did the washed out thing happen because of range default change in some recent madvr update, nvidia driver update, both, or was it always this way?

Hendrik · « **Reply #86 on:** May 26, 2015, 07:02:00 am »

Recent NVIDIA drivers changed, as they implemented an option to clearly choose 0-255 or 16-235, and this may have influenced the behavior. I had to reset the setting on my HTPC as well, but of course I knew that the setting would appear, in fact that was the reason I installed the new driver.

Trumpetguy · « **Reply #87 on:** May 26, 2015, 08:46:11 am »

Quote from: Hendrik on May 26, 2015, 07:02:00 am

Recent NVIDIA drivers changed, as they implemented an option to clearly choose 0-255 or 16-235, and this may have influenced the behavior. I had to reset the setting on my HTPC as well, but of course I knew that the setting would appear, in fact that was the reason I installed the new driver.

Ah, good, there's the explanation, thanks. There may be some of us (less watchful) that didn't notice that at once.

Trumpetguy · « **Reply #88 on:** June 08, 2015, 08:55:05 am »

Another thing - the Output Color Format is either "RGB" or "YCbCr444". What is the correct choice?

mojave · « **Reply #89 on:** June 08, 2015, 09:07:45 am »

Quote from: Trumpetguy on June 08, 2015, 08:55:05 am

Another thing - the Output Color Format is either "RGB" or "YCbCr444". What is the correct choice?

RGB

Trumpetguy · « **Reply #90 on:** June 08, 2015, 09:15:58 am »

Ok, thanks.

jmone · « **Reply #91 on:** August 24, 2015, 10:59:16 pm »

Anyone else seeing unreported (in the madVR GUI) frame drops / presentation glitches with MC21 / Win10 / nvidia GPU? Been solid for years, but this has started in the last month but of course lots up SW upgrades in that time! (MC, Win, nvidia drivers)! No noticable pattern just dropped frames or presentation glitch though Audio is perfect. It may be unrelated but I've had two occasions where black frames were presented for a couple of seconds to the PJ as well that I've never seen before either.

I've seen a few posts in the madVR doom thread but most seem to be AMD related.

Thanks
Nathan

Manfred · « **Reply #92 on:** August 25, 2015, 01:50:03 pm »

I had also a few crashs with my gtx 750 TI under Win 10.

jmone · « **Reply #93 on:** September 10, 2015, 05:57:51 am »

I'm still getting unreported visible Dropped Frames or Presentations Glitchs on my HTPC regardless of the madVR and MC settings. I'm about to Nuke/Pave but before I do any suggestions? It has been 100% stable pre Win10 RTM (and at the same time a change in TV) for years so this one has me scratching my head.

jmone · « **Reply #94 on:** September 22, 2015, 05:35:49 am »

I see Madshi has NNEDI3 working again under Win10. Whats the sweet spot these days for GPUs?

jologskyblues · « **Reply #95 on:** September 22, 2015, 10:07:58 am »

Quote

I see Madshi has NNEDI3 working again under Win10.

Really? Cool.

I'm going to give it a try although I'm really liking Lanczos 3 Taps with AR right now which seems to have less blurring compared to NNEDI3 in my experience.

Quote

Whats the sweet spot these days for GPUs?

For NNEDI3, more is always better.

jmone · « **Reply #96 on:** September 25, 2015, 03:48:15 am »

Thanks - I'll play some more with the settings first....

Hendrik · « **Reply #97 on:** September 25, 2015, 04:07:05 am »

Quote from: Aphex on September 24, 2015, 12:41:59 pm

A GTX 950 or a GTX 960.
Both will do 10-bit UHD decoding and are the only GPUs other than the Skylake iGPUs which can.
I think Skylake is the only GPU which will do VP9 decoding though. Or at least, it's not supported via LAV on my 960.

Note that Skylake GPUs (and Broadwell as well) only have a hybrid decoder for 10-bit, so its somewhat ineffecient.
And VP9 decoding isn't possible with any GPU through LAV today, because there is no common interface to access such a decoder.

For 4K TVs, a 960 4GB is probably a good choice. Not the most highend for all sorts of NNEDI3 processing, but still decent.

Hendrik · « **Reply #98 on:** September 25, 2015, 05:19:11 pm »

Quote from: Aphex on September 25, 2015, 04:16:49 pm

Do we know if the 960 will do VP9 decoding?

That depends if there will ever be a DXVA2 specification for VP9 (and if NVIDIA in turn adopts it). Right now, I wouldn't bet on it.

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