Topic: JRiver Id Questions? (Read 414005 times)

bob · « **Reply #1000 on:** January 18, 2019, 07:48:46 am »

Quote from: michaelmd on January 18, 2019, 06:18:51 am

Id NUC 5 mostly problem free but keeps dropping USB connection to DAC for no obvious reason. Can run 'audio device' from hw: and front: but drop outs occur on both. Sometimes will play for hours with no problem, sometimes 20 minutes. Any thoughts?

Try a different port or cable. The rear ports have more power IIRC.

mdooney@gmail.com · « **Reply #1001 on:** January 19, 2019, 10:12:23 am »

Tried that. It looks as if it tends to happen when I switch a track. Sometimes the connection can be re-established by simply unplugging the USB and putting it back in. Sometimes only a complete shutdown and restart solves it.

bob · « **Reply #1002 on:** January 21, 2019, 09:41:16 am »

Quote from: michaelmd on January 19, 2019, 10:12:23 am

Tried that. It looks as if it tends to happen when I switch a track. Sometimes the connection can be re-established by simply unplugging the USB and putting it back in. Sometimes only a complete shutdown and restart solves it.

Interesting.
What I'd try next would be a different USB cable, then if still no luck, inserting a USB hub into the picture.

mdooney@gmail.com · « **Reply #1003 on:** January 22, 2019, 05:46:47 am »

tried a different cable - same issue.

What's the thinking on the USB hub - presumably linking NUC usb output via hub to Benchmark DAC input...

bob · « **Reply #1004 on:** January 22, 2019, 08:32:49 am »

Quote from: michaelmd on January 22, 2019, 05:46:47 am

tried a different cable - same issue.

What's the thinking on the USB hub - presumably linking NUC usb output via hub to Benchmark DAC input...

Just that the inserting the hub into the chain changes how the controller on the NUC talks to the DAC.
There is still a bit of black magic in the USB world.

clpetersen · « **Reply #1005 on:** January 23, 2019, 10:22:52 am »

Interested in setting the Id as part of music system. Ideally headless for daily use, touchscreen control, USB or Coax connection to outboard DAC, music on a NAS.
Experienced with JRiver on Mac; using now to manage the library and Sonos as the renderer.

So, are there any good threads/wikis/instructions/ on how to set this up? Not seeing anything very direct on the forums.

Thanks!

BradATIMA · « **Reply #1006 on:** January 24, 2019, 09:16:06 am »

Quote from: clpetersen on January 23, 2019, 10:22:52 am

Interested in setting the Id as part of music system. Ideally headless for daily use, touchscreen control, USB or Coax connection to outboard DAC, music on a NAS.
Experienced with JRiver on Mac; using now to manage the library and Sonos as the renderer.

So, are there any good threads/wikis/instructions/ on how to set this up? Not seeing anything very direct on the forums.

Thanks!

You can find some information on the wiki here: https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Id_Install_Guide
There is some information about mounting a NAS here: https://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php/topic,95376.msg657083.html#msg657083

The Id is mostly ready to go when it arrives, aside from connecting it and some configuring. You'll either need to have a monitor connected to it and boot the Id in GUI mode or connect to it remotely to do the Media Center configuration, like choosing the audio device and setting output options in DSP studio. Because you're using a USB DAC, when selecting the audio device, you will likely see multiple instances of the DAC in the device list. You may need to try multiple options to find the right one, but you probably want to start with options that begin with 'hw:' which lets the DAC handle the conversion.

mdooney@gmail.com · « **Reply #1007 on:** January 24, 2019, 12:40:02 pm »

Bob: I've tried changing cables and I'm now trying via a usb hub - I'll let you know how I get on. But I also had another RTFM moment and the Benchmark talks about setting up usb 1.1 or 2.0 and how it's been tested for compatibility with Windows and Mac - no mention of Linux. Windows requires drivers for 2.0, Mac works out of the box. Could this be the source of the problem........

bob · « **Reply #1008 on:** January 24, 2019, 02:08:34 pm »

Quote from: michaelmd on January 24, 2019, 12:40:02 pm

Bob: I've tried changing cables and I'm now trying via a usb hub - I'll let you know how I get on. But I also had another RTFM moment and the Benchmark talks about setting up usb 1.1 or 2.0 and how it's been tested for compatibility with Windows and Mac - no mention of Linux. Windows requires drivers for 2.0, Mac works out of the box. Could this be the source of the problem........

