Topic: TV video is very jumpy. (Read 11911 times)

BartMan01 · « **on:** May 18, 2016, 12:40:24 am »

Trying out TV in MC using my OTA HDHomeRun box. I can tune in the channels from that box using WMC, VLC, etc and everything works fine. Trying to watch TV in MC, all video is very jumpy and not in sync with the audio. Any suggestions on what the problem might be?

All other playback is fine, including BluRay 1080p content.

RoderickGI · « **Reply #1 on:** May 18, 2016, 02:23:53 am »

Have you completely disabled all the WMC components/processes/services?

You need to do that first to be able to deal with TV tuners in MC. Plus check the settings at "Options>Theatre View>Behaviour>Disable Windows Media Center" just to be sure. (Mostly for Remote Control functionality.)

If that doesn't help, come back and share the specific model of HDHomeRun box, as different models have different issues. A search may even find discussion on your model.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #2 on:** May 18, 2016, 07:02:14 pm »

Can't disable WMC, need it to record encrypted cable.

JimH · « **Reply #3 on:** May 18, 2016, 07:34:37 pm »

Try it for testing purposes, just to see if it helps.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #4 on:** May 20, 2016, 06:29:41 pm »

Quote from: JimH on May 18, 2016, 07:34:37 pm

Try it for testing purposes, just to see if it helps.

Sorry, not going to mess with my WMC setup while I rely on it for TV recordings. The TV viewer app from silicone dust and VLC play back the TV channels flawlessly.

FYI, I have it successfully running on my work laptop but I would really like to confirm it works on the system that would actually be running it before considering using MC as my primary DVR.

Yaobing · « **Reply #5 on:** May 20, 2016, 07:11:13 pm »

What video card do you have? What video playback mode do you use (Red October standard or HQ)?

BartMan01 · « **Reply #6 on:** May 21, 2016, 03:59:38 pm »

Radeon HD 5570 - old but no plans to change it out until I move to 4k since it handles BluRay and HDDVD flawlessly.
Video mode: Red October HQ
JRMark 3696

v21.0.83

I have a 50 mile antenna arriving tomorrow, my 35 mile setup is marginal on a few channels since I am between 28 and 32 miles from the local antenna cluster and don't have direct line of sight. When that arrives and I confirm the channels are coming in acceptably we are going to drop cable TV for now. When I do that, I need to redo my WMC setup anyway so I can disable things to test MC at that time.

My comments yesterday about not being willing to mess with WMC were made right before we decided for sure to drop cable and ordering the new antenna.

RoderickGI · « **Reply #7 on:** May 21, 2016, 08:28:12 pm »

Sometimes a graphics card that plays Blu-ray and HDDVD flawlessly can struggle a bit with high resolution interlaced TV recordings.

But I just tested on my workstation, which has a HD5870 card and runs madVR, and it played 25fps 1440x1080i mpeg-2 video just fine, so maybe your HD5570 would be okay. But do check the format of the video you are receiving.

With digital signals, the picture will either be there, or not, unlike analogue signals. If the video is jumpy, is the image dropping out, or freezing on a frame then jumping forward, or does it look like it pauses then restarts, then pauses, etc.? Also check for dropped, delayed frames, presentation glitches and so on; Ctrl-J in madVR.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #8 on:** May 21, 2016, 10:04:14 pm »

Quote from: RoderickGI on May 21, 2016, 08:28:12 pm

Sometimes a graphics card that plays Blu-ray and HDDVD flawlessly can struggle a bit with high resolution interlaced TV recordings.

But I just tested on my workstation, which has a HD5870 card and runs madVR, and it played 25fps 1440x1080i mpeg-2 video just fine, so maybe your HD5570 would be okay. But do check the format of the video you are receiving.

With digital signals, the picture will either be there, or not, unlike analogue signals. If the video is jumpy, is the image dropping out, or freezing on a frame then jumping forward, or does it look like it pauses then restarts, then pauses, etc.? Also check for dropped, delayed frames, presentation glitches and so on; Ctrl-J in madVR.

I can play back a 1080i TV show recorded with WMC in JRiver without any issues, so I don't think it is a video card issue. Didn't think about using Ctrl-J, per the stats it is dropping almost all of the frames. It displays maybe 2-4 frames per second of the video.

RoderickGI · « **Reply #9 on:** May 22, 2016, 12:31:22 am »

Well that is something very specific to look at. Specific to MC recorded files as well.

What format are you recording in, TS or JTV?

Also, you said you had a HDHomeRun box, but specifically which model, and how is it connected?

