Topic: "Spinning up hard drive" - what does that mean? (Read 13987 times)

okvaal · « **on:** January 15, 2015, 03:05:41 pm »

I started getting this message in MC20 a few days ago, and it will frequently appear before playback begins.
So - I'd like to know what it means, as it is new to me. Please?

Awesome Donkey · « **Reply #1 on:** January 15, 2015, 03:18:49 pm »

In Windows if a hard drive hasn't been accessed for a while (45+ minutes, I believe) it'll 'turn off' the hard drive (stopping it from spinning) in an effort to prolong its overall life. When that message appears, the hard drive is being 'woken up' for use again. You can change/disable this feature in Windows' power options but I wouldn't recommend it unless you're using NAS-level HDD(s) that's approved for 24/7 use.

6233638 · « **Reply #2 on:** January 15, 2015, 03:45:40 pm »

I've noticed this a couple of times recently as well.
I think what they mean is "waiting for disk access" since I don't allow my drives to sleep.

It happens quite often if I'm set to use a low latency output (ASIO set to 64 samples or WASAPI set to 10ms for example) and click my "random" playlist a few times.

MusicBringer · « **Reply #3 on:** January 15, 2015, 04:42:54 pm »

Spinning up hard drive

Spinning up hard drive

Spinning up hard drive

I think this (error) message flashing up in front of my eyes is an irritating annoyance and I wish I could turn it off or hide it. Grrhh.

If my hard drive is being awoken from sleep then it's been accessed and playing all day while asleep.

I get a similar message flash up when MC is thinking about displaying a view. No, not the "Working" message. This view message pops up just like the Spinning up hard drive.

JimH · « **Reply #4 on:** January 15, 2015, 05:58:41 pm »

Could you post a picture? I'm not sure it's an MC message.

mwillems · « **Reply #5 on:** January 15, 2015, 06:45:07 pm »

I definitely have gotten the "spinning up" message in a JRIver-specific dialog box when I've got IO latency for some reason. It's not necessarily triggered by actual Hard drive latency, like 62 said it seems to be more about I/O latency.

For example my NAS doesn't allow the drives to spin down and I used to get the "spinning up" message on only one computer in my house whenever I tried to start playback. That PC had a wireless network conenction and was tucked under a desk, and no other computer in the house ever produced the "spinning up" message. I found it (and other network issues) irritating enough that I just hardwired the box in question to a gigabit switch and that fixed it, I haven't seen the message since.

So after checking to make sure your drives aren't spinning down, I'd suggest looking for other I/O problems.

JimH · « **Reply #6 on:** January 15, 2015, 06:59:49 pm »

Is it always when a NAS is in use?

glynor · « **Reply #7 on:** January 15, 2015, 07:39:39 pm »

I think Matt added it to explain otherwise frozen-UI when experiencing disk latency.

pahunt · « **Reply #8 on:** January 16, 2015, 06:12:31 am »

I've seen this message recently too and while I have no issue with it, I think it would be better to remove the word "hard" as I've noticed it most when it's spinning up my DVD drive and so the message can be slightly misleading.

Matt · « **Reply #9 on:** January 16, 2015, 08:02:20 am »

Quote from: pahunt on January 16, 2015, 06:12:31 am

I've seen this message recently too and while I have no issue with it, I think it would be better to remove the word "hard" as I've noticed it most when it's spinning up my DVD drive and so the message can be slightly misleading.

Good point.

Next build:
Changed: Switched 'Spinning up hard drive' to 'Spinning up drive' since it could have been a DVD drive, etc.

okvaal · « **Reply #10 on:** January 16, 2015, 08:05:08 am »

But why should my (empty) DVD drive start spinning immediately after opening MC? Anyway, as most seem to agree this is nothing to worry about, I'm quite content with the replies so far.

Matt · « **Reply #11 on:** January 16, 2015, 08:10:06 am »

Quote from: okvaal on January 16, 2015, 08:05:08 am

But why should my (empty) DVD drive start spinning immediately after opening MC?

It only shows that message if it's playing from the DVD drive. And if you're playing from it, it's pretty obvious why it needs to spin up!