Most of them just work out of the box with no drivers on linux.
Can you run function 10 on the Id menu (show audio information) take a pic and attach it here please?

mdooney@gmail.com · « **Reply #1009 on:** January 24, 2019, 02:16:20 pm »

screenshot attached. Also heard back from Benchmark that they've not encountered any issues using NUC with their DAC.

bob · « **Reply #1010 on:** January 24, 2019, 02:32:54 pm »

Quote from: michaelmd on January 24, 2019, 02:16:20 pm

screenshot attached. Also heard back from Benchmark that they've not encountered any issues using NUC with their DAC.

That looks good.
I'm starting to run out of ideas.
From your previous messages I see you tried front: and hw: devices which is correct.
Is it possible there is a device power issue?
Does the DAC have a separate power input?
If not perhaps there is an issue with your NUC PS?
Do you have auto-import running with an external drive connected? If so can you remove that import path temporarily to see if that makes a difference?

mdooney@gmail.com · « **Reply #1011 on:** January 24, 2019, 02:59:23 pm »

The DAC has its own power supply - it works as a preamp.
I've got the 2TB version of the NUC, using internal media for playback.
I can play from other drives to the NUC via the network and can play from the NUC to other devices elsewhere on the network. It's just the local playback from Id to DAC that seems to be an issue.
Auto import never set.

bob · « **Reply #1012 on:** January 24, 2019, 03:38:15 pm »

Quote from: michaelmd on January 24, 2019, 02:59:23 pm

The DAC has its own power supply - it works as a preamp.
I've got the 2TB version of the NUC, using internal media for playback.
I can play from other drives to the NUC via the network and can play from the NUC to other devices elsewhere on the network. It's just the local playback from Id to DAC that seems to be an issue.
Auto import never set.

Ok, for comparison, can you try playing the same material to the built-in analog or hdmi output? You can just create a new zone, i.e. Analog and change the audio settings to use the hw:CARD=PCH,DEV=0 device?

mdooney@gmail.com · « **Reply #1013 on:** January 25, 2019, 04:10:39 am »

Bob: Did that. The headphone/optical port lit up red and headphones played no prob.

mdooney@gmail.com · « **Reply #1014 on:** January 25, 2019, 04:24:33 am »

Bob: What I actually did was just switch the audio device setting - didn't bother to create new zone.

mdooney@gmail.com · « **Reply #1015 on:** January 25, 2019, 06:44:18 am »

Bob: And I've now followed your original instructions and added a zone called Analog. I've got Player zone streaming Radio Paradise - DAC indicates 16 bits and 44.1 being received. Have got the Analog zone playing ournas files to headphones. All playing steadily for past 30 minutes.

mdooney@gmail.com · « **Reply #1016 on:** January 25, 2019, 08:05:26 am »

Bob: And just now both zones stopped playing. The DAC shows the USB connection has dropped. The Analog zone starts again on command. Not so the USB. (I notice there was a .dsf file in the playlist when the playback stopped but that's coincidental I think.) Disconnect and reconnect the USB, select a new M4A track and it plays fine alongside the continuing Analog stream.

bob · « **Reply #1017 on:** January 25, 2019, 08:26:04 am »

Quote from: drmimosa on January 24, 2019, 09:39:53 pm

Does the IdPi support external drives formatted to exFat file system? I'm having trouble getting a drive to show up in the menus.

