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Author Topic: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support  (Read 10970 times)

jmone

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NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« on: April 12, 2018, 07:34:04 pm »

Media Center 24 for Windows now has added Title Playback for unencrypted Ultra HD Blu-ray discs (UHD BD).  Full UHD BD Menu playback is currently not enabled.

Like with standard BD's, MC does not support the decryption of discs or keep any "keys" to do so.  Hence, you will need a 3rd-party UHD BD decryptor (more discussion on these tools can be found in this older thread or at the UHD forum at MYCE).  You will also need very specific drives and firmware for these programs to work.  DeUHD support some "UHD official drives" and "UHD friendly drives".  AnyDVD / MakeMKV / DVD Fab only supports some "UHD friendly drives".  A list can be found here of the supported drives/firmware
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jmone

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2018, 07:49:44 pm »

Experimental UHD BD Menu Support (for testing) - Updated 21 April

Hendrik has added UHD BD Menu support and it is already working very well as of Media Center 24.0.17 onwards.

There is no need for my hack to enable menus on BD UHD anymore!  I'll leave the attachment and following description for those that need to reverse the changes.  If you have modified any of your UHD BD's with my script you will want to run "UHD Menu Off" when the new version of MC that supports UHD BD Menus is released.

========DEPRECATED==================================
This is NOT Supported by JRiver, but..... For those that want to test how Menus work on UHD BD at this stage, I've made a little script that will enable/disable this for your UHD Rips.  Just add the location of the attached scripts to the "Tools--> Send To--> Send To (external)--> Add/Edit Programs--> Add" menu in MC as follows:

Name: UHD Menu Off
Program Path: ....whatever path you saved it in...\UHD_Menu_Off.exe
Parameters: "[Filename]" (eg this is the default)

Name: UHD Menu On
Program Path: ....whatever path you saved it in...\UHD_Menu_On.exe
Parameters: "[Filename]" (eg this is the default)

You can then select one or more UHD item(s) in MC then right click --> Send To--> Send To (external)--> UHD Menu On or UHD Menu OFF (or the recent command if used previously)

In my testing on around 70 UHD Discs that I currently have:
- 0 Crash MC
- 1 Does not display the menu items (Pacific Rim)
- 3 Have a Warning that I’m not connected to a 4K TV with an OK Button you can not press (Creed, Mad Max Fury Road, and Man of Steel)
- 66 Discs play (though sometimes there may be artefacts as between splash screens, or a menu item needs to be selected twice for it to then disappear).

If you have a disc that fails to open correctly, you can always use the MC OSD or Right Click menu and select Title Playback and it will then play sans menu.

The attachment has both the compiled exe and the AHK script so you can see what it does.... which is really just changing the header in index.bdmv from 0300 to 0200 and back again (0300 is used to identify a disc as UHD BD, and 0200 is for BD), and will rename the BDMV\JAR\onQClient.cfg file to BDMV\JAR\onQClient.cfg.no and back again (if it exists).
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rec head

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2018, 08:05:27 am »

FYI to those thinking about trying UHD from a PC: The GPU is much more important than the CPU.

A couple of other points:
UHD HDR MKV's will play if your setup can handle it but no menus.
There is no Dolby Vision support in MKV's and as far as I know no support for it on any PC.
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jmone

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2018, 09:41:03 pm »

FYI - I've updated the utility to enable testing of UHD BD Menus in the 2nd post, for me that now means in the testing of the UHD Discs almost all now work (the 2nd post has details on what issues I still do have.
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audioriver

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2018, 04:17:07 am »

FYI to those thinking about trying UHD from a PC: The GPU is much more important than the CPU.

I'm guessing even the low-end GeForce GT 1030 should be enough? It boasts a very recent generation of PureVideo HD (hardware acceleration).
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Hendrik

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #5 on: April 15, 2018, 05:47:53 am »

A 1030 is probably too low memory for full UHD & HDR usage. I would personally recommend at least 4GB (at the very least 3GB). Therefor, in the current generation the lowest card I would be comfortable with personally would be a 1050 Ti 4GB model.
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tranle

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #6 on: April 15, 2018, 08:40:03 pm »

I am a bit confused about how to get MC24 play Blu-ray and UHD.
If you have the disk ripped to your hard drive, does it need to be in iso format or the bdmv disk structure would work.
If bdmv work, can you give MC24 the top directory or you have to go and pick and choose one of the file inside ?
Or do you have to import it info MC24 so it knows its structure ?