BartMan01 · « **Reply #10 on:** May 22, 2016, 08:28:43 pm »

JRiver is currently set to use JTV.

Box is a Silicone Dust HDHomeRun, connects over Ethernet.

RoderickGI · « **Reply #11 on:** May 22, 2016, 10:52:43 pm »

Quote from: BartMan01 on May 22, 2016, 08:28:43 pm

Box is a Silicone Dust HDHomeRun

I gathered that. But there are, or have been, various models. Most are based on the HDHR4 currently by the look of it, with a couple based on the HDHR3. But there were earlier models, although Silicon Dust don't seem to want to list their earlier models even on their support pages. I was wondering of you had an older model, or a recent one.

It may make a difference in MC, although probably only Yaobing could confirm that.

Yaobing · « **Reply #12 on:** May 23, 2016, 09:05:35 am »

The only real distinction is between HDHR and HDHR Prime, i.e. between the bda models and the CableCARD models.

Have you tried using Red October Standard? If there is a difference in the outcome, then we know we should concentrate on madVR configuration.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #13 on:** May 23, 2016, 11:56:49 pm »

Playback with RO standard is fine.

When I play back WMC recorded files, it also seems to be using EVR not madVR.

PGibby · « **Reply #14 on:** May 27, 2016, 11:26:41 am »

I am experiencing something similar with an HDHomeRuun Prime (3 tuner one). Here's what I have going on, and it started maybe a week or two ago:

Every 10-15 seconds, I'll get a little bit of a glitch or hang in audio/video, the screen will pixelate for just a sec, and then it recoveres. It only does this on live tv.
Discs, ripped discs...everything else is flawless.

I've monitored system resources. CPU stays between 10-20%, memory has something like 6 gigs free. During trouble shooting I added a spare Radeon 6850, that didnt help. Looking at the frames rendered during live tv, it shows no missed frames when this glitch happens. It does it on RO standard and with MadVr. I've monitored signal quality from the tuner, and it is locked at 100% most of the time , occasionally dips to 98 or 99%.

I've tried checking and unchecking force hardware acceleration, smooth video clock...every combo, no help there.

I also tried running the tv/recording buffer on a different hard drive, that didn't seem to clear it.

I've also ruled out the my tuner or router being the issue, as the HDHomerun View ap works perfectly smooth on the same pc. And, ironically, my spare laptop run live tv perfectly with jriver.

So, i think i've got it isolated to that specific pc. On it, i uninstalled jriver, reinstalled, tried different drivers for video, drivers for jsut abotu everything in that pc, and it still does it.

I'm stumped? I may release a copy of win10 from another pc, and wipe the effected one clean and start all over? Any helps/tips on what to try would be great.

Love jriver...it really is an AIO solution for media.

CountryBumkin · « **Reply #15 on:** May 27, 2016, 01:23:50 pm »

Quote from: BartMan01 on May 23, 2016, 11:56:49 pm

Playback with RO standard is fine.

When I play back WMC recorded files, it also seems to be using EVR not madVR.

If your playback with RO Standard is fine, and your having trouble with RO+HQ (madVR) then perhaps your setup is playing back in "Film" mode rather than switch to Video Mode when it should (i.e. not switching deinterlacing on-off as it should). You can test be by switching modes while playing back a Show. Try Ctrl+Alt+Shift+D to switch deinterlacing on/off while your watching the Show.

RoderickGI · « **Reply #16 on:** May 27, 2016, 07:21:12 pm »

Also remember MC is a 32 bit app, so it can access 4GB of memory. In fact I think it can only use 2GB of memory. Someone can fact check that.

So you need to look at how much memory MC is using, rather than what is free. Also look to see if memory usage is growing rather than stable.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #17 on:** May 31, 2016, 10:21:20 am »

Quote from: CountryBumkin on May 27, 2016, 01:23:50 pm

If your playback with RO Standard is fine, and your having trouble with RO+HQ (madVR) then perhaps your setup is playing back in "Film" mode rather than switch to Video Mode when it should (i.e. not switching deinterlacing on-off as it should). You can test be by switching modes while playing back a Show. Try Ctrl+Alt+Shift+D to switch deinterlacing on/off while your watching the Show.

Thanks, I will try that. Finally 'dropped' cable - I actually still have it since the price for starter cable + internet was actually cheaper than just internet at the speeds I need. Pretty slammed at work with a new role but I will work on this as I have time. I no longer have any encrypted channels other than HBO (that I can watch from other devices) so I have more flexibility now in what I can test.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #18 on:** May 31, 2016, 11:48:38 pm »

De-interlacing change made no difference.