Yes, if it's the version running MC23 or newer.
How large is the drive? Is it partitioned with MBR or GUID?
Do you have an external power supply on the drive? The IdPi has pretty limited power through the USB bus capability.

bob · « **Reply #1018 on:** January 25, 2019, 08:28:45 am »

Quote from: michaelmd on January 25, 2019, 08:05:26 am

Bob: And just now both zones stopped playing. The DAC shows the USB connection has dropped. The Analog zone starts again on command. Not so the USB. (I notice there was a .dsf file in the playlist when the playback stopped but that's coincidental I think.) Disconnect and reconnect the USB, select a new M4A track and it plays fine alongside the continuing Analog stream.

Were you playing both zones at the same time?
Will the .dsf file play (are DSP studio settings such that it will get converted to something your devices can handle)?

mdooney@gmail.com · « **Reply #1019 on:** January 25, 2019, 08:33:27 am »

yep, both zones were playing. the .dsf is an oddity - shouldn't have been there. I've left DSP output off while we've been experimenting the last 24 hours

bob · « **Reply #1020 on:** January 25, 2019, 08:38:07 am »

Quote from: michaelmd on January 25, 2019, 08:33:27 am

yep, both zones were playing. the .dsf is an oddity - shouldn't have been there. I've left DSP output off while we've been experimenting the last 24 hours

I'm thinking it would have stopped on that track and popped up a "can't play" box depending on whether you are booted into text mode or gui mode. In text mode the message box is skipped but it still might stop playback.

mdooney@gmail.com · « **Reply #1021 on:** January 25, 2019, 08:41:41 am »

possible. I've left it playing in the background to see what happens. It's early days but it seems more stable. Would activating the optical out have made that kind of difference?

bob · « **Reply #1022 on:** January 25, 2019, 08:52:05 am »

Quote from: michaelmd on January 25, 2019, 08:41:41 am

possible. I've left it playing in the background to see what happens. It's early days but it seems more stable. Would activating the optical out have made that kind of difference?

I'm not sure, but I don't think so.
What we are trying to do with this testing is to find out if the problem is due to a Id configuration or hardware issue vs the external device as an issue.

mdooney@gmail.com · « **Reply #1023 on:** January 25, 2019, 09:08:50 am »

for what it's worth I stream from two other devices to the DAC with no issues but they're not usb connections

drmimosa · « **Reply #1024 on:** January 25, 2019, 11:43:23 am »

Does ipdi work with exFat filesystem over external USB drive?

I'm having difficulty getting a couple drives to show up, and want to check in before I reformat and recopy to a different file system. I'm running the latest version.

[Edit: Yes! I must have made a mistake in the original disk formating. I reformatted the drive and now it works.]

[Edit: The first time I formatted the disk, I used the linux command mkfs.exfat -- this drive didn't show up. However, the second time I formatted the disk, I used a Windows 10 machine to format the disk. This time it worked and showed up as external storage on the IdPi. Strange, I probably just don't know how to use mkfs.exfat correctly yet]

bob · « **Reply #1025 on:** January 25, 2019, 02:59:04 pm »

Quote from: michaelmd on January 25, 2019, 09:08:50 am

for what it's worth I stream from two other devices to the DAC with no issues but they're not usb connections

It narrows down the possibilities some. It means there isn't an issue on the audio hardware side of the DAC.

cshearly · « **Reply #1026 on:** January 27, 2019, 10:44:26 am »

I'm having trouble getting a 200G exFAT formatted USB drive to be recognized by my IdPi. Any suggestions?

JimH · « **Reply #1027 on:** January 27, 2019, 10:46:11 am »

Is the drive externally powered? Did you find instructions here?

cshearly · « **Reply #1028 on:** January 27, 2019, 11:06:26 am »

It is a microSDXC 200G with a USB adapter formatted exFAT.

cshearly · « **Reply #1029 on:** January 27, 2019, 11:09:24 am »

I can get a 16G thumb drive to work perfectly. The 200G with adapter works fine in my Win10 machine.

cshearly · « **Reply #1030 on:** January 27, 2019, 11:32:07 am »

...the adapter works fine with FAT32 formatted microSD cards 1G and 32G...

