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[Magic_Randy]

I want to Re-Rip my library to upgrade the bitrate, but I do not want to lose current library info including:
1) Lyrics
2) Cover Art
3) Playlists
4) Stats (last played...)

I created a small workflow based on the following:
0) I created a new library for Re-Ripping (called Re-Ripping) and turned off auto import

1) I move all of the files for an album out of the current folder into a temp re-ripping folder (I do not do this from MC)
2) In MC I switch libraries to my Re-Ripping Library
3) I Re-Rip the album
4) I switch the library back to my default library
5) I select all the tracks for the Album and use the library tools to Update Tags (From Library)
6) With all the tracks still selected for the Album, I  use the library tools to Update Library (From Tags) - this fixes the bitrate in the library
7) If everything is OK, I delete the original files from step 1 and clear the Re-Ripping Library

Question:

Is there a better way to do this? This is a lot of steps.



EDIT: This is the process I'm settling on:

1) Turn off auto-import
2) Re-Rip to a temp location, using [Disc #]-[track #] convention as the outgoing files
3) Delete the freshly ripped files from the library
4) Select the album in MC, Rename old files to [Disc #]-[track #] convention
5) Use windows explorer to replace the old files with the new
6) Select the album in MC, do an Update tags from library
7) Select the album in MC, do an Update library from tags
Select the album in MC, Rename files back to the convention you use
9) Turn auto import back on.

Note: I'm using a 2nd library for the re-ripping.
        I repeat step 2 multiple times to re-rip a batch of albums before proceeding to the next steps
        I do step 9 to turn auto import back on after I complete re-ripping & updating a batch of albums
        I added a step to clear all of the cover art after step 2.

[marko]

If it were me:

1) Turn off auto-import
2) Re-Rip to a temp location, using the same filenaming convention as the outgoing files
3) Delete the freshly ripped files from the library
4) Use windows explorer to replace the old files with the new
5) Select the album in MC, do an Update tags from library followed by an update library from tags.
6) Turn auto import back on.

Or

1) Re-rip files to a location and filename easily accessed via the rename from properties tool
2) Delete freshly ripped files from the library
3) Select the old files and open the rename, move and copy files tool
4) Set the top function to "update library to point to a new location (no move or copy)
5) Apply directory and filename rules that will point MC to your freshly ripped files and hit OK
6) Do update tags from library followed by update library from tags
7) Delete the old files
8) Use the rename from properties tool to move the new files back to where the old ones were.

I wouldn't use the second method as it's too hard, for me at least, to track mentally... I just know that old files would be bound to get forgotten about somewhere!!

If you want to change format, say, replace mp3 with flac rips, follow the first set of steps, but before doing the replace with explorer, use MC to do a find and replace on the filename field using "replace .mp3 with .flac"
Then replace the files using explorer and do the update tags shuffle. Works a treat.
Remember though, turning off auto-import is critical. If you forget, then MC will pick up the new files as "external changes" and begin updating the library accordingly. You wouldn't want that :)

I'm not sure that the first set of steps is "the best way" overall, just that it's the best way for me, and once you've done a couple and familiarised yourself with the steps, it really takes no time at all.
That "update library to point to a new location" option should, on the face of it, have made this job easier, but in practice, I've found that not to be the case at all. Where that option excels is when you've moved your files, for example, to a new drive, and need a wholesale library update without losing precious statistical library info.

-marko.

[mark_h]

This question gets asked frequently enough that there should be a Wiki FAQ entry?

Mark

[Mr ChriZ]

What would be nice is if MC offered the option to replace files but maintain tags/data.

[JimH]

This question gets asked frequently enough that there should be a Wiki FAQ entry?

Mark

The wiki can be edited by anyone.  Thanks for volunteering. 

[mark_h]

Jim, good point, and I have a Wiki registration somewhere, however, I don't feel qualified enough on this topic to make the entry.

Mark

[JimH]

Jim, good point, and I have a Wiki registration somewhere, however, I don't feel qualified enough on this topic to make the entry.

Mark

You could just add a link to this thread.  There are other examples you could use as a prototype.

[Magic_Randy]

marko,

Thanks for the tips.  I'll give your process a try.

BTW: I had already turned off auto-import. As you mention, this is a key point.

Randy

[mark_h]

I've just run through this converting an existing mp3 into a flac format to verify the steps (based on Marko's steps). I'll now have a stab at a wiki entry.