Thanks.
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jmone

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #7 on: April 15, 2018, 09:20:19 pm »

If you have a BD Ripped to your HDD in it's folder structure (unencrypted), just import the index.bdmv file into MC and will be able to play it.  If you put a BD into your ODD or Mount an ISO, MC will see it and ask if you want to Play or Rip the disc (but you will need a decrypter running in the background).
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audioriver

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #8 on: April 16, 2018, 07:16:20 pm »

A 1030 is probably too low memory for full UHD & HDR usage. I would personally recommend at least 4GB (at the very least 3GB).

As a test, I tried the new NASA 4K/UHD satellite channel with a 1030 (2GB/GDDR5). It seems to work fine with DXVA2 native, with smooth audio/video playback and no interruptions. DXVA2 (copy-back) and CUVID cause enough stuttering/glitches to make it unwatchable.
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tranle

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #9 on: April 16, 2018, 08:59:27 pm »

If you have a BD Ripped to your HDD in it's folder structure (unencrypted), just import the index.bdmv file into MC and will be able to play it. ..
Thanks, I have just tried with BD and UHD folder structure and index.bdmv and it works.
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TheShoe

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #10 on: April 16, 2018, 08:59:49 pm »

FYI to those thinking about trying UHD from a PC: The GPU is much more important than the CPU.

A couple of other points:
UHD HDR MKV's will play if your setup can handle it but no menus.
There is no Dolby Vision support in MKV's and as far as I know no support for it on any PC.


hmmm..   does dolby vision work if playing the title directly (not in an mkv container)?

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Hendrik

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #11 on: April 17, 2018, 03:37:54 am »


hmmm..   does dolby vision work if playing the title directly (not in an mkv container)?

No, Dolby Vision is not supported.
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jmone

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2018, 06:26:38 am »

Updated Post 2 - Experimental UHD Menu Support
Quote
Hendrik is currently working on the the inclusion of UHD BD Menu Support in MC.  At this stage I'd recommend just waiting and not to use my hack to enable Menu Support.  I'll leave the attachment and following description for those that need to reverse the changes.  If you have modified any of your UHD BD's with my script you will want to run "UHD Menu Off" when the new version of MC that supports UHD BD Menus is released.
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jmone

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2018, 05:48:53 pm »

From Media Center 24.0.17 onwards, BD UHD Menus has been enabled and so far 71 out of 72 Discs play fine (1 Stalls) :)

Great work!
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JimH

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2018, 05:51:42 pm »

From Media Center 24.0.17 onwards, BD UHD Menus has been enabled and so far 71 out of 72 Discs play fine (1 Stalls) :)

Great work!
Yes!  Well done, Hendrik!  Thank you.

And thanks also, jmone, for all the great testing and reports.
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eddyshere

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #15 on: April 21, 2018, 03:45:35 pm »

Incredible !! The quality of the menu implementation is staggering. I'm a geek and play with dozen of players and hardwares I have (had) dune's up to the HD 4k duo, oppo's up to 205, android boxes (a whole bunch of them), countless differently built HTPC's.

What you guys (esp hendrick) have achieved is incredible. Powerdvd (fully licenced player) has a close to 100% menu hit rate. The few which do not work are mostly due to a bad rip. Oppo, licenced of course has a 100% hit rate (to be expected at this price tag), dune (semi-licenced) a 90% hit rate. All the Android boxes are more miss than hit.

I have tried over 150 BD's since MC24 is out and I had only 4 or 5 menus not working.

It's just excellent !!! Thank you so much

I just need to find .17 now ??
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jmone

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #16 on: April 21, 2018, 04:23:43 pm »

+1 - Yup it is that good!  Compared to PDVD (They just released a new version and want $100 for an upgrade), MC is half the price for a new licence and a fraction of the price for an upgrade + it does so much more and looks much better with madVR support, videoclock, frame rate changing and now Menus all working together :) 

V24.0.17 will be out soon and the experience and hit rate on UHD BD Menus is just as good.  I've only 1 UHD disc out of 70 odd that has a menu issue and you can just select Title Playback and away it goes (sans menu). 

Did you keep a list of the Discs that are not working (please post their details)?
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eddyshere

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #17 on: April 21, 2018, 04:33:41 pm »

No haven't as such but will do so from now on.
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TheShoe

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #18 on: April 21, 2018, 08:09:29 pm »

No haven't as such but will do so from now on.

this may be a good reason to start a google doc spreadsheet


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rec head

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #19 on: April 22, 2018, 07:47:34 am »

My experience with UHD menus in my stand alone is that there really isn't much to do besides play the main title. But most of my UHDs I have ripped before watching and those only had the main title track. I understand wanting to be able to select different titles on BDs but is there much point on UHDs?