JimH · « **Reply #1031 on:** January 27, 2019, 03:12:59 pm »

The drive needs to have external power. You could do a Google search on power limitations on the Pi.

bob · « **Reply #1032 on:** January 27, 2019, 07:10:45 pm »

Quote from: cshearly on January 27, 2019, 11:06:26 am

It is a microSDXC 200G with a USB adapter formatted exFAT.

Was it formatted in Win 10?
Is the partition table MBR or GUID?

cshearly · « **Reply #1033 on:** January 28, 2019, 09:05:46 am »

I formatted the card as NTFS and the IdPi found it and was able to start an import. However, after a few seconds MC just disappeared. I removed the card, used menu "77" to reset and rebooted. Now, no matter what I do every time I boot MC just closes down (disappears) after 10 to 30 seconds - even if I do nothing with the GUI.

Awesome Donkey · « **Reply #1034 on:** January 28, 2019, 09:10:25 am »

Bad files, perhaps?

cshearly · « **Reply #1035 on:** January 28, 2019, 09:18:30 am »

But even if I remove the media MC still disappears after a few seconds, even if i do nothing...

bob · « **Reply #1036 on:** January 28, 2019, 01:13:03 pm »

Quote from: cshearly on January 28, 2019, 09:18:30 am

But even if I remove the media MC still disappears after a few seconds, even if i do nothing...

Did you configure a NAS share on the Id as well?

Is your network connection wired?
You could try pulling the ethernet cable and see if it stops disappearing which would indicate a problematic device on the network.

What build of MC is it running?

emcee2 · « **Reply #1037 on:** January 28, 2019, 02:23:47 pm »

team -- about to place an order for a second Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+. Currently controlled via Win 10 computer with MC 24. Music and library are located on a separate NAS.

Do I understand correctly that, even though he B+ has no storage, I can use the B+ as both a server and DLNA renderer? in other words, using a Windows remote desktop to the B+'s MC 24, I can connect the B+ directly with the NAS content/library? My plan would be to access/ control via Remote Desktop and/or JRemote ...

I'm simply trying to unburden my PC from JR media traffic (and, then-therefore, by-pass the need for additional tools such as Audiophile Optimizer, Fidelizer). Alternatively, I may have to order a larger version of the ID with memory, etc.

Thanks very much for your thoughts/responses ...

emcee2

bob · « **Reply #1038 on:** January 28, 2019, 02:36:21 pm »

Quote from: emcee2 on January 28, 2019, 02:23:47 pm

team -- about to place an order for a second Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+. Currently controlled via Win 10 computer with MC 24. Music and library are located on a separate NAS.

Do I understand correctly that, even though he B+ has no storage, I can use the B+ as both a server and DLNA renderer? in other words, using a Windows remote desktop to the B+'s MC 24, I can connect the B+ directly with the NAS content/library? My plan would be to access/ control via Remote Desktop and/or JRemote ...

I'm simply trying to unburden my PC from JR media traffic (and, then-therefore, by-pass the need for additional tools such as Audiophile Optimizer, Fidelizer). Alternatively, I may have to order a larger version of the ID with memory, etc.

Thanks very much for your thoughts/responses ...

emcee2

Yes.
You use the diskmenu on the Id to add a file share from your NAS and import the files on there into your library on the Id (the files stay on the NAS, only a library of information is built from them).

mdooney@gmail.com · « **Reply #1039 on:** January 28, 2019, 02:59:21 pm »

Bob: couple of things to add to the list. Losing the usb stream from the Id (evidenced by the DAC's light going from steady to flashing) seems to occur when I'm playing from a stock smart list (recently imported, say) and choosing a track elsewhere in the library. I haven't played enough to be sure this always happens but, for sure, it's less likely to happen if I just leave everything alone once playback has started....

Sometimes, if I simply unplug the usb from the Id and plug it in to another Id usb slot (having stopped playback) the DAC registers a good connection again....

emcee2 · « **Reply #1040 on:** January 28, 2019, 03:03:43 pm »

thnx Bob for the quick turnaround

::m

cshearly · « **Reply #1041 on:** January 28, 2019, 03:28:53 pm »

Quote from: bob on January 28, 2019, 01:13:03 pm

Did you configure a NAS share on the Id as well?