Mark

[mark_h]

http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index.php/Re-Rip_and_preserve_tags

Please let me know if there are errors or just go ahead and edit the page.

Mark

[JimH]

Thanks, Mark.

[Alex B]

In addition it is possible to rename the old files with filenames that contain only the track numbers. The re-ripped files will automatically have exactly the same filenames when the same naming rule is used. Later on the new files can be renamed using the standard library tools.

This has been discussed at least in the following threads:

http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=46869
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=41219
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=26977

[mark_h]

Alex, if I understand correctly this would add complexity to the steps I outlined?  Why bother with the interim track# renames and temporary directories when you can rename directly to the correct target directory and then simply replace the old files with the new files and do the tag updates?

Cheers,

Mark

[Alex B]

Did you read the linked threads?

Most likely many of the filenames would not be exactly identical when the info comes from the online database. You would need the compare the names one by one.

If the track names are like "01.xxx, 02.xxx, 03.xxx, etc" they will automatically match (excluding the possibly changed filename extension). You would not need to query online data or manually tag the new files at all.

[mark_h]

Did you read the linked threads?

No, just your summary 

Most likely many of the filenames would not be exactly identical when the info comes from the online database. You would need the compare the names one by one.

I see...  Good point.  I suppose I am assuming the same ripping system is used for both rips and the [album][name] data is likely to match.

If the tracks names are like "01.xxx, 02.xxx, 03.xxx, etc" they will automatically match (excluding the the possibly changed filename extension). You would not need to query online data or manually tag the new files at all.

Yup.  The downside here is that the complexity is then moved to the ripping stage instead as options need to be changed to the ripper to output track# only filenames.

You should add your method to the wiki page as an alternative approach and users can choose which is more appropriate for their needs.

Mark

[Alex B]

FEATURE REQUEST

A tool that would automate re-ripping process would be most welcomed. You would just need to select the files that are going to be replaced and start a "re-rip" tool.

MC would re-rip the files from the inserted CD in case the track numbers and the total number of the files match. It would preserve all old library data including the original import date. It would replace only the file format specific fields and the filename extensions.

EDIT

The user interface could be very simple. It could have only an option for the file format and the ripping settings. It should issue a warning about backing up the old files. MC cannot possibly know if the CD is still in a good condition.

[Magic_Randy]

Alex B,

Thanks for pointing out this tip. While it adds steps, it reduces the manual effort. In preparation for the task, I've been re-ripping CDs that I had previously ripped with MC. I do not consistently get the same song name, so the files have to be manually compared to make it work. This should resolve that problem.

[Magic_Randy]

FEATURE REQUEST

An tool that would automate re-ripping process would be most welcomed. You would just need to select the files that are going to be replaced and start a "re-rip" tool.

MC would re-rip the files from the inserted CD in case the track numbers and the total number of the files match. It would preserve all old library data including the original import date. It would replace only the file format specific fields and the filename extensions.

This would be a great feature.

[mark_h]

FEATURE REQUEST

An tool that would automate re-ripping process would be most welcomed. You would just need to select the files that are going to be replaced and start a "re-rip" tool.

MC would re-rip the files from the inserted CD in case the track numbers and the total number of the files match. It would preserve all old library data including the original import date. It would replace only the file format specific fields and the filename extensions.

Great idea, but I would request the additional option to "Import and replace" as I don't rip inside MC.  Same principle though, just highlight files to replace and then import from a specific location.

Mark

[marko]

4. Re-rip your tracks and ensure they replace the original files

I'm 99% certain that it's not possible to do this when ripping with MC. If the file exists, MC will create a "file (1).mp3" and there's no way to control the behaviour.
That's why my steps say to rip to a temp location then replace the files using an external file manager.

Perhaps someone has the time to test, or knows for sure, and could update the wiki page if necessary?

-marko.

[mark_h]

I'm 99% certain that it's not possible to do this when ripping with MC. If the file exists, MC will create a "file (1).mp3" and there's no way to control the behaviour.
That's why my steps say to rip to a temp location then replace the files using an external file manager.

Perhaps someone has the time to test, or knows for sure, and could update the wiki page if necessary?

-marko.

Hmm.  I do all my ripping outside of MC, so I guess what I documented works for me   I'll update the page to note that.  I don't want to get bogged down with wiki-editing so all feel free to join in!

