Topic: Nero 7 prevents MC from running under Vista (possible fix). (Read 13281 times)

BartMan01 · « **on:** March 19, 2007, 05:31:02 pm »

Just purchased and installed Nero 7 for my Vista machine. After installing Nero, MC12 no longer runs - it starts up and then immediately freezes (even to an empty default library).

Edit (to save hunting through the post for the fix that works for me): Running MC12 in XP SP2 compatibility mode fixes this for me.

JimH · « **Reply #1 on:** March 19, 2007, 05:56:46 pm »

I believe they have a bad DirectShow filter.

http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=39523.0

BartMan01 · « **Reply #2 on:** March 19, 2007, 06:15:20 pm »

Quote from: JimH on March 19, 2007, 05:56:46 pm

Maybe you could change the subject

Sorry, if anything it should have been the other way around since Nero really is the issue here.

Good news, I found a quick fix that seems to leave Nero intact for burning but fixes the issue. Fix = just unregister the bad .ax file:
As Administrator (if you are running with UAC on, create a shortcut to CMD, right click it and choose run as Admin):
regsvr32 /u "C:\Program Files\Common Files\Ahead\DSFilter\NeVideoHD.ax"

To re-enable the filter (if you need it for some reason):
regsvr32 "C:\Program Files\Common Files\Ahead\DSFilter\NeVideoHD.ax"

Never mind, this change just allowed MC to run for several seconds before it froze instead of an immediate freeze.

JimH · « **Reply #3 on:** March 20, 2007, 07:00:27 am »

Please report this to Nero. I wrote them yesterday, but a customer report may get more attention.

jmone · « **Reply #4 on:** March 20, 2007, 01:24:46 pm »

What version of Nero is causing problems (so I know which one to avoid!)

BartMan01 · « **Reply #5 on:** March 20, 2007, 02:53:52 pm »

Quote from: jmone on March 20, 2007, 01:24:46 pm

What version of Nero is causing problems (so I know which one to avoid!)

7 (from the title), and that is the only version of Nero that is 100% compatible with Vista. It appears that even if you do a custom install and only select the actual burning software it still installs all of the Nero codecs and filters.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #6 on:** March 20, 2007, 03:22:05 pm »

Quote

MC12 is freezing right after startup with Nero 7 installed. This happens even with the default, empty library. What is it doing that causes this to happen? I can understand it crashing/freezing when it tried to access a media file that needs the problem filter/codec, but this is happening with no files in the library.

Quote

I can't tell you why it would happen, but the solution is to uninstall Nero.

Since it is only happening with MC12, it seems that MC12 is doing something that interacts with installed codecs/filters beyond any 'normal' media playback software. JRiver has no idea what their own software is doing while just sitting there with an empty library?

JimH · « **Reply #7 on:** March 20, 2007, 03:24:34 pm »

Quote from: BartMan01 on March 20, 2007, 03:22:05 pm

Since it is only happening with MC12, it seems that MC12 is doing something that interacts with installed codecs/filters beyond any 'normal' media playback software. JRiver has no idea what their own software is doing while just sitting there with an empty library?

It would take a little digging to know and I'm not sure when it may happen.

Did you report this to Nero?

glynor · « **Reply #8 on:** March 20, 2007, 03:27:53 pm »

Which version of Nero 7 are you using?

The current version is 7.8.5.0. If you are using anything prior to that, nero is going to tell you to drop dead. The part of the application that actually installs most of the playback filters is Nero Vision 4 and Nero Recode 2. I know that with older versions of Nero Vision there were all kinds of filter and codec problems.

There are about a million threads about it at doom9.org in the forums.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #9 on:** March 20, 2007, 03:56:51 pm »

Quote from: JimH on March 20, 2007, 03:24:34 pm

It would take a little digging to know and I'm not sure when it may happen.

Did you report this to Nero?

Thanks, and yes I did. Haven't heard back yet.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #10 on:** March 20, 2007, 03:59:32 pm »

Quote from: glynor on March 20, 2007, 03:27:53 pm

Which version of Nero 7 are you using?

The current version is 7.8.5.0.

