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[dlone]

This is starting to get silly

For all the bugs/problems reported thaere are so few answers back from JRiver

When you tell them about a problem, and give reproducable steps to show what the problem is you don't even get a "we'll look at it'

There's just no feedback at all - it's like shouting at a wall

I've read so many queries and error reports with no answer - please Jiver, could you at least say "we'll look at it'
Because at the moment there doesn't seem to be any reason to post bug reports if they aren't considered

My personal bugbear is the thumbnailing of videos - the multiple threads of extracting thumbnails just does not work with the amount of threads that MC uses - if I could lower the number of concurrent threads then all would be great

But
After posting here multiple times I've heard nothing
Honestly I'd be happy with "forget it we aren't going to change it"

It's the total absence of any kind of answer that is so infuriating
If you don't want to do it, just say no and then at least we'll have an answer - we may not like it, but at least we would know
This hanging around, posting bug reports and getting no feedback makes me wonder if it is even worth reporting problems


but
some things you do get on straight away, so I'm confused
it looks like (from the outside) that there are a few people you accept bug reports and that you just ignore reports from people whoe are not 'on the list'

[John Gateley]

We spend a lot of time on interact, though most of it is reading, not posting. The more time we spend posting, the less time we spend developing.

Some things have higher priority, some have lower. I'm not sure where the video thumbnail issue falls.

Have patience, feel free to repeat your post (just do a *bump*) and we'll eventually get to it or say "we're not going to do that", one of the two.

j

[sherbs]

dlone, you got my sympathy, been there myself. I tend not to post problems unless I'm desperate anymore, too frustrating.

Good luck!

[John Gateley]

Sherbs, even though it is frustrating, please do post. Even when we don't answer, we do read them and the more people who mention an issue means the more chance we'll look at it sooner.

j

[dlone]

Sorry to sound so negative - I really do love this program

But so many reports are unanswered - even an 'ok but it's our lowest priority' would help
Please, answer the reports even with 'not yet, maybe later' at least
When you don't give any kind of reply at all, it feels like there's no reason to post bug reports - and after all, we're trying to help you

Honestly - every time I've posted with a problem there's been no answer apart from other users
And I see the same repeated over and over apart from a few users (forums admins etc)

The rest of us do have valid points but we get totally ignored, and that's what is so frustrating
There's no feedback from you guys on our problems and how would you react to a forum that never answered your questions?
If the answer is "Maybe later" or even "we don't care just yet", that would be better that absolutely nothing


I know you guys are busy doing something else, but but you please give a "yes/no/maybe later/not a chance to the posts" here?

I'm really not trying to be awkward, or implying you are ignoring us on purpose
Athe moment there really doesn't seem to be any reason to let you know how we feel or what whe would like
Any kind of answer would be good - being completely ignored doesn't inspire much loyalty

[dlone]

Yes, It's not a problem with you guys fixing MC, but a non-comunication problem

you guys may have taken the information on board, but unless we get some kind of feedback we don't know it we may have been shouting out of the window
after a while, getting no reply at all means "Why bother"

[cncb]

Sorry, dlone.  I got fairly upset about this before but you need to get used to it - that's the way this forum works.  They mainly rely on other users to answer questions.  Unfortunately you only seem to get an "official" response if you are particularly obnoxious (and no I'm not insulting any other forum members).

[dlone]

Yeah - it does seem to look like if "you aint on the list" forget you

[Chan Kong-sang]

http://mods.simplemachines.org/index.php?mod=7

That could help maybe, if you work on a problem make it solved or change the "solved" button with a "in work" or "noted" button.

[hit_ny]

Way it works here, is the forum acts as a sorter. Evveryone's free to post. The more replies it gets, the faster it rises to the top. When they have time, they look at the ones ppl are most excitable about.

a self-sorting system.

Many ppl have been in your shoes including myself.

Now as you say, being obnoxious is a way of gaming the system but i think its not very effective in the long run. Threads get locked, ppl get bitter, your request is still outstanding.

They prefer if the bug reports come in thick & heavy when they are working on the build you are using. Otherise they are working on the next version and if it isn't drop dead critical, you would be quite lucky.

[Magic_Randy]

Interesting thread, but I think the fundamental problem is unrealistic expectations.

I’ve been using the MC products for years.  Whenever I have a ‘real’ problem, I always get help.  Sometimes from J River, sometimes by other users, but help always comes my way.

If I post a problem that is just a ‘bug’ or an ‘idea’ (e.g. enhancement) I expect them to read it and consider it for the future, but I do not expect an immediate personal reply, nor do I expect an immediate software change.  The exception is a critical bug – but I’m very happy with the turnaround on those types of issues.

All software has bugs – all software could use enhancements – except obsolete software.