Mark.

[mark_h]

I've added an extra step to the guide to cover ripping within MC.

Mark

[Magic_Randy]

I'm 99% certain that it's not possible to do this when ripping with MC. If the file exists, MC will create a "file (1).mp3" and there's no way to control the behaviour.
That's why my steps say to rip to a temp location then replace the files using an external file manager.

Perhaps someone has the time to test, or knows for sure, and could update the wiki page if necessary?

-marko.

marko,

I think if you use the advanced CD ripping option you can achieve this.

CD & DVD-->CD Ripping-->Advanced Ripping Options-->File Management-->Overwrite existing files that have the same name

[mark_h]

marko,

I think if you use the advanced CD ripping option you can achieve this.

CD & DVD-->CD Ripping-->Advanced Ripping Options-->File Management-->Overwrite existing files that have the same name

Hmm, very interesting.  I wonder what MC does with the tags at that point?  Propagate to the new file or remove the old entry and replace it with the new file...?

If tags are preserved, this is the simplest method of re-ripping same formats...

I'll try to test this later but am knee deep in musicbrainz tagging right now.

Mark

[Alex B]

The "Overwrite existing files that have the same name" setting in "Advanced ripping options > File management" works.

However, it replaces library data with new data, it does not work when the new file format is different and it cannot detect minor differences in the filename - the old filename and the new filename need to match exactly.

[marko]

confirmed

I used the options search bar to look for "existing" and it came up empty. Seems the search system doesn't parse those secondary option dialogues...
mark_h, I've updated the wiki page, because, as Alex has pointed out, if ripping with MC and replacing files, MC may not preserve the old library data.

-marko.

[mark_h]

mark_h, I've updated the wiki page, because, as Alex has pointed out, if ripping with MC and replacing files, MC may not preserve the old library data.

Thanks, Marko.

[Magic_Randy]

However, it replaces library data with new data, it does not work when the new file format is different and it cannot detect minor differences in the filename - the old filename and the new filename need to match exactly.

If you use a second library for the re-rip you are OK. You can then switch libraries back to update tags  - but the filename must match exactly.

[rjm]

FEATURE REQUEST

A tool that would automate re-ripping process would be most welcomed. You would just need to select the files that are going to be replaced and start a "re-rip" tool.

MC would re-rip the files from the inserted CD in case the track numbers and the total number of the files match. It would preserve all old library data including the original import date. It would replace only the file format specific fields and the filename extensions.

EDIT

The user interface could be very simple. It could have only an option for the file format and the ripping settings. It should issue a warning about backing up the old files. MC cannot possibly know if the CD is still in a good condition.

This has been requested many times and would be a fantastic addition.

A related feature that should also be added is the ability to quickly move online files offline and vice versa. I frequently move online content offline to dvd-r and want to maintain the tags. This is a real pain because the files must be reimported and all tags reentered. A cheap way to implement this would be to allow us to edit the Offline and Volume Name fields.

[marko]

A related feature that should also be added is the ability to quickly move online files offline and vice versa. I frequently move online content offline to dvd-r and want to maintain the tags. This is a real pain because the files must be reimported and all tags reentered. A cheap way to implement this would be to allow us to edit the Offline and Volume Name fields.

You know that MC keeps a catalogue of offline files?
You can list them, and manipulate the tags, though naturally, the data can only be held in the MC database.

Try the attached file for an example. Extract the enclosed file to ...\Media Center 13\Data\Saved Views\
Then, from MC, choose "add library view"

-marko

[rjm]

You know that MC keeps a catalogue of offline files?
You can list them, and manipulate the tags, though naturally, the data can only be held in the MC database.

Try the attached file for an example. Extract the enclosed file to ...\Media Center 13\Data\Saved Views\
Then, from MC, choose "add library view"

-marko

Thanks for the tip Marko.

Sorry I was not clearer. I make heavy use of MC to track the content of offline media stored on DVD-R and CD-R. It works beautifully and allows me to rely on MC to manage all of my media, not just the media stored on my hard drive.

The only problem is that it is a pain to change the location of media from online to offline or vice versa.
As far as I can tell the only fields that change in this operation are Offline (which toggles between 0 and 1) and Volume Name which changes between a hard drive letter and the volume label of the optical disc. Unfortunately it is not possible to edit either of these fields which means all tags must be reenterred and thumbnails must be rebuilt when switching between online and offline.