Well, as of yesterday 7.7.5.1 was 'current'

Will pull 7.8.5.0 and try that one.

lalittle · « **Reply #11 on:** March 20, 2007, 04:30:18 pm »

Quote from: glynor on March 20, 2007, 03:27:53 pm

The part of the application that actually installs most of the playback filters is Nero Vision 4 and Nero Recode 2.

Are you saying that it's possible that installing JUST the main part of Nero (the part used for burning) might prevent this issue?

Thanks,

Larry

BartMan01 · « **Reply #12 on:** March 20, 2007, 04:52:21 pm »

Issue still happens with 7.8.5.0

Quote from: lalittle on March 20, 2007, 04:30:18 pm

Are you saying that it's possible that installing JUST the main part of Nero (the part used for burning) might prevent this issue?

Nero seems to want to install all of it's codecs/filters even if you just do a custom install of the burning software only.

lalittle · « **Reply #13 on:** March 20, 2007, 05:07:39 pm »

Quote from: BartMan01 on March 20, 2007, 04:52:21 pm

Issue still happens with 7.8.5.0

Nero seems to want to install all of it's codecs/filters even if you just do a custom install of the burning software only.

Sorry -- I forgot that you already mentioned this above.

Do I understand correctly that we still do not know which filter is causing the problem (since you unregistered NeVideoHD.ax and the problem persisted)?

Given this, do we really know that it's a filter causing this issue? I've been reading over other posts talking about a "bad Nero filter" causing these issues, but I'm unclear how people made a connection between a filter and these conflicts. It seems clear that it IS Nero, but could it be some other aspect of Nero that's causing this issue?

Thanks,

Larry

BartMan01 · « **Reply #14 on:** March 20, 2007, 06:55:57 pm »

No, we don't know WHY it is causing MC12 issues, just that it is (which is the reason for my question above on what MC12 is doing that could be causing/contributing to this).

The .ax files are suspect because they have caused issues with other programs, I also understand the NERO splitter is causing issues as well.

The only way I can think of to narrow this down is to install Nero and then start disabling the filters/splitters/codecs one by one until the problem goes away.

LonWar · « **Reply #15 on:** March 20, 2007, 07:14:09 pm »

I have 7.5 running with MC12 on 2 computers and have never had any problems.
I use Nero for watching video's and MC for the music

lalittle · « **Reply #16 on:** March 20, 2007, 07:43:14 pm »

Quote from: imjustagamer on March 20, 2007, 07:14:09 pm

I have 7.5 running with MC12 on 2 computers and have never had any problems.
I use Nero for watching video's and MC for the music

Well that throws a wrench into this theory. Does the order in which the programs are installed perhaps make a difference?

Can you think of anything you did that could explain why your system seems to be uneffected by this issue -- maybe some sort of configuration setting in Nero?

Thanks,

Larry

JONCAT · « **Reply #17 on:** March 20, 2007, 08:14:45 pm »

Well I have Nero 7 installed (will check the version) and I have been posting about some lockups with MC12 here. I installed just the main package and I do have the Nero Showtime crap installed as well; their DVD codec is also installed on my machine along with Purevideo.

Not sure the lockups are Nero codec related as I can use MC with FFDSHOW & Purevideo but get lockups when switching the view quite a bit. My issues could be some kind of database sharing problem; I'm not sure yet.
I seem to get stuck with the .dat file in my logs.

http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?topic=39519.0

DC

LonWar · « **Reply #18 on:** March 20, 2007, 09:15:18 pm »

Quote from: lalittle on March 20, 2007, 07:43:14 pm

Well that throws a wrench into this theory. Does the order in which the programs are installed perhaps make a difference?

Can you think of anything you did that could explain why your system seems to be uneffected by this issue -- maybe some sort of configuration setting in Nero?

Thanks,

Larry

Not really sure on the order... But I installed it with all the fixens...
Maybe the bad codecs got overwritten?

Of course maybe now that I said something, I will see problems...

glynor · « **Reply #19 on:** March 20, 2007, 09:28:33 pm »

This (and the other seemingly endless similar threads I've seen on Nero7) make me glad I've stuck with Nero 6. It does everything I need, and doesn't mess my system up...