I am seeing something odd though, the OSD for MadVR is showing that the source is 59.941fps or 29.970 but the display output is set and converting to 23.976Hz.

In MC setup I have NTSC set to output at 59Hz and all other NTSC content that I have except the TV stations is using 59Hz.

CountryBumkin · « **Reply #19 on:** June 01, 2016, 05:04:32 am »

I think your on to something.
Do you have the "display mode switching" setup in madVR to allow switching to 59p or 29p (along with 23p or 24p)?
Or do you have "Display Settings: automatic change mode" set to On at Tools>Options>Video>Display Settings?

It sounds like your display is stuck at 24p

BartMan01 · « **Reply #20 on:** June 01, 2016, 07:57:48 am »

Display mode switching is working fine for everything except TV. Confirmed both in MadVR and in the projector menu where it displays the current format:

NTSC video content is playing back at 59Hz
24FPS film content is playing back at 24Hz
PAL content is playing back at 50Hz
Desktop is displaying at 60Hz
TV is trying to play back at 24Hz regardless of original format.

Current display settings attached below.

CountryBumkin · « **Reply #21 on:** June 01, 2016, 09:05:02 am »

What about the settings in madVR? I'm not sure if you need display mode settings in both JRiver and madVR (I think former member 623... said it was better to setup display modes in madVR) I have it in both palaces.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #22 on:** June 01, 2016, 09:58:09 am »

My MadVR setup is identical to yours except the display mode list field is empty. To date I have not needed anything there and the playback for videos is switching per the MC video settings.

CountryBumkin · « **Reply #23 on:** June 01, 2016, 11:08:02 am »

Okay. I'm out of ideas.
Last thing - if you look at the FPS for each recording in the Standard View>Video>Files (you can add the "fps" field by right clicking on the column header and selecting FPS from the dropdown box) do the TV shows have "29.97" (for the 720x480 recordings) or "59.94" (for the 1920x1080 shows) or do they have "23.98" or something else?

RoderickGI · « **Reply #24 on:** June 01, 2016, 06:06:12 pm »

Quote from: BartMan01 on May 21, 2016, 10:04:14 pm

I can play back a 1080i TV show recorded with WMC in JRiver without any issues, so I don't think it is a video card issue. Didn't think about using Ctrl-J, per the stats it is dropping almost all of the frames. It displays maybe 2-4 frames per second of the video.

I think you should go back to this issue. Use MediaInfo to compare the WMC WTV file with the MC JTV file. Any obvious differences?

They were made with the same tuner, correct? So MC should be playing both properly. There might be some difference between them. I think WTV files are just the broadcaster's transport stream, just like JTV files. I checked some of my files and they are basically identical according to MediaInfo, with the only difference being the GOP format in some.

Perhaps post a screenshot of the MediaInfo output for one of your JTV (actually JTS) video files.

It would be a good idea to check the audio formats as well, as audio can often be the cause of video stuttering. Unfortunately MediaInfo doesn't seem to show the audio format of WTV files, so you may need to rely of what MC says, or find another tool to check what is in the file.

The other area to investigate is other processes running on your HTPC system. You said MC plays TV fine on your laptop, so there could be something still running on your HTPC that is interfering. Disable and kill the processes of everything you absolutely don't need and see if TV plays back normally. If it does, start adding components back in until you find whatever is interfering. Could be a WMC service still running, or part of the Silicon Dust software, or security software, or . . . lots of things.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #25 on:** June 06, 2016, 10:46:19 pm »

Finally got a chance to test some more, what finally fixed it was putting the switching modes in the MadVR settings. Odd that this only seems to matter for TV, everything else (including TV recorded outside of MC) was switching automatically per the MC video settings with the MadVR settings blank.

imeric · « **Reply #26 on:** June 12, 2016, 10:25:35 am »

Don't know what happened but TV is jumpy on all 3 PCs with MADVR...Works fine with Bluray 3D and everything else...Video/audio might be out of sync at times also but not sure...

Was something changed in later versions? I now have to use RO Standard....

Trying to change madvr settings based on what I read didn't help...Not surfe where that switching mode is?

thx

JimH · « **Reply #27 on:** June 12, 2016, 11:40:15 am »

The version is important. There was a problem with AMD graphics cards that a newer version of madVR fixed. It's included in MC now.

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Author Topic: TV video is very jumpy. (Read 11911 times)