Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[TopDownDriver]

I have three computers on the network: Photo, HTPC, and DF.

I think I have them configured correctly.  However, only HTPC shows up as a Player.

I would like it if all three could control what is playing on each other.  Any ideas as to what is going on?  Shouldn't all three be seen as Players?

Thanks

[Arindelle]

need a bit more details please ... if you are loading the library from the HTPC and it only has one zone configured, this seems to be normal ...what do you want to accomplish? If you mean you want to remotely control playback from multiple machines they would also have to run media server .. this can be a can of worms ... is this what you want to do??

Normally, one of your PCs would be your Media Server, the others would be clients only with all machines sharing the same content. The clients can be configured to show all the playback zones,locally and for remote playback; not just the default "Player" on the server (Media Network client options).  Then you can easily access the media files on any client machine on your network.

[TopDownDriver]

I have three computers set up.  They all see the same music library of files on the NAS.

I would like to be able to have all of the computers be seen as players so that I can control them all from any of the others, so I can have something different playing on each.  So far only the HTPC can be seen as a Player on the network.

[Arindelle]

I have three computers set up.  They all see the same music library of files on the NAS. I would like to be able to have all of the computers be seen as players so that I can control them all from any of the others, so I can have something different playing on each.  So far only the HTPC can be seen as a Player on the network.

I meant how are they configured ... anyways if the HTPC zones are being shown on the others, it is probably running Media Server (call this PC1) ... your NAS is simply a file server, not a "media server" in this case

So PC2 and PC3 can control playback on PC1 remotely, PC2 and PC3 can't control each other, and PC1 can only control its own physical playback.  PC1, 2 and 3 can play different music just not remotely control each other --  or they all can play what PC1 is playing.  This is sort of normal as it is "the" server here.

Well I have to admit I don't have a definite answer here for you .... so here's my brainstorming for what its worth

You would have to be running multiple instances of media server (which will create a bunch of issues IMHO) or you would have to switch off PC1 as the server and change it to client and load cloned libraries I guess to each other PC  -- I can't see how you can get all three to control each other remotely - you would just be changing the control point. Doesn't seem very viable and probably would be a real mess.

I guess you could do this through Remote Desktop and literally running each PCs jriver installation separately, but it seems cumbersome to say the least.  Maybe you could run PC2 and PC3 through a DLNA connection, but someone else would have to chime in to help on that one.

Maybe you could try this with jremote and an ipad. You would then have to clone libraries from PC1 to PC2 and 3, running media server on all of them and switching servers via jremote. I would probably try this first, bearing in mind that keeping those libraries in sync is going to be a pain.

None of my business, just curious. Why do you want to do this remotely from all three/i] areas? and not just from the area you are in?

[mwillems]

You would have to be running multiple instances of media server (which will create a bunch of issues IMHO)

What kind of issues would it cause?  I only ask because that's sort of how I have my setup configured at the moment so that I can control several client PCs remotely.  I enabled media server on each of them, but turned off the DLNA server option on the PCs that aren't serving any files (leaving renderer and/or controller enabled as appropriate). 

I can confirm that enabling media server on each of the PCs will allow several PCs to control each others output, but I didn't realize it could cause problems, so maybe that's not the best way to do it?

[JimH]

I know of no problems that will cause.

I think Arindelle meant running multiple instances of MC on one machine.

[mwillems]

I know of no problems that will cause.

I think Arindelle meant running multiple instances of MC on one machine.

Oh ok, then that's the answer to OP's question: enable media server on all three machines, and make sure that all three have at least renderer and controller enabled and you should be able to play to all three from each other.

[Arindelle]

I know of no problems that will cause. I think Arindelle meant running multiple instances of MC on one machine.

Yes Jim, I run multiple instances sometimes to test some things on a client local library and the main network library at the same time  (or if someone asks me a question in french, I run an one in french to give me the current translation). If I forget to shut one of them down, things have gone "awry".

Never thought of turning off the DLNA, that's pretty cool mwillems !

So for the OP =>
- he sets up all machines to run media server as controllers; on the client (non-file serving) PCs, he would accept the defaults originally then goes back through "add or configure DLNA servers" and chooses to remove them (again just for the clients). They would all be renderers of course

Did I get that right?

Wouldn't he have to connect from the server PC using an IP address rather than the password? Seems like quickly doing this on one client at my place, the same password shows up. or does this not matter? As he also want to not only control from client to server and server to client like you but also client to client (non-servers so to speak^^)

[mwillems]

Yes Jim, I run multiple instances sometimes to test some things on a client local library and the main network library at the same time  (or if someone asks me a question in french, I run an one in french to give me the current translation). If I forget to shut one of them down, things have gone "awry".