BartMan01 · « **Reply #20 on:** March 20, 2007, 10:00:08 pm »

Quote from: imjustagamer on March 20, 2007, 07:14:09 pm

I have 7.5 running with MC12 on 2 computers and have never had any problems.
I use Nero for watching video's and MC for the music

Vista or XP?
WMP11 or 10?

lalittle · « **Reply #21 on:** March 20, 2007, 10:24:34 pm »

Quote from: glynor on March 20, 2007, 09:28:33 pm

This (and the other seemingly endless similar threads I've seen on Nero7) make me glad I've stuck with Nero 6. It does everything I need, and doesn't mess my system up...

That's EXACTLY what I was thinking -- Nero 6 seems pretty non-invasive and does everything I need it to, which is simply to burn discs.

That said, version 6's days are numbered now that Vista is out, so hopefully somebody will get to the bottom of this soon.

Larry

LonWar · « **Reply #22 on:** March 21, 2007, 10:27:14 am »

Quote from: BartMan01 on March 20, 2007, 10:00:08 pm

Vista or XP?
WMP11 or 10?

XP Home, and 1 XP Pro
WMP11 on 1, and I think 10 on the other.

JONCAT · « **Reply #23 on:** March 21, 2007, 10:39:07 am »

I'm using 7.0 and I can use MC but some hangs as I referred to in my thread. Can you clarify the behavior your seeing? You can't use MC AT ALL?

thanks
DC

glynor · « **Reply #24 on:** March 21, 2007, 10:44:19 am »

Quote from: lalittle on March 20, 2007, 10:24:34 pm

That said, version 6's days are numbered now that Vista is out, so hopefully somebody will get to the bottom of this soon.

Absolutely. And it certainly does need to be fixed, but I'm just glad I stuck to 6. I'm also sticking to XP for the forseeable future anyway (especially since nVidia is refusing to release Vista drivers for most of their chipsets), so Vista compatibility isn't a serious problem for me...

glynor · « **Reply #25 on:** March 21, 2007, 10:45:23 am »

Quote from: Doctor Cilantro on March 21, 2007, 10:39:07 am

I'm using 7.0 and I can use MC but some hangs as I referred to in my thread. Can you clarify the behavior your seeing? You can't use MC AT ALL?

Dr. C, saying you're using Nero 7.0 doesn't tell us anything. Nero releases new versions of their software almost as fast as JRiver does. What actual version number are you using?

BartMan01 · « **Reply #26 on:** March 21, 2007, 11:44:46 am »

I am running Vista (with an XP dual boot plus an XP VMWare virtual machine 'just in case').

Using the current 7.8.5.0 version of Vista, MC just hangs while starting - so no I can't use it at all while Nero is installed. AFAIK, 6.x has issues with Vista so using that is not an option. MC does run for long enough for me to turn on logging, so I am sending in a log file in case it helps. After several freezes, it appears that it is consistently hanging in the exact same spot (partial log):