JimH · « **Reply #12 on:** January 16, 2015, 09:08:22 am »

Quote from: Matt on January 16, 2015, 08:02:20 am

Good point.

Next build:
Changed: Switched 'Spinning up hard drive' to 'Spinning up drive' since it could have been a DVD drive, etc.

Is there a delay before the message is displayed? A few seconds (5 or 10?) without an error message seems reasonable. Maybe that isn't possible.

okvaal · « **Reply #13 on:** January 16, 2015, 09:12:09 am »

"It only shows that message if it's playing from the DVD drive." No, it doesn't. My DVD drive is empty/not in use. Either does it appear every time I start up MC. I just can't find any pattern when it appears and when it does not.

6233638 · « **Reply #14 on:** January 16, 2015, 09:19:13 am »

Unless MC is actually frozen while this is happening, I'd rather it was just silent about it, or perhaps displayed something in the main display at the top rather than a modal dialog.
It's one of those things where adding the dialog is an annoyance and makes things feel slower - even if they are not.

Matt · « **Reply #15 on:** January 16, 2015, 09:21:41 am »

Quote from: JimH on January 16, 2015, 09:08:22 am

Is there a delay before the message is displayed? A few seconds (5 or 10?) without an error message seems reasonable. Maybe that isn't possible.

It waits 100ms before showing anything.

Then it shows the dialog for the length of time it takes to get the drive working.

If the drive is connected and online, it'll never show anything.

JimH · « **Reply #16 on:** January 16, 2015, 10:27:40 am »

Could it wait for 5 or 10 seconds? That might reduce the confusion.

JimH · « **Reply #17 on:** January 16, 2015, 10:28:48 am »

Quote from: 6233638 on January 16, 2015, 09:19:13 am

Unless MC is actually frozen while this is happening, I'd rather it was just silent about it, or perhaps displayed something in the main display at the top rather than a modal dialog.

The problem with doing nothing is that users assume the program is hung and then some of them kill it.

Matt · « **Reply #18 on:** January 16, 2015, 10:44:05 am »

Quote from: JimH on January 16, 2015, 10:27:40 am

Could it wait for 5 or 10 seconds? That might reduce the confusion.

It only takes 3 or 4 seconds to spin the drive up. So that would effectively make the wait message pointless.

I think it's really nice personally. I've seen it a few times after my hard drive went to sleep at work and always think "oh, that's what it's doing." It's a good feeling. Much better than when the program hung unresponsive and gave no clue about what it was doing.

JimH · « **Reply #19 on:** January 16, 2015, 11:10:25 am »

How about a compromise of 2 seconds?

Matt · « **Reply #20 on:** January 16, 2015, 11:12:21 am »

Quote from: JimH on January 16, 2015, 11:10:25 am

How about a compromise of 2 seconds?

What are you hoping to accomplish?

It doesn't show now if the drive is already there.

So who cares what the delay is if it's going to show?

JimH · « **Reply #21 on:** January 16, 2015, 12:02:52 pm »

In my opinion, an error message isn't necessary if the delay is reasonably brief. 100 ms seems like a very low threshold.

We have another place in the program where it shows a 3d error message before the screen paints. It's not necessary, in my opinion.

glynor · « **Reply #22 on:** January 16, 2015, 01:12:16 pm »

Quote from: Matt on January 16, 2015, 11:12:21 am

What are you hoping to accomplish?

It doesn't show now if the drive is already there.

So who cares what the delay is if it's going to show?

For the record, I agree strongly with Matt here.

I understand that the message confused this user, but we've had years of people complaining about MC being "hung" for brief periods. Things like this (where it explains why it is stuck for a second) go a long way to easing that problem. It amounts to this:

Better to confuse people with a message, than to confuse them with unexplained hangs.

JimH · « **Reply #23 on:** January 16, 2015, 01:44:09 pm »

I don't think anyone would consider two seconds a hang.

glynor · « **Reply #24 on:** January 16, 2015, 01:58:51 pm »

Quote from: JimH on January 16, 2015, 01:44:09 pm

I don't think anyone would consider two seconds a hang.