Never thought of turning off the DLNA, that's pretty cool mwillems !

So for the OP =>
- he sets up all machines to run media server as controllers; on the client (non-file serving) PCs, he would accept the defaults originally then goes back through "add or configure DLNA servers" and chooses to remove them (again just for the clients). They would all be renderers of course

Did I get that right?

Wouldn't he have to connect from the server PC using an IP address rather than the password? Seems like quickly doing this on one client at my place, the same password shows up. or does this not matter? As he also want to not only control from client to server and server to client like you but also client to client (non-servers so to speak^^)

Hmm.  I haven't been using authentication so far because I haven't opened my network up to the outside, so I'm not sure on the password front.  He'd want media network enabled on all three, and then he'd go under DLNA options and disable server for the machines not serving anything, and enable both renderer and controller for all three.  At that point, as long as the client options are setup to show remote playback zones, he should be able to see and play to any of the other machines.

I'll have to play around with authentication later and see if that puts a wrinkle in it.

[TopDownDriver]

Yeah, don't know if I've been clear.  I've got everything turned on in Media Network under Options.  However, I don't see those systems as Players.  I can only see the HTPC, the Xbox and the current unit.

Playing Now
  Overview
  Player
  HTPC
  Xbox 360

I would have thought they would all show up as "Playing to" options.  What am I doing wrong?

[mwillems]

Yeah, don't know if I've been clear.  I've got everything turned on in Media Network under Options.  However, I don't see those systems as Players.  I can only see the HTPC, the Xbox and the current unit.

Playing Now
  Overview
  Player
  HTPC
  Xbox 360

I would have thought they would all show up as "Playing to" options.  What am I doing wrong?

Is media network turned on on the other computers?

[TopDownDriver]

Yes, that's it.  Media Network is switched on On all of the computers.

[TopDownDriver]

So what do I need to do to see all computers as Players?

If I understand correctly, the other systems are not properly being seen as DLNA clients?

[mwillems]

So what do I need to do to see all computers as Players?

If I understand correctly, the other systems are not properly being seen as DLNA clients?

Check the following settings:

1) Make sure Media network is checked on all three
2) Under "advanced" make sure that DLNA controller and DLNA renderer are checked on all three PCs.

That should let each of the PCs see one another's playback zones. 

If that isn't working try the following (but you shouldn't need to do this):

1) Under client options, make sure that "show playback zones from the server on the client" is checked, and
2) Make sure that DLNA server is checked on all three computers.

I don't think you should need to enable "DLNA server" on all three, but that should ensure it will work if it isn't already.

[TopDownDriver]

Setup EXACTLY as you describe.  However, nada.  Can not see the two systems as "Players".  There has got to be something else going on, perhaps in the network settings of the machines?  They are all running Windows 8.1 if that helps.  They can also all see each other through the File Manager in Windows as well.

NOTE: Their libraries show up in the list, but they are not listed as "Players".  I thought J River was supposed to be a DLNA Renderer and show up automatically as "Zones", but no luck.

LASTLY: Have connected my iPad running JRemote to each and can control them all.  The only issue is that I can not "send" audio to be played on two of the systems.  Any ideas???

[TopDownDriver]

So, no one has a clue???

[Arindelle]

I'll make a check list but won't have time until tonight (GMT+1), without screen shots of your configs, when you say you did everything like mwillems said, I believe you   but you could have missed something ...

in the mean time if you read this just double check a couple of things for me please (see screenshot)

I have had some problems with authentication in the past - so try Network access by IP address and not access key to see if this makes a difference.

To test -
Have you mapped your your media to a network drive(s)?
Have you assigned static IP addresses to each machine in DHCP via the router - If via windows set that to auto and define via the router.

try on one Client and the media server first
Create a new zone on each PC - do not use the same name eg: No DSP - Downstairs ; No DSP - Den -- remember you are seeing defined zones not just the word player. Reboot client(s)  -- you should see something like this on the "Den" client : No DSP - Den AND there: No DSP - Downstairs if it works. Of course name the zones as you like

There is a bug I have found btw. Zones I had created and consequently renamed are no longer showing up on client. Perhaps this is your problem too - that's why I'd like to see what happens if you create a new zone. It would be good to include location in the name. And try something other than Player

Sorry I do not have Win 8 installed, btw

I'll check this post later to see if you have had the time to try

[TopDownDriver]

Alright let's see if I can address this.