Quote

0015016: 5372: SDK: CMJFilesAutomation::CMJFilesAutomation: Global Count: 1
0015016: 872: Handheld: CHHManager::RefreshFilesFromDevice: Finish (0 ms)
0015016: 5372: Handheld: CPortableDriveWMDM::GetFiles: Start
0015016: 872: Handheld: CHHManager::InitializePlugin: Finish (281 ms)
0015016: 5372: Handheld: CWMDMSupport::GetFiles: Start
0015016: 872: Handheld: CHHManager::Initialize: Finish (281 ms)
0015016: 872: Handheld: CHHManager::Initialize: Start
0015016: 872: Handheld: CHHManager::UpdatePluginDeviceInfo: Start
0015016: 872: Handheld: CHHManager::UpdatePluginDeviceInfo: Finish (0 ms)
0015016: 872: Handheld: CHHManager::InitializePlugin: Start
0015016: 872: Handheld: CHHManager::InitializePlugin: PluginName: 'Portable Drives'
0015016: 872: Handheld: CHHManager::InitializePlugin: Creating plugin
0015016: 872: Handheld: CHHPluginThread::CHHPluginThread: Start
0015032: 872: Handheld: CHHPluginThread::CHHPluginThread: Finish (16 ms)
0015032: 872: Handheld: CHHManager::InitializePlugin: Valid plugin created
0015032: 872: Handheld: CHHManager::EnableEvents: Start
0015032: 872: Handheld: CHHManager::EnableEvents: Finish (0 ms)
0015032: 872: SDK: CMJAutomation::CMJAutomation: Global Count: 6, Main 0, 132b4d0
0015032: 872: Handheld: CHHPluginThread::ProcessCommand: Start
0015032: 4960: Handheld: CHHPluginThread::Thread Message Processing: Start
0015032: 4960: Handheld: CHHPluginThread::Thread Message Processing: Type: 0, Function: 2
0015032: 4960: Handheld: CHHPluginThread::Thread Message Processing: Command = 1031
0015032: 4960: Handheld: CHHPluginThread::Thread Message Processing: Finish (0 ms)
0015094: 872: Handheld: CHHPluginThread::ProcessCommand: Finish (62 ms)
0015094: 872: Handheld: CHHManager::InitializePlugin: Initializing plugin...
0015094: 872: Handheld: CHHPluginThread::Initialize: Start
0015094: 4960: Handheld: CHHPluginThread::Thread Message Processing: Start
0015094: 4960: Handheld: CHHPluginThread::Thread Message Processing: Type: 0, Function: 0
0015094: 4960: Handheld: CPortableDriveWMDM::Initialize: Start
0015094: 4960: Handheld: CPortableDriveWMDM::Initialize: Initializing device: $$?$usbstor#disk&ven_smsc&prod_223_u_hs-cf&rev_3.60#000223223223&0#{53f56307-b6bf-11d0-94f2-00a0c91efb8b}
0015094: 4960: Handheld: CWMDMSupport::Init: Start
0015094: 4960: Handheld: CWMDMInterface::CWMDMInterface: Start
0015094: 4960: Handheld: CWMDMInterface::CWMDMInterface: Creating secure channel client
0015094: 4960: Handheld: CWMDMInterface::CWMDMInterface: Updating certificate
0015094: 4960: Handheld: CWMDMInterface::CWMDMInterface: Updating channel
0015094: 4960: Handheld: CWMDMInterface::CWMDMInterface: Authenticating
0015110: 4960: Handheld: CWMDMInterface::CWMDMInterface: Getting device manager
0015110: 4960: Handheld: CWMDMInterface::CWMDMInterface: WMDM valid: 1
0015110: 4960: Handheld: CWMDMInterface::CWMDMInterface: Finish (16 ms)
0015110: 4960: Handheld: CWMDMSupport::Init: Finish (16 ms)
0015110: 4960: Handheld: CPortableDriveWMDM::Initialize: Initialize return value: 0 (hr)
0015110: 4960: Handheld: CPortableDriveWMDM::Initialize: Setting device
0015110: 4960: Handheld: CWMDMSupport::SetDevice: Start
0015110: 4960: Handheld: CWMDMSupport::SetDevice: Setting to device: $$?$usbstor#disk&ven_smsc&prod_223_u_hs-cf&rev_3.60#000223223223&0#{53f56307-b6bf-11d0-94f2-00a0c91efb8b}
0015110: 4960: Handheld: CWMDMSupport::SetDevice: Enumerating devices...

StarBand Guy · « **Reply #27 on:** March 21, 2007, 12:31:59 pm »

If you don't mind installing the new nero 7.8.5 or whatever is is (released day before yesterday), with MC still installed, I'd try running the "Nero Cleaning" tool [I'm looking for the link], and install Nero again. The cleaner should take out of most of the old registry and Nero codecs stuff. It could be stuff left over from previous Nero versions causing the problems.

I have a relatively new machine with the latest MC 12 and Nero 7.8 whatever as of last night (to use Nero's editing/exporting ability with avchd) and MC seems to be just fine.

StarBand Guy · « **Reply #28 on:** March 21, 2007, 12:34:36 pm »

Here's that Nero link:
http://www.nero.com/nero7/eng/Clean_Tools.html

cheers;)

BartMan01 · « **Reply #29 on:** March 21, 2007, 12:44:28 pm »

I ran the clean tool before installing the current version yesterday. No difference.