So why do I want this? I manage about 4 TB of hard drive content with MC and my drives are full. I have decided for a variety of reasons not to increase my drive space until 2+ TB drives are cheap.  This means that when I get new content that I want online I have to move something else offline. It would be great if this operation was quick and friendly. For example, burn the files to DVD-R and tell MC that the location has changed. As it currently stands, I groan and waste about 10 minutes for every new optical disc.

[Magic_Randy]

Should you re-analyze audio after doing the processes described in this thread?

I do the analyze audio as part of the rip, but I'm not sure if the results are stored in the library. If they are, using the processes described in this thread may not be keeping the new analyze results.

[mark_h]

It would make sense, you need to clear the replay gain tag to do so.

Mark

[Alex B]

Should you re-analyze audio after doing the processes described in this thread?

I do the analyze audio as part of the rip, but I'm not sure if the results are stored in the library. If they are, using the processes described in this thread may not be keeping the new analyze results.

They are always stored in the library and by default also in the file tags.

If you are anal-retentive about storing only exactly correct numbers, then yes, you should analyze the new files in a way or another (assuming you are switching from a lossy format to losslesss or between two different lossy quality settings). It might be easiest to not analyze the files during ripping and run the analyzer separately after the new files are in place.

However, the difference between e.g. a typical high bitrate lossy format and lossless source is mostly academic. The peak values are usually slightly smaller in lossless, but the replay gain values are almost identical.

[dcwebman]

Sorry I was not clearer. I make heavy use of MC to track the content of offline media stored on DVD-R and CD-R. It works beautifully and allows me to rely on MC to manage all of my media, not just the media stored on my hard drive.

The only problem is that it is a pain to change the location of media from online to offline or vice versa.

rjm, you're not the only one that would like an easier way to do this. I have a bunch of stuff that I would like to move offline because I don't listen to them often and don't want to go through the re-rip process of all. At the moment I'm keeping them online because I have hard drive space but that means backups take longer too. It would be nice to get them offline.

[Magic_Randy]

They are always stored in the library and by default also in the file tags.

If you are anal-retentive about storing only exactly correct numbers, then yes, you should analyze the new files in a way or another (assuming you are switching from a lossy format to losslesss or between two different lossy quality settings). It might be easiest to not analyze the files during ripping and run the analyzer separately after the new files are in place.

However, the difference between e.g. a typical high bitrate lossy format and lossless source is mostly academic. The peak values are usually slightly smaller in lossless, but the replay gain values are almost identical.

Thanks...

I'll re-analyze everything after I've completed re-ripping the entire library.

[rjm]

rjm, you're not the only one that would like an easier way to do this. I have a bunch of stuff that I would like to move offline because I don't listen to them often and don't want to go through the re-rip process of all. At the moment I'm keeping them online because I have hard drive space but that means backups take longer too. It would be nice to get them offline.

I introduced some unnecessary confusion in the above discussion. On my system I have changed the display name of the field Removeable to Offline. So everywhere above that I say Offline please read Removeable.

Also sorry to Magic_Randy for hijacking his thread. I'll shut up now.

[Magic_Randy]

I'm out of town now, but will be back to my re-ripping project this weekend. I will finalize my workflow and provide an update to this thread for anyone that is interested.

What I've learned so far:

1) MC has the capability necessary to achieve this while preserving all of the valuable data in the library.
2) Every time I try to shrink the steps, I find that the longest path between 2 points is a short cut. I always end up having to do detail reviews of each CD I re-rip due to; not 100% match in track name, or not 100% match in album name. Example, I tried various workflows that overwrote existing files, but there are usually problems that have to be reviewed for and corrected.
3) The most fail safe approach is to use the technique of renaming files based on track number in a temp folder and copying them back to the final destination folder. This is the approach suggested by Alex B.
4) A problem I ran in with Alex B's suggestion is Disc #. I use Disc# with the same album name for all multi-disc CDs. I think I can do my re-naming based on Disc# and Track# instead of just Track#. I will finalize that process this weekend. That would solve this issue.

Thanks for all the help and suggestions, this is going to be a big project (well over 1000 albums) so I want to fix the process in advance.

