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[john dolan]

Hi guys new member here so just like to say hi everyone.

Ive just bought jriver after using the trial version for 2 days that did all I wanted and sounds great so I bought the full thing and very happy I did.

I have a problem with JRiver locking up while playing my music 5 or 6 times a day it will just freeze so I was wondering if theres any settings I should adjust in the options that would sort it.

My pc is
Intel Core i7-2600K , Asus P8P67 PRO Intel P67,Corsair Vengeance 8GB (2x4GB)
Sapphire 6990 + 6970,Samsung P2450H 24" ,Corsair AX1200i Lian Li v2000 case cpu and gfx water cooled and OS is Windows 7 64 bit

Hifi is
michell gyrodec with orbe platter - phono x + psxr - synology nas - streamX - cdxtse + psxr - audiolab m-dac with Mcru psu - AS Passion passive - sony bdp s780 bluray also into the dac - - pmc tb2+speakers -  biamped with 2 Xpowers both with psxr with rel sub - dab 8 - fm 7.5

My music is ripped using lossless flac and stored on both the pc and a Synology nas.

Can anyone help please.

[JimH]

Try updating the Synology firmware.  There was a problem with it about year ago.  You could probably find more with an Internet search.

USB DAC's sometimes have problems when switching sample rates.  You could try using MC's DSP Studio/Output settings to force everything to a single sample rate.

[john dolan]

Hi
Its when I stream using the pc and jriver I have the problem because at night I just use the N - remote to control my cyrus stream and stream from the nas without problem so the nas is fine.

In the day I use the pc to stream from its internal hd using jriver and its jriver that locks up.

The music files and the hard drives in both the pc and the nas are the same.

The problem seem to be jriver locking up randomly but it works and sounds fine most of the time.

Thank you for your quick reply much appreciated.

[john dolan]

Today so far ive tried to play 2 albums and neither of them made it to the end.

This is what I see after it happens

[john dolan]

[john dolan]

Today ive tried to play 3 albums and none of them made it to the end.

The first one 18 tracks got to about track 10 the second album 17 tracks got to track 15 and the 3rd one only got to track 2 and I get the same message each time and sometimes jriver is locks solid and I get a windows message saying stopped responding.

All 3 albums were straight cd rips flac lossless.

Ive just started album 4 which is a 24/96 download flac fingers crossed.

[JimH]

So you're playing to a DLNA device over the network.  Not all devices work that way.  Can you play in the other direction (controlling the device instead of MC)?

Simplify your setup if possible.  Don't use a DLNA Controller, for example. 

Force all to the same samplerate, as I said above.

Just for testing.

[csimon]

What DLNA device are you streaming to?

[john dolan]

I have virgin media 100 mb broadband and use the supplied router into which is plugged the Synology nas a Cyrus StreamX and a PC all wired with Ethernet.

I stream music from the nas and the pc to the Cyrus StreamX which feeds M-dac and the rest of the hifi this is how I listen to music.

At night I just use the Cyrus n-remote to control the Cyrus stream X and stream music just from the nas and this works fine.

In the day im using the PC with the same music files and same hd as in the nas and I stream the music from the PC hd using JRiver which then goes from PC to router to Cyrus StreamX.

[john dolan]

This is my Cyrus StreamX

http://www.hi-fiworld.co.uk/index.php/internet-audio/391-cyrus-stream-x.html

Its designed to be used as im using it.

[csimon]

Have you got conversion turned on in your MC DLNA Server?  If so, try turning it off.

Have you got DLNA Renderer turned on in the MC options? If so, try turning it off.

Are DLNA and DLNA Extra turned on in the DLNA server? If so, try turning them off. (EDIT: The link you've provided above only mentions UPNP, not DLNA, so try turning DLNA off via this method).

Does the StreamX disappear from the Playing Now menu when this problem occurs?

[john dolan]

Yes the StreamX disappears from the Playing Now menu when it happens.

Thanks for the response guys ill try turning off the DLNA.

[csimon]

OK - it won't help much but since the machine disappears from the Playing Now menu it basically means MC "loses it" from the network. MC automatically removes devices if there are too many errors/communication faults with it, which could well be because MC is sending DLNA commands to it when it only understands UPNP. Or something like that!

[JimH]

Try the latest build from the top of the MC18 board. 

[john dolan]

Will try the latest build thank you for the help guys.

[john dolan]

latest build update seems to of fixed it thank you very much for the fast response and help.

[john dolan]

Played 3 albums fine from start to finish but failed on the 4th same problem.

If I turn off any DLNA options I lose the Cyrus stream from the playing now options.

[csimon]

Which DLNA options have you turned off?

[john dolan]

Ive tried all of the ones I can find in the media network options and any I turn off I lose the Cyrus from the playing now.

[john dolan]

Is there any option to make jriver use UPNP or some kind of DNLA work around maybe.

[csimon]

Make sure Media Network is turned on, and turn DLNA Controller and DLNA Server back on.