That's plenty long for Windows to turn the UI white.

There have been threads.

6233638 · « **Reply #25 on:** January 16, 2015, 02:21:35 pm »

Isn't the default 5000ms?

Things may be different if you are trying to interact with it though. It feels like a couple of seconds might be a good solution, but if it's this or the UI completely freezing and Windows reporting that the app has frozen, I guess this is the better option.

Vincent Kars · « **Reply #26 on:** January 16, 2015, 03:06:36 pm »

I have this problem for a couple of weeks.
JRiver displays the message (spinning up) and everything is horrible slow.
BTW: I don't have any optical drive in my PC.

Unfortunately it is not a matter of spinning up a HD but a HD reported by Win as active while doing almost nothing.
I see latency of 10.000 ms while the I/O is marginal.
I'm afraid it is a Win 8.1 problem but nobody knows the solution.

Couple of examples:
http://superuser.com/questions/470334/extremely-high-disk-activity-without-any-real-usage
http://www.techspot.com/community/topics/unacceptably-high-disk-usage-performance-lag-windows-8.190289/

MusicBringer · « **Reply #27 on:** January 16, 2015, 05:04:36 pm »

I don't use DVD.
I don't use NAS.
I don't stream.
I don’t use Win 8.1

I am using Win 7x64.
I am working.
I use the PC as a work tool. MC is playing music.
In front of my eyes pops up this wretched message: Spinning up hard drive. Grrhh.

While I am working on the PC, what Hard Drive has gone to sleep and then starts Spinning up?
This Spinning up hard drive message is nonsense.

Spinning up hard drive.

Spinning up hard drive

Spinning up hard drive

It is soo annoying.

Get rid of it, please.

richard-ec2 · « **Reply #28 on:** March 19, 2015, 03:27:23 pm »

I'm getting this problem too. It's driving me nuts. Basically, in MC20, whenever you switch to another track from the one you're already playing, you get this message flashing up "Spinning up drive" (note, NOT "Spinning up hard drive"), even though your drive is already spinning. Often it flashes up all by itself when MC moves on from one track to the next. It happens whether I'm using the ASIO driver or in Direct Sound. I don't know how long it's been going on because I normally use JRemote on an iPad and of course you don't get it there. It's definitely a JRiver message. not a Windows message. (I'm in Windows 8.1.)

I'm not sure why it's so irritating. I guess because it's an alert that's designed to attract attention but it does so for no reason - what it says isn't true. In fact, it's very difficult to read it because it flashes up so quickly and it took me a long time to figure out what it was saying, which has the perverse effect of making it even more distracting!

I wish it would stop.

Matt · « **Reply #29 on:** March 19, 2015, 03:29:43 pm »

Quote from: richard-ec2 on March 19, 2015, 03:27:23 pm

I'm getting this problem too. It's driving me nuts. Basically, in MC20, whenever you switch to another track from the one you're already playing, you get this message flashing up "Spinning up drive" (note, NOT "Spinning up hard drive"), even though your drive is already spinning. Often it flashes up all by itself when MC moves on from one track to the next. It happens whether I'm using the ASIO driver or in Direct Sound. I don't know how long it's been going on because I normally use JRemote on an iPad and of course you don't get it there. It's definitely a JRiver message. not a Windows message. (I'm in Windows 8.1.)

I'm not sure why it's so irritating. I guess because it's an alert that's designed to attract attention but it does so for no reason - what it says isn't true. In fact, it's very difficult to read it because it flashes up so quickly and it took me a long time to figure out what it was saying, which has the perverse effect of making it even more distracting!

I wish it would stop.

We'll make the next build wait longer before showing the message.

Vincent Kars · « **Reply #30 on:** March 19, 2015, 04:04:13 pm »

Much appreciated
Might it be related to memory playback?

mojave · « **Reply #31 on:** March 19, 2015, 04:10:56 pm »

Quote from: Matt on March 19, 2015, 03:29:43 pm

We'll make the next build wait longer before showing the message.