If you have MC12 and Nero 7.x running together - is it under Vista or under another OS?

Matt · « **Reply #30 on:** March 21, 2007, 12:51:14 pm »

Nero installs a driver that makes your CD burner appear like a WMDM device.

However, it makes the entire WMDM sub-system hang when doing a simple "enumerate devices."

Under XP, MC actually disables this feature of Nero during run. This is the only time we've ever needed to do something like this to a 3rd party program. This disabling doesn't work under Vista.

Ideally Nero should fix this issue. We'd be happy to provide details to them.

Barring that, try disabling the option to make your CD drives show like handheld devices.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #31 on:** March 21, 2007, 01:14:19 pm »

Where do I disable the option to make the CD drive show up like a handheld? I looked around in the options, but didn't see that.

After seeing that it appears to work under XP, I tried two things that both appeared to work under Vista:
I ran MC12 with Admin rights.
I set the main MC12 application to compatibility mode with XP SP2

I know Vista's UAC will 'quietly' fail many system requests that do not conform with the new UAC rules (in an attempt to slow down/thwart malware authors), perhaps this is what is happening with the attempt to disable the Nero feature.

Matt - I have a support case open with Nero on this issue. If you would like me to forward on any specific data or contact info just let me know.

JimH · « **Reply #32 on:** March 21, 2007, 01:15:28 pm »

Quote from: BartMan01 on March 21, 2007, 01:14:19 pm

Where do I disable the option to make the CD drive show up like a handheld? I looked around in the options, but didn't see that.

In Nero.

Berto · « **Reply #33 on:** March 21, 2007, 01:29:41 pm »

Quote from: imjustagamer on March 20, 2007, 07:14:09 pm

I have 7.5 running with MC12 on 2 computers and have never had any problems.
I use Nero for watching video's and MC for the music

I also never had any problems with Nero (now version 7.7.5.1) and MC.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #34 on:** March 21, 2007, 01:29:56 pm »

Quote from: JimH on March 21, 2007, 01:15:28 pm

In Nero.

Sorry, don't see anything obvious in Nero either. If someone can post instructions on how to do this I will test that too, but for now running in XPSP2 compatibility mode seems to do the trick.

Berto · « **Reply #35 on:** March 21, 2007, 01:31:32 pm »

Quote from: BartMan01 on March 20, 2007, 10:00:08 pm

Vista or XP?
WMP11 or 10?

XP and Vista
WMP 10 and 11
Never had any problems.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #36 on:** March 21, 2007, 01:32:38 pm »

Quote from: Berto on March 21, 2007, 01:31:32 pm

XP and Vista
WMP 10 and 11
Never had any problems.

Are you running Vista with UAC turned off?

Berto · « **Reply #37 on:** March 21, 2007, 03:17:03 pm »

Quote from: BartMan01 on March 21, 2007, 01:32:38 pm

Are you running Vista with UAC turned off?

Yes

JimH · « **Reply #38 on:** March 21, 2007, 03:49:22 pm »

If anyone is running Vista PLEASE say so.

Berto · « **Reply #39 on:** March 21, 2007, 04:05:41 pm »

Quote from: JimH on March 21, 2007, 03:49:22 pm

If anyone is running Vista PLEASE say so.

I am running Vista with UAC disabled.

BartMan01 · « **Reply #40 on:** March 21, 2007, 07:48:09 pm »

Quote from: JimH on March 21, 2007, 03:49:22 pm

If anyone is running Vista PLEASE say so.

It would also help to specify if you have disabled UAC, since that may be what is stopping MC from disabling that Nero 'feature'.

rmbean · « **Reply #41 on:** March 26, 2007, 03:42:56 pm »

Any update on this in the last few days? I just recently reloaded my system with Vista and got MC12 running right away (a necessicity

) I have been holding off on installing Nero until there is a known fix. Can anyone confirm that I can get the two to play nice together? I'm not even sure if it is relevant, but I currently have UAC turned off, but would hope to reenable once I have all of my programs installed (unless someone can talk me out of it - I'm all ears). Thanks in advance.

Matt · « **Reply #42 on:** March 26, 2007, 06:08:02 pm »

In case anyone from Nero looks at this, here's the explanation:

Media Center enumerates WMDM devices in one thread.