Then turn on DLNA but not DLNAExtra.  If that doesn't work, turn off DLNA.

Remember it may take a while for devices to appear in Playing Now.  If in doubt, restart both MC and the cyrus.

[csimon]

Is there any option to make jriver use UPNP or some kind of DNLA work around maybe.

It reverts to UPNP when you turn DLNA and DLNAExtra off.

[john dolan]

But when I turn off DNLA I lose the option to select the Cyrus from the playing now options

[john dolan]

Just a thought do I need this DNLA because my pc goes via the router to the Cyrus ? if I bought a long usb cable and went from pc direct to the usb in on my Cyrus would I then see the Cyrus listed in the playing now options because I will order a cable if you thing that work sort it.

[csimon]

Yes, if it behaves as a USB DAC/sound card then this will work. It won't appear in Playing Now explicitly, you will have a default zone in there which is basically the local sound card. You can have more than one local audio device in your PC and you specify which one MC uses in Tools/Options/Output Mode Settings. Under Device you can select a device explicitly or select the Windows Default.  Use WASAPI for Output Mode initially. Make sure the device is set up in Windows correctly and works before trying it in MC. Note that you can add more zones which refer to different sound cards if you wish.

If you do this then you can use all MC's internal audio processing capabilities. When using DLNA, you are sending audio essentially untouched and the device processes it itself. Control should also be far more reliable!

USB can be flaky over long distances though.

[john dolan]

I would need 6 metres of usb cable to reach that's why I use Ethernet cable instead.

Its a shame JRiver wont play nice with my Cyrus though.

Thanks for your help.

[pluto]

I might be missing the point here (but have to ask anyway), why are you using DLNA with its associated vagaries at all? Assuming you can see the area on which you are storing the FLAC files, from the Windows PC on which you are running MC, either as a drive letter or something like

Code: [Select]

\\Synology\Music\FLAC files
why bother with DLNA at all when using MC to play music residing on the NAS???

Use the Windows networking to access it just like any other drive, thus bypassing DLNA and all its oddities.

[csimon]

He's sending music to an external DAC/DLNA renderer, it's not the reading of the files that's the problem.

[pluto]

Is the M-DAC not locally attached to the Windows PC? No, I see it's hanging off the Cyrus beast. Lots of variables!

[john dolan]

I can stream from my nas fine using my Cyrus n-remote its when im using my pc I stream from the hd on the pc because its faster than the nas.

if I turn off DNLA jriver cant see the Cyrus streamer.

[csimon]

Is the M-DAC not locally attached to the Windows PC?

No, it's networked at the moment, hence DLNA, but where we're currently at is to try connecting locally via USB, but the length of the required USB cable may be a problem.

[john dolan]

Is the M-DAC not locally attached to the Windows PC?

The Cyrus StreamX is connected to the M-dac by digital coax.The pc is connected to the router not the cyrus.3 pc a Blu-ray and a nas and the Cyrus StreamX alall connected through the router.

[john dolan]

Thanks for your help guys it is appreciated but I think ill just stick to the nas for streaming music as the pc doesn't want to play nice and I don't want to be using long usb cable runs.

[pluto]

I have to comment that this sounds unduly complicated.

Suggestion: instead of the Cyrus thingy, try a Windows netbook (running MC as a player), access the NAS via Windows networking (no DLNA) and connect it to the M-DAC via USB. I suggest this because many DLNA devices are bug-ridden. Simple, effective and reliable.

I don't think I've yet encountered a truly sweet DLNA-based set-up.

[john dolan]

The Cyrus is a expensive high end streamer and is designed to be used as im using it.It cost £1400 also has 30000 radio stations and can plug other digital separates into its 2 coax and 2 optical inputs.Yes I know I could just use a netbook for £200 but I want high end music.

[john dolan]

I was using a Squeezebox touch usung EDO for usb out into a powered usb hub into a ifi iusb power then into m-dac usb input and I upgraded to the cyrus because it sounds better than the SBT.

[john dolan]

If you click the getting started guid this is how mine is wired and the way its designed to work.

http://www.cyrusaudio.com/support-streaming-music-players

[pluto]

Yes I know I could just use a netbook for £200 but I want high end music.

Believe me, a $200 netbook connected to an M-DAC via USB will sound no different to a million dollar dedicated streamer connected to an M-DAC. In fact, if the renderer (in this case, MC) is better than the implementation in the million dollar streamer, the netbook may well sound better 

It is the view of the M-DAC's designer that USB is the best sounding input, as the DAC will be clock-master in these circumstances rather than having to slave to an external clock.

[john dolan]

I read PFM and the m-dac thread that JW posts in.

I was using and still have a SBT that I used with EDO direct into m-dac usb also ifi iusb power and I have upgraded to the cyrus because it sounds better than the SBT I have both here right now.i also used a linear psu on the SBTand tried usb isolator I did everything I could think of to get the best sound from the SBT but when compared to the Cyrus the cyrus sounds better than the SBT.