First my problem is that I thought the instances of JRiver MC running would automatically show up as DLNA Renderers (Zones).  Am I wrong?

My Media is on a NAS.  Each machine on the network has its own local Library connected to the NAS, in case one is off.  It is not mapped to a drive, but called directly.

Each machine has a static IP.

I can add a Zone, but as I can't link it to anything other than the existing Zones, I don't see the point.  What I want is a Zone for the Players which are not showing up in the list.  All this does is give me a duplicate of hat I already have.

I think I am missing something, somewhere.

[TopDownDriver]

Screenshot of settings on Photo (PC name) - one which does not show up as a Player on any other JRiver on the network.

[csimon]

First my problem is that I thought the instances of JRiver MC running would automatically show up as DLNA Renderers (Zones).  Am I wrong?

I am not sure, but I think I read something somewhere some time ago that MC will not use DLNA to control instances of itself as it's a layer that is not needed - it has its own communication and remote-control protocol. Therefore I can well imagine that MC DLNA renderers will not show up as zones within MC.

However, instances of MC (players) that can be controlled from other instances of MC should indeed show up as zones, as "PC Name: There" by default I think.

I also remember that people have reported a bug in that server zones do not appear on clients that are connected as clients, or something along those lines.  The whole client/server thing is a bit confusing as each instance of MC can be both at the same time rather than there being one central server to which everything else connects.

[TopDownDriver]

Don't know what the problem is, though I would sure like to get it fixed.

I have three PCs running JRiver.  Let's call them A, B, C.

A can be seen as a Player/Zone by the others all the time by B & C.

B can not see C and C can not see B as A Player option.

As far as I can tell they are all configured the same.  They each have their own library (it is the same network location, not mapped to a drive, but accessed directly from the NAS).

Anyone?

[Arindelle]

 

My Media is on a NAS.  Each machine on the network has its own local Library connected to the NAS, in case one is off.  It is not mapped to a drive, but called directly.

maybe mwillems understood this, but I didn't.

I’m afraid we are running around in circles. Let’s make sure we are on the same page. Warning => wall-of-text  

Just to make sure … You are trying to run three media servers at once,  with, now it appears to me,  each PC  running separate libraries. Are you not loading a common “shared” library??  The NAS is just a repository for the media, the PC running as the media server is actually “serving” the files. It would be nice to have JRiver installed on the NAS and have everything else run as a client, but it can’t. Maybe this is what is confusing to you?

 I thought the instances of JRiver MC running would automatically show up as DLNA Renderers (Zones).  Am I wrong?

Not really. Consider “Player” as nothing more than a default zone – a zone being a specific configuration or set-up. I think you are getting hung up on the word. Think of “Player” as the default Zone#1 on each local machine, rather than something that plays Media located in a specific place. Zones are not renderers as such. They are, in a way, configurations of renderers. However, Media Servers don’t show zones of clients, but clients do (read should) show the Server’s zones.

So, the Server PC is “normally” not set up to show remote zones. That is why it was recommended to set two client PCs as renderers and controllers – I believe by activating all PCs as servers you won’t be seeing the zones without unchecking the DLNA server box in advanced settings and reloading the program. Somebody please fell free to correct me if I am missing something.

Please test the following to make sure at least 1 media server is correctly configured for the clients as indicated previously – also remember that the library indicated on all installs as “Main” is not necessarily the “serving library” – it is the default local library.

First …
Set PC1 to run as media server, renderer, controller
PC2 & PC3 just as Clients do not check the media network box just yet
Also, please create a new zone, which  you can remove later (want to make sure you don’t have the same bug as I do - see screenshots)

Then load PC1’s Library on both PC2 and 3 from either Playing From in the tree or File=> Library (PC1 library includes all media?)

Now you should see PC1’s zones on each of the clients like this: “There: Player” and “There “New Zone”” You should be able to playback and control PC1 from each client (see screens again)

If that worked ….
Now set up Media Server on PC2 & PC3 running ONLY as renderer, controller
Both will again load PC1’s library. Now PC2 can control PC3 and vice versa as mwillems suggested.  If PC1 is not visible on the network, this will not work (not what you want, but close)

Personally, I would run like this and just set PC1 to “wake on lan”. I have had better luck with mapped network drives than unmapped. Also, if you do not check use identification, you will not be able to use library sync. You could map the same paths to a local library on each client so that playback could be done with just one PC+NAS on of course. I would set that local library to not write tags to files so you wouldn’t screw up the “master” library.