BTW: I really like Alex B's enhancement suggestion for re-ripping (earlier in this thread). This may appear simplistic, but a simple solution in MC would make this process much more efficient. And sometimes a simple solution is best. If it does show up, I will test it (1000+ times).

[Magic_Randy]

This is the process I'm settling on:

1) Turn off auto-import
2) Re-Rip to a temp location, using [Disc #]-[track #] convention as the outgoing files
3) Delete the freshly ripped files from the library
4) Select the album in MC, Rename old files to [Disc #]-[track #] convention
5) Use windows explorer to replace the old files with the new
6) Select the album in MC, do an Update tags from library
7) Select the album in MC, do an Update library from tags
Select the album in MC, Rename files back to the convention you use
9) Turn auto import back on.

Note: I'm using a 2nd library for the re-ripping.
        I repeat step 2 multiple times to re-rip a batch of albums before proceeding to the next steps

[Alex B]

Great, now the JRiver guys can follow these steps when they design the new re-rip tool. 

BTW, did you remember to select the secure ripping mode? Here's an old thread where its importance was discussed:
Topic: How can I ensure quality of a ripped music file

Also, you can load two instances of MC13 with different libraries so that you don't need to switch between the libraries all the time (Tools > Options > General > Advanced > Allow multiple instances to run at one time). The step number three is also unnecessary. You can simply trash the ripping library after you have finished.

[Magic_Randy]

Great, now the JRiver guys can follow these steps when they design the new re-rip tool. 

BTW, did you remember to select the secure ripping mode? Here's an old thread where its importance was discussed:
Topic: How can I ensure quality of a ripped music file

Also, you can load two instances of MC13 with different libraries so that you don't need to switch between the libraries all the time (Tools > Options > General > Advanced > Allow multiple instances to run at one time). The step number three is also unnecessary. You can simply trash the ripping library after you have finished.

Thanks Alex B....

I'm using secure ripping mode. I agree this is very important.

Good tip on running multiple instances. I'll try it that way.

On step 3, I just clear the entire re-ripping library after I do a batch of albums. I thought that was too confusing for some of the people reading the thread so I did not get specific on how I do it.

[rjm]

Your process looks optimal to me.

Correct me if I am wrong, but for someone that wishes to rip to an alternate format (eg. mp3 to flac) this will not work.

I really think "re-rip" is a core function that JRiver should add to the product.

[edit]

It appears to me that the hooks are already present in the software because the Convert function does a beautiful job of maintaining all tags. So it should not be a lot of work to add re-rip.

[Alex B]

Correct me if I am wrong, but for someone that wishes to rip to an alternate format (eg. mp3 to flac) this will not work.

Step 4.1

Tool: Find and Replace
- Tick only the "Filename (name)" field
- Find what: .mp3
- Replace: .flac

[rjm]

Thanks, did not know it was possible to manipulate the file extension.

[Alex B]

The MP3 files will be incorrectly named for a moment. Fortunately MC is not programmed to prevent the "illegal" filename extension change.

[benn600]

I want to Re-Rip my library to upgrade the bitrate, but I do not want to lose current library info including:

Everyone should listen to this thread.  Notice what is kicking this off?  How about we make a rule that everyone use lossless from now on to avoid these painful resulting issues.

[Alex B]

Everyone should listen to this thread.  Notice what is kicking this off?  How about we make a rule that everyone use lossless from now on to avoid these painful resulting issues.

I constantly do some of the steps mentioned in this thread when I replace lossless files with lossy files. 

Usually I have my latest ripped CDs in the library in a lossless format for some time while I finalize tagging and scan the complete art sets including the back covers, booklets, etc. Eventually I convert most of them to a high quality lossy format. Since I have the fully tagged lossless files in the archive I can always re-encode new versions with different codecs or settings or start using the lossless files.

[darichman]

Everyone should listen to this thread.  Notice what is kicking this off?  How about we make a rule that everyone use lossless from now on to avoid these painful resulting issues.

Very very good point

[Gl3nn]

Great, now the JRiver guys can follow these steps when they design the new re-rip tool. 

BTW, did you remember to select the secure ripping mode? Here's an old thread where its importance was discussed:
Topic: How can I ensure quality of a ripped music file

Very interesting thread.  Thanks!

[Magic_Randy]

3,635 tracks completed. 

Still a long way to go but the workflow described earlier does work.