I compared coax optical and usb into the m-dac from the SBT and yes the usb using EDO gave the best sound from the SBT but the cyrus using coax sounds better again.

[bob]

First:
Try turning off DLNA and DLNAExtra advanced flags as csimon asked above (I never saw a suitable reply to that suggestion).
That doesn't disable DLNA it just reverts the server to uPNP only.
Those options are in:
Media Network->Add or configure DLNA servers->[server name]->Advanced.
You'll see a bunch of check boxes. Only touch the two mentioned above.
On that same screen under "Audio" set the mode to "specified format" and the format to PCM L16 no header (this is required to be played by the spec).
exit out with "ok's"
Try pushing something to it again.
If it still doesn't work download and install the "uPNP tools for developer (google it)"
Run device spy.
Find your renderer in device spy.
Expand the "connection manager" part of the tree.
Double click on the "GetProtocolInfo" function.
Click on invoke.
Select all on the sinkprotocolinfo field.
Copy and paste it into a message here..

[Peter_RN]

Hi John

There has been an issue for many users of the Superhub for some time now, assuming this is what you were supplied. If you have a modem only and you have supplied your own router (best option in my opinion) then this may not apply. The known issues reported seem mainly to apply to internet radio and Virgin's advice from around May 2012 is for users experiencing problems is to place the SuperHub into modem only mode and use another router connected to the superhub for providing connections into the house. I have not heard that this advice has been changed but may be worth a call (dial 150) from their phone line if it is the superhub that you are using. Of course if you happen to have a spare router this may be worth a quick try.

Regards
Peter

Edit: I should have mentioned that I too am on V Media using their modem into my own router and smartswitch and we run both Mac & PC version of Media Centre for several hours a day, files on a NAS, and all run very smoothly. 

[john dolan]

Try out those settings now Bob  :)thanks again guys.

[john dolan]

Just tried Bobs settings and got no sound everything went slow then I got this

[JimH]

It means what it says.  Try rebooting.

[john dolan]

I did reboot and it did the same thing 3 times so have no changed the settings back.

Have ordered a long usb cable to try.

[john dolan]

Today I've been using JRiver on my pc to stream music from my nas to the Cyrus and it's worked perfectly all day long.

[john dolan]

I connected my 5m usb cable £2.99 from amazon to my pc to ifi iusb the to M-dac selected a album with jriver also selected the same album with n-remote from the music on my nas and hit play so was able to just change input on my M-dac between pc and StreamX for quick comparisons.

Verdict is I cant hear any difference between them so for sure the sound is not being degraded by the 5 metre usb cable and for sure the cyrus StreamX doesn't sound any better than just going direct.

[csimon]

Well...glad it seems to all be working now, either/both ways!

so for sure the sound is not being degraded by the 5 metre usb cable and for sure the cyrus StreamX doesn't sound any better than just going direct.

Yeah - I'm pretty sure the sound won't actually be degraded by a long USB cable, it's all digital after all. What I was meaning was that USB is designed to work over short distances and I certainly have experienced dodgy operation with keyboards, mice etc on long USB cables. So if your cable was going to give problems then it's more likely to be in the realm of not working at all or giving lots of droputs, as opposed to the sound quality being degraded.

[john dolan]

Id just like to take the time to thank you guys for your speedy replies which I found helpful.

[chf]

Hi,

I ran into the exact same issue with the Samsung DA-E750 Wireless Dock... device appearing and disappearing, playback error messages, etc...

I then decided to try to stream to the Dock using Windows Media Player, and to do that I first had to set-up streaming in WMP.
After that was done, streaming went smooth with WMP, and after shutting WMP down and trying JRiver MC again, it also worked there.

Update 1: my joy was short-lived. Problems with device showing up and disappearing started again.
I think that MC messes the Samsung Dock up somehow. Here's why I think this:
 - start up the dock (dlna mode)and start up WMP on he pc
 - streaming then works fine
 - close WMP and start JRiver MC -> dock appears after a while, disappears, and so on...  Playing back results in the error messages as shown above in this thread.
 - close JRiver MC and start up WMP again -> impossible to stream to dock anymore
 - reboot dock (keep WMP open) -> streaming works again in WMP

I've tried many DLNA-settings in JRiver MC, but nothing seems to work.

Streaming from the dlna server on my NAS (ReadyNAS ultra) also works.

Update 2: did some more tests...
- installed "Asset DLNA" server on my pc, and that works fine...
- Then tried to play to the Samsung Dock with the JRiver MC DLNA server as source, but controlled from my phone with BubbleUPNP.
  This works perfectly.
- The moment you select the Samsung Dock in JRiver MC, it disappears and reappears. Playback then stops on the Dock.
- Using the Device Sniffer for the UPNP Developer tools, I notice that the dock disappearing seems to be caused by packets with type "NOTIFY/BYE".

The issue seems to be caused by the initial communication between JRiver MC and the Samsung Dock...
I still wonder why it was working for a short period yesterday...

Anyone who has any clue what is causing this or if I can report this to the dev team? (how to report)

Cheers,
Charles