I'm not looking to stir up anything just wondering why not just rip to MKV?

P.S. I think that it is great that the MC team got it working.
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jmone

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #20 on: April 22, 2018, 07:51:05 am »

Yup, many have just the main title, but several do have other stuff where a menu is great (and plenty of options that you'd never use!):
- Westworld : Navigation for finding the correct order of the Eps on each disk. 
- The Martian : Has both the theatrical and extended edition.
- Billy Lynn : Has a Special Feature on the technology they used and why
- Blade Runner (Final cut): Has Special Features like an Into from Ridley Scott, Trailer
- Many have the directors commentary
- Many also have an odd feature where you can "focus" on the actor you like and then you get just the scenes with them in it.
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eddyshere

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #21 on: April 23, 2018, 03:10:14 am »

(...)  Compared to PDVD (They just released a new version and want $100 for an upgrade), MC is half the price for a new licence and a fraction of the price for an upgrade + it does so much more and looks much better with madVR support, videoclock, frame rate changing and now Menus all working together

Agree ! But in all fairness I'm always stunned by the quality of PDVD theater Enhancement technologie which is able to make a very good image even with weak igpu's. MadVr is of course a software per se but I can't help sometimes to think that it goes into esoteric aspects of picture quality. The internet is full of comparative screenshots of Madvr at upscaling with X algorithm vs Y and for the life of me you see no difference.

It reminds me a time I was in a high-end hifi shop where a seasoned gentlemen was crawling on all four putting his ears against a 60'000.- loudspeaker and saying (about a >100'000 hifi set) that "the silence coming out of the loudspeaker is really of exceptional quality".... ;D

Fact is that if you want a close to silent, good-looking and small HTPC in your livingroom with best Madvr quality it is really a challenge.

When U want a good laugh : https://www.amazon.com/AudioQuest-Diamond-feet-Braided-Cable/dp/B003CT08E4/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1524471186&sr=1-1-spons&keywords=audioquest+diamond&psc=1&smid=A3MK4ZWZYGY9IC

The comments are brilliant
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RD James

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #22 on: April 23, 2018, 03:46:50 am »

The internet is full of comparative screenshots of Madvr at upscaling with X algorithm vs Y and for the life of me you see no difference.
If you can't see the difference, just use the basic options?
There is a difference though.
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jmone

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #23 on: April 23, 2018, 03:56:13 am »

I remember when JINC first came out, what a difference that made!  These days I crank madVR up to whatever my current GPU can handle and I'm more than satisfied.  If you like funny Amazon Reviews then they keep a dynamic list here.

Got a bunch more UHD BD today and they all play fine in MC24.... well the one I could rip anyway (waiting of support for 3 discs to be added).

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eddyshere

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #24 on: April 23, 2018, 04:09:45 am »

If you can't see the difference, just use the basic options?
There is a difference though.
Take it easy...
There are differences...all I tried to say is that certain settings are not always worth it with the performance hit it makes on the hardware....

Let's leave it here..sorry @jmone...don't want to hijack this thread.

Will help on UHD as soon as .17 is out...
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jmone

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #25 on: April 25, 2018, 04:24:58 pm »

FYI - Another half dozen UHD imported and playing just fine in MC including Menus.   ;D Looks very good.  The only disc causing grief is my version of "Jack Reacher: Never Go Back".  Plays fine in Title Mode but stalls with Menu Playback, and I also have a simple workaround for now on that disc so that the Menu works.
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JimH

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #26 on: April 26, 2018, 09:02:08 am »

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Z0001

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #27 on: May 26, 2018, 12:59:09 am »

So HDCP 2.2 is no longer an issue if there is a decrypter working or the rip has been decrypter?

Just clarifying that we don't need HDCP 2.2 compliance on all hardware between playback and screen via AVR?