Keep up the good work…

Randy

[KingSparta]

many good comments.

a few years ago you would get more comments from J river be it JimH who is normally in the forum many times a day.

some of the people at j river are never in the forum

I do think comments directly from j river have slowed thru the years

I do think most of questions get answered in one way or another

it would be nice to know your comments have not fallen on death ears however.

[JimH]

it would be nice to know your comments have not fallen on death ears however.

Yes.

[britade]

I can see both sides of the discussion.  It takes a lot of time and effort to read and reply to posts in forums - I seem to lose hours in forums without noticing the time pass.

Provided the issues get worked on and MC continues to be developed then I'm happy for the developers to spend their time coding - provided they keep one eye on the feedback on the forum.

I've been using MC for many years now and have been very pleased with the speed with which the application develops.  The incremental builds are constantly being released to fix issues and implement new features - which is better than most software.

The fact that other users are happy to pitch in and help out on the forums is a good thing - It shows we're a friendly bunch after all.

[KingSparta]

Yes.

See They Do Read The Forum.

Does MusicMatch, Yahoo Jukebox, Real, Apple Have A Forum? (I have not looked recently).

I am wondering how they communicate with there users.

When i was beta testing years ago Real Jukebox 1, and 2 and music match they did not answer most, if any of there testers.

I recently asked a question of MusicMatch (Yahoo owned) i got an answer but it took 2 days for them to reply to my request for my license information.

they never did find my information even giving them all my information. I did find it on my own however.

I think for the most part this forum works if you give it time, normally you will get an answer from someone.

If not you can always bump it up

You just might not get a answer from j river. sometimes this is due to, they do not want to promise any options because they often will not live it down (someone will say "remember you said on such and such date"). sometimes they don't know the answer. They have other projects in the works for other companies. Or Jim is flying his plane over Some airport doing approaches and touch and gos.

I think gately was more active in the forums when he had his WebCam on so jim could see if he was working or not.

[RobOK]

Does MusicMatch, Yahoo Jukebox, Real, Apple Have A Forum? (I have not looked recently).

I think this is the key.  I try to look at it that J River's participation here is much better than for any other software I own.

Everyone gets frustrated -- the software does SOOOO much, it seems, why can't it just do this one extra thing for me, it shouldn't be hard for the developers to tweak this one feature or fix this small bug.

But over time more features get added, more tweaks made and more bugs fixed.  (And some new bugs introduced).

[ohohyodasoda]

I must agree!  JRiver does an outstanding job of supporting their product.  It must be a huge job trying to track down solutions to the many bugs that are reported. 

All in all, I have been very happy with this software.  It does a DYNE-0-MITE job at keeping my music library organized.  I don't use it for anything else, but in the area of Music, MC is the KING!

[cncb]

The point is that this is it for support.  You can't send them an email so they have to have some presence here or there would be no support at all.  So I wouldn't pat them on the back for spending a little time here.  No reply to bug reports is essentially getting no support for a product you payed for.  And tracking down and fixing bugs is one of the jobs of a software company so don't act like this is an extra burden they are taking on...

[Two Wire]

I am wondering how they communicate with there users.

I can tell you MusicMatch initially uses an automated reply system. Many time times I have asked a question, only to be answered by an automated system which searches for key words - giving me an answer having no relation to the question I asked. This goes on for several days until finally I reach a live person, only to tell me something I already have tried. They won't consider the fact their program may have have a bug. This is one major reason I switched to MC. The forum members are very knowledgeable and eager to help.

[hit_ny]

Reasons these otherplayers dont need forums is they dont specilaise in the program, some give it out for free, so no one bothers much to support a free product.

Musicmatch probably has tie-ins with media companies so i bet they make the bulk of thier income from there.

[GHammer]

I don't pay attention as long as my questions are answered.

[dlone]

Lots of interesting points you all make

Glad to see you all looked at it seriously and it didn't get into a flame war - seen that happen too many times on other forums 

The trouble with fixing bugs just by the number of posts is that you
1)miss uncommon problems where people have found the answer and told you exactly how to fix it
2)miss a single post solution to problems that have a lot of posts in other threads
With these two types, nobody replies because the answers given - so, there's no reason to post

I've done a few of these - some have taken me several hours to track down and work out reproducable steps (just for info I do beta testing for a few products and know how important exact information is)
It's only because we love the program and team so much that we do this 

Just a one word reply would let us know that we havn't been wasting our time

If it was me (and thank god it's not - I couldn't cope with all these threads!!) I'd have a 'To-Do' thread similar to the "latest version of MC" thread you already have so people could at least see that you had read their problem and also see if there were other problems that they had that had already been reported

Thanks for all the thought on this peeps