It then creates a different thread for each handheld plugin. If those handheld plugins are WMDM devices, the plugin also creates an instance of WMDM.

The Nero plugin (neroburnplugin.dll) dead-locks when WMDM gets accessed from the second thread in the same process. No other real device we've ever dealt with exhibits this problem.

We only have two possible work-arounds:

1) Disable neroburnplugin.dll while we run. We do this on XP, but Vista UAC makes this impossible.
2) Not support WMDM devices when neroburnplugin.dll is installed. We could message this case, but it will still lead to cases where people don't have devices when they expect to.

Thanks everyone.

Matt · « **Reply #43 on:** March 26, 2007, 06:55:38 pm »

I should add that you can manually unregister neroburnplugin.dll to fix this issue.

Run regsvr32.exe /u neroburnplugin.dll

You may have to configure regsvr32.exe to run as administrator since you're on Vista. RegSvr32 is here: C:\Windows\System32

This only disables the handheld device emulator piece of Nero that shows up in WMP and any other media player that supports WMDM handhelds.

lalittle · « **Reply #44 on:** March 26, 2007, 07:15:15 pm »

Quote from: Matt on March 26, 2007, 06:55:38 pm

I should add that you can manually unregister neroburnplugin.dll to fix this issue.

Run regsvr32.exe /u neroburnplugin.dll

You may have to configure regsvr32.exe to run as administrator since you're on Vista. RegSvr32 is here: C:\Windows\System32

This only disables the handheld device emulator piece of Nero that shows up in WMP and any other media player that supports WMDM handhelds.

Just to make sure I understand this, are you saying that this will NOT effect using Nero for CD/DVD burning? This might be an acceptable workaround for many people since I believe it's Nero's burning capabilities that attract most people.

Also, I'm a bit unclear when you say "and any other media player that supports WMDM handhelds." Given that MC supports WMDM handhelds, and the fact that you said "any other media player," does this effect MC as well?

Thanks,

Larry

Matt · « **Reply #45 on:** March 26, 2007, 07:19:54 pm »

Quote from: lalittle on March 26, 2007, 07:15:15 pm

Just to make sure I understand this, are you saying that this will NOT effect using Nero for CD/DVD burning? This might be an acceptable workaround for many people since I believe it's Nero's burning capabilities that attract most people.

Correct. One of the features of Nero is to appear as a handheld in WMP and MC. This is the only feature that causes a problem.

Disabling this feature should not change the Nero stand-alone programs.

Quote

Also, I'm a bit unclear when you say "and any other media player that supports WMDM handhelds." Given that MC supports WMDM handhelds, and the fact that you said "any other media player," does this effect MC as well?

It will make your CD burner not appear as a handheld in any software. Since MC has more powerful burning built in, we don't think anyone would miss this from inside of MC.

Matt · « **Reply #46 on:** March 27, 2007, 09:59:16 am »

The next build of Media Center will disable the Nero plugin under Vista with UAC enabled.

This will eliminate the issue. Media Center will restore the Nero plugin as soon as it closes.

Thanks everyone.

lalittle · « **Reply #47 on:** March 27, 2007, 06:57:07 pm »

Quote from: Matt on March 27, 2007, 09:59:16 am

The next build of Media Center will disable the Nero plugin under Vista with UAC enabled.

This will eliminate the issue. Media Center will restore the Nero plugin as soon as it closes.

Thanks everyone.

That's great news Matt. Thanks for cracking this issue.

Larry

vine-au · « **Reply #48 on:** May 02, 2007, 01:29:01 pm »

thanks for the info - uninstalled the "Special Features" part of nero and all the issues cleared up.

lalittle · « **Reply #49 on:** May 02, 2007, 02:40:42 pm »

Quote from: vine-au on May 02, 2007, 01:29:01 pm

thanks for the info - uninstalled the "Special Features" part of nero and all the issues cleared up.

Just for clarification, what is the "Special Features" part of Nero? For people installing Nero for the first time, what should they do or not do?

Thanks,

Larry

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Author Topic: Nero 7 prevents MC from running under Vista (possible fix). (Read 13281 times)

JONCAT

JONCAT