Will this help with the flashing cover art issue, too? Instead of a "spinning up hard drive" I get flashing cover art between items in a video playlist. Maybe they don't use the same timer.

richard-ec2 · « **Reply #32 on:** March 19, 2015, 06:25:41 pm »

Quote from: Matt on March 19, 2015, 03:29:43 pm

We'll make the next build wait longer before showing the message.

Excellent news - thanks very much indeed.

spiggytopes · « **Reply #33 on:** March 20, 2015, 12:45:17 am »

May I suggest that the message dialogue is replaced with the spinning circle which we all are used to in Windows?

I see the please wait message more when playing bigger video files in succession.

MusicBringer · « **Reply #34 on:** March 20, 2015, 11:49:22 am »

Quote from: richard-ec2 on March 19, 2015, 03:27:23 pm

I'm getting this problem too. It's driving me nuts. I wish it would stop.

Quote from: mojave on March 19, 2015, 04:10:56 pm

Instead of a "spinning up hard drive" I get flashing cover art between items in a video playlist.

...and the "Updating View" message.

If the program spent more of its energy on actually updating the view it might have no need to annoy me, again and again and again, by telling me its doing what I told it to do.
These messages are soo **** annoying.
I do wish it would stop.
thanks,

paul.raulerson · « **Reply #35 on:** March 20, 2015, 12:27:51 pm »

Gish - I am surprised that people don't like that message. I am much happier when a computer tells me why it is acting like it is frozen than just mysteriously giving me the cold shoulder. A lot of UI interfaces these days use spinning circles or progress bars and such to indicate they are working.

I rather like the new message myself.

-Paul

JimH · « **Reply #36 on:** March 20, 2015, 12:34:07 pm »

Quote from: MusicBringer on March 20, 2015, 11:49:22 am

...and the "Updating View" message.

If the program spent more of its energy on actually updating the view it might have no need to annoy me, again and again and again, by telling me its doing what I told it to do.
These messages are soo **** annoying.
I do wish it would stop.
thanks,

Maybe you're ready for a faster system.

6233638 · « **Reply #37 on:** March 20, 2015, 12:53:29 pm »

Quote from: paul.raulerson on March 20, 2015, 12:27:51 pm

Gish - I am surprised that people don't like that message. I am much happier when a computer tells me why it is acting like it is frozen than just mysteriously giving me the cold shoulder. A lot of UI interfaces these days use spinning circles or progress bars and such to indicate they are working.
I rather like the new message myself.

Because modal dialogs are terrible.
Media Center has a tabbed interface which supports multiple split views.

OK, if you have to spin up the drive or update a view, keep doing that, but don't prevent me from using the rest of the program while it happens.

paul.raulerson · « **Reply #38 on:** March 20, 2015, 09:58:14 pm »

Quote from: 6233638 on March 20, 2015, 12:53:29 pm

Because modal dialogs are terrible.
Media Center has a tabbed interface which supports multiple split views.

OK, if you have to spin up the drive or update a view, keep doing that, but don't prevent me from using the rest of the program while it happens.

What do you plan to do for the few seconds it takes a drive to spin up? Have lunch?

Serioulsy, the Media Center interface is kinda primitive, especially on MacOS and Linux, but also on Windows. It works, and I tend to use JRemote more than anything else, so it isn't a big deal to me.

MusicBringer · « **Reply #39 on:** March 27, 2015, 08:48:29 am »

Quote from: Matt on March 19, 2015, 03:29:43 pm

We'll make the next build wait longer before showing the message.

20.0.86 (3/20/2015)

1. Fixed: MOV/MP4 files could have the wrong information in the Compression field.
2. Changed: Guide button on MCE remote control will also work if the Guide in Theater view is part of a custom group named "Television".
3. Fixed: JTV recordings with uncompressed audio or video would not play.
4. Fixed: JTV rcordings with JRiver Video Codec would not play.
5. Fixed: An 'e' in a string would get interpreted as the power of the number so that sorting S01E03 type inputs would be wacky.
6. Changed: The "Spinning up drive..." message only shows if it's taking longer than 1.5 seconds instead of 0.1 seconds.

thanks,

INTERACT FORUM

Author Topic: "Spinning up hard drive" - what does that mean? (Read 13987 times)