Thanks
Z
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jmone

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #28 on: May 26, 2018, 04:49:01 am »

MC will play any un-encrypted file and hence there is no need to HDCP compliance.
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jmone

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #29 on: June 02, 2018, 07:09:09 pm »

Here is a log from Maze Running playing with Menus.  First part of the log shows Maze Runner playing decoding the ATMOS track and it plays fine.  2nd Part of the Log shows Maze Runner playing when Bitstreaming the ATMOS track and while audio starts (and stutters) from the begining of the movie the playback marker shows it is at the end of the movie and the video frames are black.  Tested on two different setups (both the same issue).  I see alot of these in the 2nd part of the log when bitstreaming.
Code: [Select]
0122375: 5860: Playback: COutputPluginAudioRenderer::DoRenderSample: Correcting drift by 461168601842583.250 ms
0122391: 5860: Playback: COutputPluginAudioRenderer::DoRenderSample: Correcting drift by 230584300921271.094 ms
0122391: 5860: Playback: COutputPluginAudioRenderer::DoRenderSample: Correcting drift by 115292150460625.453 ms
0122422: 5860: Playback: COutputPluginAudioRenderer::DoRenderSample: Correcting drift by 57646075230292.320 ms
0122422: 5860: Playback: COutputPluginAudioRenderer::DoRenderSample: Correcting drift by 28823037615141.395 ms
0122438: 5860: Playback: COutputPluginAudioRenderer::DoRenderSample: Dropping sample because it is too late; Error: -893514166069747.750

Edit: No issues when playing this disc in Title Mode or if changing the Audio track to something other than ATMOS when in Menu mode.  The only combo that fails is Menu + ATMOS + Bitstreaming.
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Hendrik

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #30 on: June 03, 2018, 03:55:28 am »

Like mentioned before, I don't think its related to Atmos, but probably just something on that disc. Did you ever encounter that on any other disc?
Unfortunately I don't have that disc, and I can't even buy it yet since it didn't release around here yet. :)

But I'm looking over the timestamp handling when bitstreaming in LAV Audio, maybe something looks off to me. It seems to send a super high timestamp once that entirely screws over the playback clock, explaining why it thinks its already at the end of the file. But where that timestamp comes from...
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jmone

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #31 on: June 03, 2018, 05:04:38 am »

Nope - only this disc (well at this point).  I could zip up the structure if that helps (minus the M2TS files)?
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Hendrik

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #32 on: June 03, 2018, 05:08:40 am »

Probably not helpful without the media data. I'll keep digging. Otherwise the disc releases here next week. :p
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Hendrik

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #33 on: June 03, 2018, 09:11:05 am »

I found the problem, its an issue in Media Center, not LAV.

Edit:
And its fixed for the next build
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jmone

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #34 on: June 03, 2018, 04:07:23 pm »

:)  Don't you love how issues hide each other!  Thanks for digging into it.
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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #35 on: August 24, 2018, 10:11:09 pm »

Deleted
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jmone

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #36 on: August 25, 2018, 07:09:08 am »

FYI, the 20x0 cards do not have HDMI 2.1
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jwk246

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #37 on: August 25, 2018, 10:08:16 am »

Don't you just hate people who post incorrect information  :-[
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~OHM~

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #38 on: August 25, 2018, 12:23:24 pm »

Don't you just hate people who post incorrect information  :-[
it happens....just look to the American president... ;D
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jwk246

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #39 on: August 25, 2018, 01:34:32 pm »

Off topic, but on point. It would funny if I were not here in the US living through it. It's pathetic and an embarrassment.
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gonca

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #40 on: August 27, 2018, 08:11:07 pm »

Since the update to the latest x64 version I have been getting crashes when loading the index.bdmv from 4K movies.
It appears to be an issue with madvr
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TheShoe

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #41 on: August 27, 2018, 08:55:31 pm »

i am using it without issue, though i think i had to delete the java related files that are downloaded to support bluray menus.  this was with Deadpool 2.   it re-downloaded and all worked fine.  don’t exactly recall at this point but give it a try...

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gonca

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #42 on: August 28, 2018, 06:19:35 am »

I'll uninstall JRiver and re-install
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gonca

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #43 on: August 28, 2018, 07:12:04 am »

Re-installing and reverting to Red October HQ seems to have helped
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Hendrik

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #44 on: August 28, 2018, 07:22:01 am »

The LAV Video in your custom setup is severely out of date. I would strongly recommend to just use the version that ships with MC, especially with Blu-ray playback.
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gonca

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Re: NEW: Ultra HD Blu-ray Support
« Reply #45 on: August 28, 2018, 07:28:36 am »

The LAV Video in your custom setup is severely out of date. I would strongly recommend to just use the version that ships with MC, especially with Blu-ray playback.
I had some doubts about which LAV was being used, that is why I reverted to Red October HQ.
Keeps it all internal
I kept importing the settings from one version to the other, easier that way, and forgot that I was using an older LAV

Thank you for pointing me in the right direction
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