Is your network connection wired?
You could try pulling the ethernet cable and see if it stops disappearing which would indicate a problematic device on the network.

What build of MC is it running?

No wired network currently.

No NAS share.

Current build. Just updated to see if it would help but it didn't.

bob · « **Reply #1042 on:** January 28, 2019, 04:11:05 pm »

Quote from: michaelmd on January 28, 2019, 02:59:21 pm

Bob: couple of things to add to the list. Losing the usb stream from the Id (evidenced by the DAC's light going from steady to flashing) seems to occur when I'm playing from a stock smart list (recently imported, say) and choosing a track elsewhere in the library. I haven't played enough to be sure this always happens but, for sure, it's less likely to happen if I just leave everything alone once playback has started....

Sometimes, if I simply unplug the usb from the Id and plug it in to another Id usb slot (having stopped playback) the DAC registers a good connection again....

This is starting to sound like a memory or other hardware issue with the Id.
If you download the repair/update stick, there is a memory test on it you could try.

bob · « **Reply #1043 on:** January 28, 2019, 04:13:51 pm »

Quote from: cshearly on January 28, 2019, 03:28:53 pm

No wired network currently.

No NAS share.

Current build. Just updated to see if it would help but it didn't.

Could you temporarily take it off of the network (connect a keyboard and monitor and run option 13 then disconnect the network) and see if it stops MC from going down and back up?

cshearly · « **Reply #1044 on:** January 28, 2019, 04:36:15 pm »

MC disappears after 15 seconds or so. I Turned off the Wifi using option 13 and got "The wicd daemon has shut down. The UI will not function properly until it is restarted." Took nearly a minute before MC disappeared this time. The boot seems to take a lot longer now than it used to...

cshearly · « **Reply #1045 on:** January 28, 2019, 04:46:39 pm »

I think we are on the right track. This latest reboot has allowed me to import all of the 5992 files on the USB micSD card. Six+ minutes so far with no disappearing MC. So that I might be able to do self support in the future, what do you think was wrong? Thanks!

mdooney@gmail.com · « **Reply #1046 on:** January 29, 2019, 04:34:02 am »

Bob: I've just checked your instructions on using Rufus. Is rufus-3.4.exe the correct download? I'm on a Mac using Windows 10 via VMWare.

bob · « **Reply #1047 on:** January 29, 2019, 10:46:09 am »

Quote from: michaelmd on January 29, 2019, 04:34:02 am

Bob: I've just checked your instructions on using Rufus. Is rufus-3.4.exe the correct download? I'm on a Mac using Windows 10 via VMWare.

Does the VMWare windows instance have access to the USB ports for raw memory stick writing?

Seems like this might be an easier way:

http://osxdaily.com/2018/01/11/write-img-to-sd-card-mac-etcher/

bob · « **Reply #1048 on:** January 29, 2019, 10:47:24 am »

Quote from: cshearly on January 28, 2019, 04:46:39 pm

I think we are on the right track. This latest reboot has allowed me to import all of the 5992 files on the USB micSD card. Six+ minutes so far with no disappearing MC. So that I might be able to do self support in the future, what do you think was wrong? Thanks!

Is sounds like there is a DLNA device on your network that's causing issues.
Can you list the DLNA devices on your network?

mdooney@gmail.com · « **Reply #1049 on:** January 29, 2019, 11:33:41 am »

Hi Bob. I've left a toslink connection playing Id to DAC for the last 4 hours, and fired up the usb connection an hour ago - all stable so far in spite of some chopping and changing of playlist selection.
DLNA list: Squeezeboxes - 2 x Boom, 1 Duet, 1 Radio
Sonos: Playbar, Woofer, 2 x D1, 3 x D5
Robinson Radio
Synology NAS x 2
Etcher app looks good - I just have to find an SD card.....

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Author Topic: JRiver Id Questions? (Read 414005 times)