Finally: If you want to run all three PCs as servers and controllers/renderers, I believe you would have to have identical cloned libraries on each machine (syncing any admin or retagging will be tricky as there is no real master library).  The PC acting as server will not be able to control the clients, but in this case you could run PC2 loading its own library as server and control via PC1 and PC3. I do not want to test this on my system as a “master” library is important to me; so I haven’t tried this. It is logical though , if you have multiple PCs running, one of them would have to be actually  serving the files, and consequently the zones of the other would not be showing up.  Also, you might need to run the network with fixed ip addresses rather than with the access key  

There is some work in this direction going on, however. Please read this post http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=85671.0 and read Hendrik’s solution (and InflatableMouse’s explanation). This post concerns working outside of a LAN, so it might not be applicable here. However, at least in your screenshot, you are using the default port 52199. It appears you can’t use the same port for different static IPs, but it could be possible assigning different ports to each IP address -- have to see about this.

[TopDownDriver]

Did as you suggested.  Went through and loaded the library from PC1 (Server) to PC2 and PC3.  Did not see anything on these other than Player and There as player options.  PC2 and PC3 never saw each other.

Using the Media Server Library loaded onto each one only.

Then set them up as Renderers and Controllers with no change.

Here are screen shots.

[Arindelle]

So -- your screen shots are taken from either PC2 or PC3 and the loaded library is from HTPC (what I'm calling PC1) correct? Are Do you see exactly the same thing indicated on the screen shot in both PC2 and 3

- did you actually set up a new zone in PC1 ? What did you name it? If you did there is a configuration problem or you have a zone not showing up (I have 2 that don't)
-you set up first one PC running server (assuming this is called HTPC) and the other two only as a client and you were able to control the server from both?? In otherwords could you make it play from PC2 and 3 by clicking on "There"? Could you play music on PC2 and PC3 by choosing Player?

if you did both of these things, but you couldn't control PC1, stop there,   --something is wrong and have to fix something first. I am assuming you can "see" the three PCs in windows explorer

if you did not do the above, please do  -- you should have something like the screen shot below if you click the "Overview" button (It would show three zones to play something like Player (which would be local) and two remote zones with "There" (see screenshot attached)

IF that worked .... try  to connect by IP address and not the access key. Set up a new zone (different names on each) on PC2 and PC3.  Repeat mwillems config.  Remember to keep all three PCs on line. Sorry to say, but I cannot test this config as I do not have three PCs with jriver installed. Also you might have a problem with authentication if you have passwords on each PC -- another thing to try would be to check that box in options (i use authentication in my config with my access key°

[TopDownDriver]

Really appreciate the assistance.

Did everything you suggested.  Each computer can see each computer in Windows File Explorer.  They also do have passwords (all the same in Windows 8.1).  PC2 and PC3 can see and control PC1 in JRiver, but PC1 can not see or control either PC2 or PC3 - after the changes you suggested.  Added a Zone on PC1, but that did nothing - named it Test, and deleted it before I made the screenshots.  When I click Overview (on PC2 or PC3) I get the Local and the PC1 (and also my Xbox on the network) but nothing else.

Now, here is the odd thing.  Turned on Authentication for all three PCs, and rebooted JRiver on them.

PC1 - PC2 showed up, but Xbox disappeared.  Played song from PC1 to PC2.
PC2 - no change, PC1 and Xbox only players.
PC3 - no change, PC1 and Xbox only players.

This is getting weird.  What would you like me to try?  I am sending screenshots from each computer.  HTPC is the Server, Photo and DigitalFocus are the clients).

I hope you can make sense of this...

[bob]

Try the newest build. (19.0.87)
I don't know how much of this applies to your issues but there was a problem starting the renderer when the server is disabled (which I saw in one of your screencaps).

[TopDownDriver]

Updated, no change.

However, when I restarted the HTPC's copy of JRiver, it came up with DigitalFocus as opposed to Photo this time.  Still no Xbox on the HTPC, but it is on the other two.

Baffled!

[bob]

Updated, no change.

However, when I restarted the HTPC's copy of JRiver, it came up with DigitalFocus as opposed to Photo this time.  Still no Xbox on the HTPC, but it is on the other two.

Baffled!

firewall issues on the HTPC? Blocking port 1900 (SSDP discovery). Something else on the HTPC using port 1900?

[TopDownDriver]

Turned off Firewall completely and no changes.

Here is the firewall settings for Port 1900 on Photo (should be same on HTPC).

[bob]

In services, look for SSDP discovery and turn it off.
Do you have another firewall?

[TopDownDriver]

Stopped the service - no change.

There is no other firewall running on any of the machines.